Three children found dead

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m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-27122410

Very, very sad

Shakin

So so sad that poor woman and her poor family. I hope that her dh is able to forgive her

The decision to end their life is something one can understand..after all, diagnosed pre birth it would have been an option on the table up to the day before the baby is born. As a society we would today accept a decision to terminate the foetus prenatally with this diagnosis....so why not after birth let parents make that decision ?

However, if this was the decision it should be made with the father too. And it is illegal.... We don't know if he was aware.... And what abput the impact on the other child? any preparation ? one imagines not...(unless it was a pact? )

My ex spoke many times our son was "better off dead" (sld/asd) but I had no idea he might actually follow Thru in actions until the day he picked him up and threw him across the room screaming why are you disabled I don't want a disabled child... fortunately I was there... I attacked my ex to stop him... Son was ok. it was damned scary.... He my ex has episodic severe mh issues.

(Ex has since had therapy and now few years in expesses diff views re son...I semi trust him..)

Shortly after that incident when ex was away getting help, I found out that someone I had met online with a son with much more severe issues had had her son killed on an access visit to her ex. She knew her ex had had depression etc but had no idea or inkling he had thoughts to kill... She thought her ex loved him...

Nor did I . I was lucky. I caught my ex In The act of harming.... Perhaps he meant to do it this way i dont know... This lady did not. Her ex gassed himself and child.. She was devastated. Her child also had a condition which was life limiting but she did not share the views of her ex about his life. She did not want her ex deciding when and how he should die... Without any forewarning.

I think it is unfair on the other parent to make that decision alone.

But we don't know here what the situation was, we dont know if this was discussed we dont know how much psychiatric or emotional support they had how many discussion the mother and father had.... Practical help she had access to.

I have also met a baby with Sma I who died at eight months and I have an inkling how hard it must be...insofar as I can... To have three children growing up to die... V hard.

But if this was a decision made alone then it was unfair on other family members...

Tragic for sure.

I feel terribly sad for the mum, actually - my child was discharged, no respite provision at all, and I was told I had to quit my job in a city law firm (in early 20s) to care for her - there is no support. the entire country runs on 'informal carers' and it hits HARD the parents who have to care for their child 24/7 at home - let alone children. I completely see this tragedy had an answer - better respite care, better care provision

I'm shocked at what I'm reading.. You can terminate up until the day the babies born so why not after?

That's a life, if its a baby,a child or an adult is irrelevant.

Tragic situation and yes the mother is bloody awful, she took away what wasn't hers to take. Her own flesh and blood. She may have needed more support but to let it spiral this far out of control? She should have took hold of the situation and reached out for help. Not taken 3 innocent life's away. As a mother you are there to protect these innocent
, helpless little ones.. You cannot justify what she's done, and if the father knew, he's just as bad. If he didn't I cannot even begin to imagine his pain/hurt/anger

Exactly, cafe. Those who have been left at home to care for a sick child through endless sleepless nights and days of screaming pain and hospital visits with no respite have a lot of sympathy for this woman. There but for the grace of God...

I had one sick child, and nowhere near as sick as her three. She had three. And a frequently absent husband. It is all too easy to see how she was brought to the brink. Of course what she did was wrong. 100% wrong. She should never have done it. It should never have happened.

But Locket to say she should have taken hold of the situation shows zero understanding of the utter erosion of normality that happens when you are abandoned by society, even by your husband, to care for your dying children. Have compassion.

Sorry..I said noone on thread had advocated euthanasia for life limited children but someone just did.

Cestlavielife that concept is very wrong.

I think it's appalling to blame the husband for abandoning his family. We have no idea that this was the case. Who knows what the dynamic was or how long/ often he was away for.

The oldest daughter presumably needed respite too.

This thread is full of speculation and painting a picture based on so few facts. I find it bizarre that so much can be read into so little.

Agreed.

Morris, you're right about the husband. He didn't abandon his family. I expressed that really badly. I meant (but didn't say) that under such intense circumstances, having a husband who is off doing stuff, however legitimate, feels like an abandonment. We know on MN how often new mums with healthy DC feel aggrieved that their DHs are still swanning off to the gym or a drink after work while they are plugged into the sofa, breastfeeding 24/7. This is an extreme, long term version of that awful feeling of cabin fever, made even worse by how ill the children were and how many of them she had.

