Rabbis call for extermination camps

[Kurkum]

imemc.org/article/60435

And this is nothing new. Watch this: .

Imagine the outrage if Christian bishops or Muslim imams demanded the mass death of Jews in concentration camps. So where is the outrage when leading rabbis call for death camps and genocide for the Palestinians?

the thing that's tragic is that arabs and jews are very similar, perhaps that why they don't get on. although i had loads of arab friends when i was in israel. loads of arabs live there, really happily too with rights just like everyone else there, probably more rights than arabs living in arab states although noone here in the west ever reads about that. infact, most people have never been to israel, it is quite different than the picture that is painted over here. peoples views are mostly built on what they have either read or been told. i wish they hadn't taken the gaza etc, alot of israelis wish this too, americans i think mostly to blame there, sticking their noses in

Have never lieved in Israel just visited once many moons ago, so your experience is probably more true than mine. I found that when I was there, the Palestinians were not living happily in Israel but seemed resentful. I would say their lifestyle is better by far than somewhere like Gaza but they are not IME at least happy with things. The Christian Arabs more so perhaps than the Muslims. Mind you this was long ago, perhaps things have changed or I just met different people to you. I thought it seemed tense.

I wonder a bit too how much "the Arabs" are really a homogenous group. I lived in Morocco and I lived in the UAE and the people were totally different. In every way I can think of really.

What is happening to the Palestinian's already is wrong and against human rights anyway. Palestinian's are living in an aparthied situation already, with efforts being made to marginalize the Palestinian population as much as possible. I'm sure all the mothers on here will understand how horrific it is that women are left to give birth on the side of the road, at checkpoints, without any medical help because Israeli soldiers will not allow them to pass through to hospitals. Many mothers and babies are put in danger this way and needless to say it leads to complications and even death. It is not propoganda, it is fact.

There is definitely extremism on both sides, no doubt about that, but Israeli forces continue to oppress the human rights of another group of people. Would everyone be this passive about it if it were still South Africa?

There is a lot of suspicion over Arab people in western states as they have become synonymous with extrimist islam through media representation, so its easy to brush of IMO.

LDNmummy there was a case of a palestinian woman (singular) giving birth at a checkpoint. But the other side of that propaganda is:
"Israeli sources said that the woman's family came to the checkpoint to ask permission to go to the hospital, but she gave birth before they could obtain the required permit."

The story I read also said that an Israeli soldier delivered the baby with instruction from medics over the phone.

SO this story could well be a bit of anti-israeli sentiment of "evil soldiers deny woman access to medical care" ...or you could read it as "Baby in a hurry, pregnant mum gives birth in car park at checkpoint." or "Humanitarian Israeli soldier assists in checkpoint birth of Palestinian woman" - each story takes a different slant,depending on the bias of the source.

Then the story grows legs and suddenly ALL women are giving birth on the roadside unassisted while the evil Israelis stand by gawping.

In WW1 the germans were touted as baby murderers.

You can't compare the Palestinain/Israeli situation with South Africa.

I don't think we need to take notice of the odd rabid nutter with regard to Israeli/ Palestinian relations. We just need to look at waht the mainstream Israeli state is doing in Gaza.

"An obscure palestinian right arab news source claim outrage that "leading" Israeli rabbis want extermination of palestinians"

The news article never claimed that though.

The news article was actually surprisingly balanced and made pretty clear that the Rabbi(s) involved in the genocide calls were not a part of the mainstream, were "radical" and had argued against mainstream practices.

It was Kurkum who claimed that they were "leading" Rabbis.

And when challenged over that Kurkum changed the argument to being about Gaza with a link to another story. And that story actually proved that another leading Rabbi didn't believe in the arguments put forward by the nutter Rabbi(s).

And so now people are arguing about Gaza and the general situation instead.

Doing in Gaza - to people who elected what is regarded as a Terrorist Group who campaign for the destruction of Israel and it's people? Wonder what you're take on this would be if you were Israeli facing rockets being launched at you, worrying about your young children out playing, or when they are at school, when they board a bus. We can sit smugly in the UK pontificating but in less we are living that situation daily - we cannot understand where these people are coming from and why the mentality is so entrenched. I'll admit I'm a bit out of date with what's going on over there - 20yrs ago I was much more aware but TBH got fed up and almost bored by the whole cycle of 2 nations who are doing nothing to help themselves.

begony, you can say exactly the same on the other side. We can all sit smugly blah di blah... there's a reason the Palestinians elected terrorists.

I can put myself on both sides, that's why I get frustrated as i can see why both sides are so entrenched. Can you - or do you only see one side? This has spiked my interest again, reading up more on the current situation.

Of course I can see both sides.

But if you read the wikileaks stuff, it's pretty obvious which side has been intransigent.

And the enormous, disproportionate power and weaponry, is on the side of the Israelis. That's why they get to define which side is terrorist.

I haven't read the wiki leaks stuff so don't know if they prove anything. Yes, the power/weaponry is on the israelis side - i still think if the power was reversed that Hamas would use far less restraint - isn't heir goal to wipe out Israel? I can understand why the people of Gaza voted for them as it seems they are less corrupt than the previous lot, spending on health, schools, social polices etc but who did the people of Gaza expect Israel to react to them voting for their biggest enemy who plan on their destruction. That Israel is stronger is fortunate for Israel and not for Gaza. Would you and your family/ children not want to be on the stronger side. Do you really think that if Gazans only throw rocks then israel is only gong to throw rocks back?

