So, white working class children are being failed by schools and society in general.

[mrsruffallo]

Held in contempt by the middle classes (much evidence of that on here)
Industry no longer provides these people with a job for a life, dismissed as chavs, it seems that these are the the people that it is okay to ignore.....

UMF I am sure there are lots of good schools with pupils that are bilingual. You say they speak another language at home. So they speak English in school. These are middle class children in a fee paying school.

I read the article and that was my interpretation of its meaning. I am not a racist and have no personal experience of the problem. However you do not need to be a genius to see that catering to the neeeds of a diverse group of children has its problem.

I have no problems with a multi cultural society, just that those schools with such a mix have a unique set of problems that the schools with children who all speak the same language and have the same culture do not and the article raises these issues. I don't believe in discrimination, even if it is positive and don't want any class or creed to be forgotten.

Maybe sea thinks I am? (Not sure who I'm judging, though).

True that opting out of local state ed at the moment, but only cos DS is still preschool and local state ed is not feasible for working parents without nannies, cos only 2.5 hours a day. DS will go to state primary, for both financial and political reasons.

My point is that this is about class - or rather economics - not race. A multi-ethnic, international environment is considered highly desirable higher up the education and earnings scale.

opting out i meant those that can afford private ('we pay a fortune for it')

Exactly Lynli.. not sure why tethersend has a problem with what you're saying...?

but would you send your child to the local primary that was 50% non-english speaking?

No need to play dumb, daftpunk- you know as well as I do that Lynli's post signposted a change in the direction of the discussion. I was sad about that.

Yes, sea. I intend to.

I do, southeastastra and it's not an issue. I see it as a bonus actually but then I'm one of these wafty types who likes to think of myself as part of the global village.

Me? I'm a middle class fusspot about schools. Which is why my children will do well. This is about parental engagement in their children's education. I have the education and energy to choose a good school and to do my part to keep it good while we're there - because I had good educational experiences myself, I'm healthy, and I'm not struggling with poverty. I also have the option of moving house to the catchment area of a better school - which few people with children on FSM have.

But I don't think the proportion of children with English as a first language would be my main criterion. When we lived in London, the local school with a high refugee intake was considered very good, dynamic and with ambitious teachers. Expect many new arrivals end up in bad schools, though.

Not without going and looking round the local primary and finding out how they handle 50% not speaking English as a first language. And whether most of that 50% have a better grasp of English than many native speakers... And whether the school population is stable or there's a huge turnover every year, whether there are lots of different languages or one dominant language and culture that my child doesn't share, whether the children are happy to socialise outside school or not etc. etc. etc.

ds's school has links with a school in Afghanistan - when they came to visit us, it was jolly handy that two of ds's friends speak fluent Farsi (sp?) so were able to show the visitors around.

Lynli's post(s) sum up what millions of people in this country think. Of course it's ok to be Liberal when your kids aren't going to these schools, but most Liberals are complete hypocrites and wouldn't go within a mile of them...but y'know...I've been over this a 1000x on here...

looking at the report for my son's old london school now i see that 90% of the intake is now from minorities and very transient.

i imagine that is similar to the school in lambeth where this report is from.

can't see how this would be insignificant.

btw there are 32 languages spoken in my ds's school now in herts. it has great leadership - london needs to help all kids achieve their potential and why the uproar that they have noticed that it is white working classes that are failing.

It's sod all to do with colour ad everything to do with family, housing and poverty. Why even talk about colour? Historically wasn't it black males that did the worst? Maybe to do with absent fathers and no positive role models, well black community leaders stepped up and gave time and effort.

Now it's just about every family making the best of their situation, investing time in their children, knowing where they are and what they're doing at all times. Making our children children again without the burden and responsibility of acting like adults and finding a tribe to replace a family.

But my kid will go to one of 'these schools' and I have taught in quite a few of 'these schools'- yet, inexplicably I disagree with you, dp- how on earth is that possible?

How do you explain the London study reflecting the national trend, sea?

i thought it was focussing on london, read the lameth link in the bbc page

would have thought it was similar in other big cities in the uk

as i said earlier though of course it's due to lots of things but we shouldn't pretent that couldn't be a factor.

as someone said earlier lack of role models, death of industry all play a part.

The Lambeth study reflects the national trend of white working class boys underachieving.

would be interesting to see figures from the rest of the country.

Here you go

Interesting report on Birmingham

Perhaps culture and role models was the reason the black boys used to be such failing group and the reason white boys are failing is because of the family unit. I would be interested to see contact with/relationship with fathers in both groups.

at the front cover picture of the birmingham report!

reading the other link - sounds like lots more money should be spend on these kids as it has for other minorities.

if it's worked for them it should work for the failing boys.

depressing reading though.

TechLovingDad wrote: "To me, it's too defeatist to blame the government, or something wider than ourselves for our own personal development."

I agree, but it's terribly convenient to do precisely that in today's infantilised victim society!

I remember a humorous card that read:

"Definitions of Psychology.
Popular psychology: Blame society or your parents.
Unpopular psychology: Blame yourself."

tethersend;

Did you see the report about the muslim children being withdrawn from music lessons in some primary schools ...the head teacher of one of the schools (a school in Lambeth funnily enough) was on the news saying it was a strain on resources as a teacher had to be supplied to sit with these kids...

Perhaps, also, when ethnic minorities struggled they saw challenges and obstacles to overcome. White families blame everyone else, they blame ethnic minorities, poverty, resources, etc, etc when in reality the buck stops with them.