"Mothers, stop moaning!" Guardian article directed partly at MNers

[MrsJamin]

here

What do we think? Is she justified?

Personally, I can see her perspective, and utterly empathise, but I still think that we have the right to discuss our parenthood problems on MN, even if she doesn't believe that mothers ever have the right to have problems or discuss them. She is expecting wrath from us, so let's surprise her shall we?

If she doesn't like the "moaning" then she needs to stop reading.

Last I knew, the right to moan about anything wasn't means tested. Her woes don't trump those of someone sleep deprived with a toddler who keeps bouncing out of bed or those of someone worried sick about a 4 year old who lives on fresh air and breadcrumbs or those despairing that their child is having a miserable time at school.

Yes, I am fortunate to have children and I am fortunate that they are mostly physically healthy, despite their other challenges. It's my job as a mother to worry about them, though and my entitlement to have a jolly good moan when I'm running on empty and anyone who wants to fill column inches with how their life is more angsty than mine can go take a running jump

I sympathise with her, but it is a very self-indulgent/self-centred piece.

I see lots of people here and on facebook and in the media complaining about irritating (or worse) things their husbands/partners do. My DH died at the age of 41, but I do not feel that gives me the right to go round telling everyone they should just be grateful they have a husband, no matter how irritating or abusive they are, because the alternative is worse.

I'm sorry for her but in reality SE made her bed and has to lie in it. She shouldn't judge mothers who do moan, which I find cathartic sometimes and can help me to move on with my day.

I know how very blessed I am, but some days are very trying. I will not keep my feelings bottled up because it may offended someone I've never even met!

We all have different lives and issues.

It is sad for her but she doesn't get to play top trumps with emotions.

I agree with some of it. There are some very entitled mothers and mothers to be who like think the world revolves around them. But as pag says it's about context.

I do sympathise with her lot, it stinks - but at the risk of being the cold blooded scientist, to me her argument is illogical.

Motherhood is an amazing journey, but it is also a demanding and gruelling one. I am sorry that the journalist will probably not get to experience it first hand - but that does not really change the facts of the experience.

Well obviously we're all sorry that she wanted kids but hasn't got them. Not sure why she thinks that it would "incur the wrath of MN Towers" for her to say that. I'm much more judgy about her 'poor me' articles about shagging a married man, frankly. Nice.

Anyways, why does it have to be sympathy top trumps? Bits of being single are great! Bits of being single are rubbish! Bits of motherhood are great! Bits of motherhood are rubbish! Sisters! Can't we all just get along?

allagory, exactly. Well said.

She's probably reading this and writing her follow up piece.

oh fuck off! sharing your challenges doesn't in any way take from mother's gratitude for HAVING their children.

And everyone has their crosses to bear love! Mothers have other heartbreaking problems too, infertility does not trump cancer, bereavement, trauma.... its all individual, noone "wins", you don't win because you can't have children, you see a woman with children discussing the daily challenges she faces with ordinary life, you don't know what she's been through, you don't see the child she's lost, you don't see the older child she's watching kill themselves with IV drugs.

Its healthy to admit your hurdles.

And I had a preference for a specific sex bacause I am just better with boys, I'm clueless when I'm looking after little girls - that worried me!, in no way EVER did that EVER take from my gratitude for having a, any, healthy child - the two things are NOT related - how dare you!

and by the way, just because I complain one day about being shattered and hating the school run, that does NOT mean it's my biggest problem in life! It doesn't mean I've got it good. I've had my traumas, but it still helps to blow off about lunch box rules - how patronising to say that that means I don't know any worse pains!

I fell pg with my ds, unexpectedly. I was very upset about it, and had to make difficult decisions about my life. The pregnancy caused problems between me and DH which took a long time to work through. It was not an easy time.

While all this was happening, a work colleague was desperately TTC.

She was furious that I was upset about my pregnancy, when she would have loved to have been PG.

She could not see that we were both in difficult situations, beyond our control.