I really shouldn't accuse the father of being neglectful of his family. But part of what brought her to the edge must have been her isolation. He was away. He did leave her on her own to care for three gravely ill children. I wonder why? I wonder if she ever got to go on holiday on her own to a sunny place with her healthy daughter, to have a break and live, for a short time, a more normal life, one with glimmers of hope in it. Maybe she did.

I feel so sorry for all those involved, inc the mum. Who is now being charged with murder. I guess she has to be but just don't see the benefit to anyone of her getting a life sentence.

The poor older girl who has lost her siblings and effectively lost her mum.

They were wealthy. Perhaps he begged his wife to go on holiday or to accept respite care, and she preferred not to.

We don't know.

She may well have.

I go off for the night quite often for respite.

Dh has been out last two nights.

If you just heard that bit it woud be easy to say he is a man who leaves me to it and swans off out all the time. He isn't. He gets up every night with dD as much as I do.

Dh has taken ds1 away on holiday in the past"
It was an opportunity for DS1 to have some time not entirely dictated by his brothers needs.
He took him skiing for example, something I had no inclination to do.

It was nothing to do with his whizzing off and everything to do with the multiple needs of our children. I would have a break on my own in a hotel or somewhere. Nowadays I often take DD off while DH entertains DS2

Christ, only on mumsnet could a tragic thread about 3 dead children turn into a Bunfight featuring remarks about someone's education choices......

Also, the irony of saying that we cannot judge the mother as we don't know what she was going through while simultaneously slating the father for being away at the time......when we know nothing about his circumstances either.

I am struggling to see how anyone could have anything but compassion for this whole family, the whole thing is just a hideous tragedy.

shakin I don't normally go in for the whole 'crying my eyes out whilst reading this', but I have read your posts whilst cuddling my 7 week old and I did tear up - I am so so sorry for your loss.

I very much suspect that the only crime here is that the Mother did not get adequate support.

I do think that parents facing such a hard prospect should be in the position of turning away surplus offers of support/respite rather than having to pay privately for it or beg/be on the point of destruction of life before getting a few measly hours here and there.

Nothing should be too much for parents bearing such a heavy burden in life.

Yes I very much agree SATS.

I don't advocate euthanasia for babies.
i think it's wrong.

however, there is a disconnect between society almost encouraging the termination of a disabled foetus (my consultant when anomalies were discovered on son's ultrasound was desperate to get me back asap to discuss termination option) - then not discussing it after birth... what I mean is - pre birth the message (almost) is - you really don't want a disabled child..but then if you do have there isn't enough emotional support to deal with it.

however, accessing emotional support is tricky - you cant force it on anyone. unless the person says to a psychiatrist hey I am considering killing my disabled child then no one can talk them out of it.

I wasn't aware my ex wanted to/would actually harm my child til he did - dealing with the inner thoughts of someone is tricky.

Cestlavie..sorry I misunderstood your post

I have three disabled children (plus one other), thankfully with a far less severe and non life limiting disorder (autism). Even then it has changed my life beyond recognition- lost career, lost friends, endless paperwork and exhaustion. Fear about the future. A constant sense of failure as it is impossible to meet all the boy'[s needs effectively. Times that by many hundreds and add in fear about pain and death and I still don;t think you touch on what she must have endured.

I know that when my husband worked ridiculous hours in an attempt to balance my lack of income it felt like abandonment when it was quite the opposite, it was support and dedication. I know that it almost split us many times, and I know I could not have coped alone with the boys at that stage. he works from home now and for himself but that just comes with multiple financial worries, overall it's a much better life now though.

I can't condone what happened but i cannot condemn the mother either. I can and do condemn a support system that seems to accept it will fail each and every person who uses it to some degree. That is wrong and can only lead to more tragedy.

RIP little ones x

''As a society we would today accept a decision to terminate the foetus prenatally with this diagnosis....so why not after birth let parents make that decision ? '

Shock, and fear are the very real accompaniments to any diagnosis. I suspect many a bad (as in, wrong for the mother and father) would be made.

Sorry multiple posts

Shakin that post about the baby opposite does not make you sound awful. It sounds perfectly understandable and human.

Hugs and thank you so much for posting X