The poor people in the 'plane, would they have suffered?

[hellymelly]

The news is so shocking, have avoided the tv news for days but read the papers today. Combined with the terrible images of injured children in Gaza it is all so upsetting. I can't help but think about the passengers in the downed airoplane, would they have been alive when they hit the ground? Or would they have passed out from lack of oxygen before then? I just hope that they knew nothing and were killed instantly but I realise that is probably unlikely. .

[ExitPursuedByAKoalaBear]

I too am surprised you were deleted

[PhantomTollbooth]

IT WAS NOT A PERSONAL ATTACK.

And now it has been deleted, nobody will be able to see that it was not either.

I have had plenty of people who agree with me. Shame on you for censoring something that was not a personal attack.

Using personal tragedy to continually shut down any conversation that you do not like is unfair and also abusive to all of us who have also endured great tragedy in our lives and don't feel the need to stop others from talking about on a public forum.

Stay off threads like these if you don't like it. What the fuck do people think it is going to say? We are not talking about frocks on a thread about a plane crash.

FFS

[gertiegusset]

Friends and relatives from the very beginning Beer yes.
But my point is that now we have so much access to all the tragedies in the world via media and internet.
And we all travel extensively so it makes it all so much closer to us somehow.
I imagine the Titanic disaster made all the papers in Europe and America.
You put the telly on and it's there, you click on here and it's there, it's hard not to think about it and hope the suffering was minimal whether they were known to us or strangers.

[FidelineAndBombazine]

Phantom I too am surprised that your very measured post was deleted.

[FidelineAndBombazine]

I have reported the deletion, as it were. I really think MNHQ should have a second look at it.

[Everard]

People want to know if suffering took place because most of us are feeling there but for the grace of God go I. It is human nature to think about death - we are supposed to be the only species with the foreknowledge that death will come to us all. Some of us fear it. Within that knowledge, it is natural to speculate out loud, or, more often given how taboo the subject is, in our heads, how peaceful or traumatic different deaths might be. I am frightened of flying and cannot get onto a plane without a certain amount of 'what if' thinking. When a tragic event like this occurs, of course some people will think that could have been me/what if that had been me/a loved one? And we want to be reassured that if that is our ghastly end, at least we won't suffer during it.

Anyone who says people shouldn't speculate about the victims final moments is either totally unafraid of death and suffering, or failing to understand the fundamental need within us to somehow look upon our future deaths and yet still carry on living.

[DiaDuit]

Me too fideline

[PhantomTollbooth]

Thank you Fideline

I have never been so angry in a long time and am a hairs breadth away from de-registering from a site I think should be treasured as a place where we can all go and speak freely.

(Unless it is racist etc or IS a personal attack and this was not- it was a comment on behaviour NOT a person).

[PhantomTollbooth]

And you too Dia.

[gertiegusset]

I don't either Beer but I do think it's normal for other humans to wonder.

[Squtternutbaush]

Phantom Expat was offering an opinion just as you are, that's what we do on here is it not?

Expat was not "shutting down" anyone she was disagreeing with the tone of the thread and some of the speculation as many others have done.

I came onto the thread originally as I thought it was a reasonable question but seeing the tone and some of the responses I quickly changed my mind.

Yes it is a thread about a plane crash and mentions of the deceased were bound to appear but some posters would appear to want a full bloody autopsy report to satisfy their need for detail and put their minds at rest.

There is no reason why the random passer by needs to be able to do this, its not healthy to dwell on the detail and its certainly not respecting the privacy and grief that the relatives and friends are entitled to.

[gertiegusset]

People share far to much of their personal lives on here.
The details of this disaster are coming from the media which is in our faces.
So people will speculate.

[PhantomTollbooth]

Most people including the OP were not trawling. The OP wanted a safe space to talk about her feelings. Nothing wrong with that.

[Squtternutbaush]

At least 2 other posters have commented to say that they know a family involved and asked for the voyeuristic speculation to stop, are they making people feel uncomfortable too?

I can't imagine how the poor strangers sitting behind a keyboard will cope with the horror of being made to feel uncomfortable

[Bigglesfliesundone]

The first thing my mother said to me when discussing the horrific story was 'do you think those poor people suffered?' I think it's a fairly immediate reaction. We nearly all use planes nowadays and the thought of what would happen if it crashed or fell out of the sky, for want of a better phrase, has certainly gone through my head. I don't think it's actually that odd to hope they didn't.

[PhantomTollbooth]

Beer

it is certainly an ancient phenomena and as for calling it ghoulish and piggybacking it most certainly is not.

You have a very poor grasp of human psychology if you cannot understand that these are very normal, human questions and thoughts. Check out the 'ask any question about my job' threads in classics and the questions about death, cremation, serious illness etc. People want to know because why shouldn't they know? They are curious or they are anxious or they want to reach out. What is cynical and abnormal is the ascribing of maleficence to a thread like this. Apart from a few comments, people have been perfectly reasonable on here. Which is par for the MN course.

If a subject upsets me I keep off the threads that deal with it. Clicking on a thread about frocks that segues into a commentary about the deaths of people would be cause for complaint, but not a thread with a clear as crystal title as this one. Makes me wonder if people go trawling through these threads deliberately to torture themselves and then blame others for it.

[Everard]

In that case, Everard, why aren't there more people hanging around the doors of A&E, asking relatives what their loved ones looked like or said after fatal accidents?

I hate to say it, in the light of the way this thread has gone recently, but I personally have learnt a lot about various ways of dying from threads on MN over the years. I am not talking about any one circumstance, but it is possible to read very intimate information which has certainly added to my knowledge of death.

To hang around the doors of A&E would obviously be inappropriate, but to want to know details which might one day be relevant to yourself is not at all surprising.

[PhantomTollbooth]

Beer

You try getting therapy on this NHS these days for something like this., Good luck with that when there are people with chronic Schizophrenia falling through the net.

For some people MN is the only place they can go to talk about things and meet other people. Not everybody has a real life safe space and maybe they are happy to settle for the illusion of safe space here?

[gertiegusset]

Yes, it isn't a safe place apart from it's being anonymous.
And of course it shouldn't be looked at as entertainment.

But how long until a god awful Blockbuster movie comes out of it.

I hate those films but there are millions of people who watch them.
That one about the Tsunami, how crass was that.
But it encourages us to see it as entertainment.
Real living memory human tragedy.