Deeply sympathetic to her.

SIL had to have a hysterectomy soon after dd was born, and two of my bfs are unable to have children. This isn't confined to women either. My brother won't be having any either. My trouble is that any and all of those 4 people I know would have made a much better parent than I do.

Life is unjust. I'm sorry, deeply sorry for all of you, but it is.

So to sum up noone is allowed to whinge or vent unless the are about to die because there is always someone worse off

what a load of rubbish. Saying mothers shouldn't moan about parenting problems because some people can't have children is ridiculous - or is Bibi Lynch trying to play sympathy top trumps ?

In which case she should stop moaning about being childless because she has never been devastated by the loss of a child

and we all moan about things we're bloody grateful for. I whinge about my job but having been faced with redundancy for 2 years that doesn't mean I'm incredibly grateful to have it

and finally - if you don't like parents "whinging" Bibi Lynch, I suggest you don't come on A PARENTING WEBSITE

Imagine if everyone had the mentality of the OP

you'ld have people caring for ill ageing parents going onto legal matters/housing threads telling homeless people that the shouldn't complain about housing waiting lists, because at least all their loved ones have their health

then you'ld have people from the ex pat threads telling the people caring for aging parents that at least they got to see their parents so they shouldn't complain about the amount of respite they get

where does it end?
who is "allowed" to complain? obviously the author thinks she is

do we all now need disclaimer tickers to show how entitled we are to let off steam?

Thread title:
Will I ever get my MA claim?

Trauma ticker: yes I am pregnant but it took me 18 months and 3 losses and one aging MIL living with us and one redundancy and one car crash this year, is that enough?

She's a bit black and white in her opinions. And just assuming you would be able to have children at 46 without problems is slightly unrealistic. Yes some do, but even after having three children, now I'm in my 40's I wouldn't just assume I could pop one out as easily as I did my first (in my twenties).

She really needs to take some responsibility for her choices if she isn't going to become bitter and twisted. OK she didn't meet the right man but had motherhood been the most important thing to her then there are other ways to become a mother and she could have followed those paths (from turkey basters to adoption - whatever). She made her choices.

She also assumes that motherhood is always easy, that children are born and grown to adulthood without issue. She says "Of course being a mum has its difficulties ? but they are finite and surmountable.: - Well no that's not really true if you have (as I do) a child who at 13 cannot talk and never will, and who will require 24 hour care for the rest of his life. That's not what I would call a finite or surmountable problem. It's one that you re-write your life plans around and get on with your life and meanwhile make sure it (and theirs) is a damn good one.

I have some sympathy with the whinging about gender thing (unless there's a medical reason for that feeling) but my sympathy evaporated pretty quickly. She needs to get herself some counselling, accept the choices she made, and move on with her life - and enjoy it. You only get one and you don't get to pick the good or bad things that happen to you.

"So to sum up noone is allowed to whinge or vent unless the are about to die because there is always someone worse off"

ah no, but if you're about to die after a longish life surrounded by family, there are people who died younger and alone so really dying doesn't automatically qualify you

yes I complain about things about my job too and am so grateful for it at the same time! some things NEED to be moaned about because they need to change!

would it be better if mothers burried every niggle till they had a nervous breakdown?

What a sad article and a sad woman. Just because I might moan about being tired doesn't mean I dont love my DS, in fact I would give up anything and everything for him. As someone else has said moaning about the trivial doesn't mean there aren't more serious problems to be dealt with, my DS had an op a couple of weeks ago and I wouldn't moan about that or his other health problems they are just something to be dealt with.

It makes me doubly sad to read this because she reminds me so much of my SIL who resents my DS massively because she doesn't have kids, so instead of looking at what she does have a nephew who she could have a brilliant close relationship with she looks at what she doesnt and pushes him away.

I feel massive sympathy for people who want children but can't have them for one reason or another but the rest of the world cannot stop having children or putting there lives on hold just to make them feel better.