Sorry for the spelling errors.

oh for goodness sake, it's not a matter of luck that israel is so disproportionately strong, it's a matter of American support. And I'm not at all sure that it's so lucky for Israel that it's so overweaningly strong, it's meant that Israel has felt it doesn't need to compromise and that has made life worse for Palestinians, meanng they got more militant and therefore worse for Israelis. It's a double edged sword, this strength.

Of course luck has nothing to do with it - why so patronising? Israel needed to be disproportionately strong given its geography and history. Of course they have been willing to talk and compromise in the past (many, many Israelis would love to live in peace as would Palestinians I presume)- why when they are now dealing with a 'terrorist organisation' intent on their destruction - should they though? If you were Israel how would you deal with Hamas?

If you were hamas, how would you deal with Israel?

Read the wikileaks stuff, it's really depressing. Sorry I have to dash out now before I murder one of my kids or they murder me.

If I were Hamas I would probably be trying blow up/ cause as much destruction as possible given the nature of the beast and the level of understandable hate involved- but that is not necessarily what is best for the people of Gaza, especially when up against a much stronger enemy who could if they wanted completely wipe you out. It's not fair but that is the situation. Israel is sending it's sons and daughters - young kids really doing NS - into these exposive situations and they are fearlessly protective of their children as we all would be and will do what it takes to protect them even if it doesn't seem fair. We cannot understand they way the Israelis feel about their army/soldiers - they see every soldier as a son or daughter and are fiercely protective of them. We cannot understand how Israelis feel about being surrounded by hatred, by people who deep down want to see you all destroyed. I just feel that those living safe lives in the west overlook this and only see that the Palestianains are the underdogs and we usually route for the underdog.

God, I sound like some Israeli propaganda machine. i do try to see it from both sides - I just don't think everyone else does which is not helpful.

begony' - i see it from both sides. i wish they could find a common ground, i get the impression a huge proportion of israelis feel the same too. one of my closes friends lives in gaza. i get regular bulletins from her as to what it is like to live there in a daily basis, not word of mouth or what i have read in the paper. tbh i don't think she should be living there, i feel angry but keep it to my self as it is nomb. problem is, countries are managed by powerful people/they are represented by them, the people have no say or control, most of the people i am sure both israeli and palestinians just want to be left to live happy peaceful lives. i think they are so similar, certainly the more traditional israelis and muslims, breaks my heart actually

The reason I originally posted this story is because it is no mere rhetoric. There is overwhelming evidence that Israeli soldiers are routinely murdering Palestinian civilians with impunity.

'A female Border Guard officer in Jenin spoke of an incident in which a nine-year-old Palestinian, who tried to climb the fence, failed, and fled ? was shot to death: "They fired? when he was already in the territories and posed no danger. The hit was in the abdomen area, they claimed he was on a bicycle and so they were unable to hit him in the legs."

'But the soldier was most bewildered by what happened next between the four soldiers present: "They immediately got their stories straight? An investigation was carried out, at first they said it was an unjustified killing? In the end they claimed that he was checking out escape routes for terrorists or something? and they closed the case."

'A female intelligence soldier who served near Etzion recounted an incident in which snipers killed a boy suspected of throwing a Molotov cocktail. The soldiers coordinated their stories, and the female soldier was shocked, mainly by the happy atmosphere that surrounding the incident: "It was written in the situation evaluation after the incident that from now on there will be quiet? This is the best kind of deterrence."'

Testimonies of Israeli female soldiers

'On 27th January, 20-year old Oday Maher Hamza Qadous was killed by settlers whilst farming between the villages of Burin and Iraq Burin, just south of Nablus. According to family sources, the Palestinian youth was alone and gathering wood when settlers ? most likely from the nearby, illegal settlement of Bracha ? shot Qaddous once through the chest, with the bullet entering his right shoulder and remaining lodged beside his left lung. Sources say that it was over an hour before an ambulance was able to reach him, and he was pronounced dead-on-arrival at the hospital. There was evidence that he was also beaten: his face was covered in blood, and a left-rib broken. Doctors concluded he died of surgical emphysema as a result of the gun-shot wound.'

Funeral held for Palestinian youth killed by settlers south of Nablus

etc etc etc

Kurkum - I'm not saying these awful things don't happen -I can well believe terrible injustices are carries out by the IDF but I don't see anything here that proves this story - it seems to be hearsay unless I missed the part stating her name and rank etc.

begonyabampot:

Did you watch the Rabbi on 'Israeli National TV' in my original post? Does that not constitute proof to your mind?

Say an Anglican bishop were to declare on BBC News that the bible requires us to slaughter all Jews -- do you really think that the media and public would ignore him as some religious bufoon? Or would there be an almighty stink and demands for his immediate resignation and even his criminal prosecution for hate crimes?

So why the hypocrisy? Why is it ok for Rabbis to say these things with international impunity?

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4274400.stm

According to the link above entitled UN Fears Over Checkpoint Births, it is estimated that around 60 women had to give birth at a checkpoint within 5 years and over half the babies died. The fact that a woman has to have a required permit HattiFattner to get to a hospital and give birth safely is bad in itself and highlights the aparthied realities of the situation. If the woman in your story was obviously giving birth to the point that a soldier had to aid delivery, then why wasn't she just allowed to get to a hospital? She was obviously not a threat.

I have encountered a lot of these kinds of defenses from pro israeli (not saying you are, just that I have) people but you managed to highlight the aparthied system within your own statement.