woman suffocated her new born baby walks free

[starshaker]

\link{http://scotlandtoday.scottishtv.co.uk/content/default.asp?page=s1_1_1&newsid=11184&newsType=\here} this is so sad

Used to be very common before abortion became so readily available. Baby wouldn't have suffered. V. v. v. sad story though. She will find that very tough to come to terms with - probably never will.

I hope she is not on here being totally and utterly judged.

well my instinct is to say "poor woman" because I just feel her life is over
how could you ever forgive yourself
or sleep at night
or get any happiness or peace
you would have to have a heart of stone not to be moved at the thought of her being desperate enough to go though labour with no help and then be so beyond help at a time when she should have been happy

How does Pink Tulips sound smug? She is simply saying that it was wrong for the girl to MURDER her baby and serve no sentence. :(

actually it wasn't murder
she pleaded guilty to culpable homicide

But she wasn't in her right mind - even before she got pregnant by the sound of things. We are a civilised society - we don't punish people for actions they aren't responsible for.

FF"
I grew up in Holy Catholic Ireland and I would never have been this terrified. My parents would have been sad, sad for me, sad for the baby, sad that nothing would have come to close to reaching the then status quo.

But I would never ever even have considered her course of action. The very basis of human nature is to nurture, she must have been in a very bad place.

Yea, I'm actually irish too. My sister had a baby at 15. I know all about it thanks.

Well ff2 if your sister had a baby at 15, and was confident to tell your parents, just think about a 21 year old in this day and age and what she went through.

May the Lord have mercy on the soul of the poor little baby, but Lord God she needs help as well.

How . I agree community servic seems an odd thing, I'd have thought compulsory help in a counselling/pschologist way would be more helpful.

Oh Yes, I don't dispute the fact that she needs help, oh no, she definitly needs help. But that poor poor child. I mean, what possible reason had she to kill a live child? She could have handed it up for adoption. Also, if her parents would have been that bad on her, why now are they standing by her side in court? They would rather have her as a murderer (which she is no matter what way you word it) than a single parent? What a mad mad world.

well she is on probation which should mean she gets help

She was probably 100% wrong about how her parents would react, but she wasn't rational - I'm sure they would far rather have had a live grandchild even if it did go for adoption.

The whole thing is just terribly sad for all concerned

Did she lie to her boyfriend that she HAD a termination or did she tell him she didnit. IE: Did he know she was still pregnant?

The report doesn't say. They'd agreed she would - maybe she didn't dare tell him they'd said no.

Are you saying how do we know he was her boyfriends baby?

It says in the 2 articles, 1 that she told her boyfriend she had an abortion and not to tell her parents and in another article it says that the babys paternal grandparents walked out of court in disgust.

Unless there is a bit more to this story than meets the eye. :(

if this woman was a teenager i would find it a bit easier to understand, but she was 21.surely old enough to be responsible for her actions.as has been said before-if you don't want to go to cardiff, don't get on the train.

FF2

Think small communities, they have two options, kick her out, or help her.

I grew up in Dublin, not the in the sticks of Dublin , but 3 miles outside Dublin. 25 years ago one of the "D" girls got pregnant. it was such a tight run ship in the "D" household that their father was never off his knees bothering God. He was from the provinces but appeared to be a relatively laid back man re teen PG etc.,

She became PG, he kicked her out on to the streets, literally on to the street. The local mood towards him hardened, she got lots and lots of support. His marriage eventually broke down, she is still happily married.

But if she had allowed herself to be cowed by him, who knows what would have happened in the "D" household.

I know that my sisters pregnancy at 15 almost ruined our family. My mum was adamant that she and my sister were moving out to raise this baby. My dad wanted her to terminate. He ignored her all the way throughout her pregnancy. Living in that house was awful. But she stood by her guns (Like the D girl) and she now has her 9yr old dd.

I just feel cold at the thought of her feeling like she had to kill her baby. Some say it wasn't intentionally, she was out of her mind.. but in going to ask for an abortion she was going to intentionally kill her baby. And the fact that she was refused must have made her angry.

I don't want to get into an argument with anyone, but I'm sure you understand that someone as anti-abortion as me I can't get my head round the fact she give birth to a live child and then killed it, wether in her right mind or not.

Sorry.

FF2

I am not going to argue with you any further, I can see your despair, I can see hers.

I will leave it at that.

Take care.

God Bless

LGJ

you too, night night xx