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Original poster

I'm taking my children on holiday with different surname

137 replies

C12 · 29/05/2023 14:47

I'm a mum taking my 2 daughters on holiday in summer holiday. They have their dad's surname and he's on their birth certificate however has nothing to with them and hasn't for 6 years. What actually happens if they ask for proof of permission from father and I don't have it? We have been abroad before but never asked for anything however I never realised was supposed to have permission

OP posts:
ladydiggins · 30/05/2023 20:12

To add to the above - OH is French, not UK

WilkinsonM · 30/05/2023 20:44

HicLocusEst · 30/05/2023 20:05

Nope. Read the govt link. Consent is needed from anyone with PR. Not only when there is a court order in place.

And no, not all adults travelling with minors are "policed". A sample are.

Yes, it's about trafficking, stopping parental abduction across borders, preventing child marriages and FGM among other things.

Show quote history

I know what the law is, but in practice they ask almost nobody to evidence they have consent. They COULD but they don't.

rightroyalblues · 30/05/2023 21:43

They always ask for birth certificate when the surname is different. I'm asked when with my son, but his step-mum wouldn't be. It's a completely flawed system.

BramblyHedge · 30/05/2023 21:49

What do you do if your child is travelling without either parent? My dad is taking my 17 year old abroad this summer. Do we need his birth certificate and my birth certificate?

WilkinsonM · 30/05/2023 22:07

BramblyHedge · 30/05/2023 21:49

What do you do if your child is travelling without either parent? My dad is taking my 17 year old abroad this summer. Do we need his birth certificate and my birth certificate?

He's 17. Nobody will ask.

LiquoriceAllsorts2 · 30/05/2023 22:13

BramblyHedge · 30/05/2023 21:49

What do you do if your child is travelling without either parent? My dad is taking my 17 year old abroad this summer. Do we need his birth certificate and my birth certificate?

You need a letter / form giving permission. Not sure if it still applies at 17 though as he could probably travel with no adults at that age.

toothbrusher · 30/05/2023 22:17

@marcopront so what would you think about my preference, where both parents are named on a passport (unless you get the other taken off because of OPs situation thru court) and if one parent travelling alone they need permission? It's not a level playing field now and while it may be down to "luck" some situations are less conspicuous than others

Ritasueandbobtoo9 · 30/05/2023 22:24

I think if you look like your kids then you are less likely to get challenged about whether they are your kids. It’s not about the name it is stop child trafficking. Which is a good thing.

marcopront · 31/05/2023 04:32

toothbrusher · 30/05/2023 22:17

@marcopront so what would you think about my preference, where both parents are named on a passport (unless you get the other taken off because of OPs situation thru court) and if one parent travelling alone they need permission? It's not a level playing field now and while it may be down to "luck" some situations are less conspicuous than others

Naming both parents on the passport would be problematic especially for situations like in the OP.

If parents travel alone they should have permission now.
Either
every one is checked which would be a logistical nightmare
no one is checked so child trafficking could happen
checks are random as happens now

In your situation how do immigration know that your children are yours and not their stepmothers? I see that naming you in the passport would help that but would require a lot more checking.

HicLocusEst · 31/05/2023 05:26

rightroyalblues · 30/05/2023 21:43

They always ask for birth certificate when the surname is different. I'm asked when with my son, but his step-mum wouldn't be. It's a completely flawed system.

They don't always ask for the birth certificate.

Apart from knowing this because of my job, my daughter also has a different surname to me (repeat: not that that is relevant) and sometimes travels on a different nationality passport.

I have often been asked for a consent letter, never for a birth certificate. But I know that I might also be asked for the b/cert.

It is an imperfect system, we know that. It would actually be much easier if a consent letter were an actual blanket legal requirement and everyone knew that if they didn't have it, they wouldn't leave the country. While it's only a sample of people who are stopped, or a particular possible red flag is raised, confusion, as can be seen on every single one of these threads about this, will follow.

Flowersun6 · 31/05/2023 06:23

I have just come back from Turkey OP. I remember I had forgotten DS birth certificate! It was fine but in Manchester where you usually may get asked....

A officer just asked my Son who I was, he confirmed and off we went!

So just take the children's birth certificates.

Flowersun6 · 31/05/2023 06:31

rightroyalblues · 30/05/2023 21:43

They always ask for birth certificate when the surname is different. I'm asked when with my son, but his step-mum wouldn't be. It's a completely flawed system.

This is untrue. DS has been on his 8th flight. Its a ridiculous system if they are going to question people then make us show the birth certificate they don't though so it's pointless if you ask me. People who traffic kids would get them to lie obviously.

sandybeaches74 · 31/05/2023 14:57

I'm currently in Mauritius with my kids that have a different surname. I brought their birth certificate and also a letter signed by their dad (I found a template online). I wasn't asked coming out here and to be honest I have never been asked when I've taken them anywhere as of yet!

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 19:35

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 please don’t say it’s not true without reading my comment. Ex AND HIS WIFE regularly travel with my daughter and don’t get challenged. I travel with my partner and do. Just because it’s not your experience doesn’t mean it’s not true for others

Grace204 · 31/05/2023 20:03

What could a letter prove though ? Surely if you were people smuggling you could just write a letter saying the father gives permission?

MrsTerryPratchett · 31/05/2023 20:13

Grace204 · 31/05/2023 20:03

What could a letter prove though ? Surely if you were people smuggling you could just write a letter saying the father gives permission?

I used to take a notarised letter when DD was small (and had a different name and nationality to me) so that's proof.

tracylamont13 · 31/05/2023 20:14

I'm in Europe atm with my son who has a different surname. I had his birth certificate it they didn't ask for it at the border.

LiquoriceAllsorts2 · 31/05/2023 20:18

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 19:35

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 please don’t say it’s not true without reading my comment. Ex AND HIS WIFE regularly travel with my daughter and don’t get challenged. I travel with my partner and do. Just because it’s not your experience doesn’t mean it’s not true for others

They may travel without your permission and not get asked but that doesn’t mean that they are allowed to (unless there is a court order in place giving permission).
you suggest that the issue with why you can’t is that you have a different name to your children but that is your choice so why would it be discrimination. You could have given them your name or taken the same name as them.

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 20:33

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 isn’t hindsight wonderful. Yes, I should have risked the beating I’d have got for suggesting I wouldn’t give his name or I should’ve known before procreating that he was a bad one even when he’d been wonderful until then. YES, I made mistakes in my life that I’m paying for now when I try to travel with my family. He is an abusive arsehole who faces no such consequences travelling. I take your point on board that I made mistakes but I massively resent your superior attitude that it’s all my fault when you have no idea what I’ve been through, as well as many women who have been thru similar or worse

LiquoriceAllsorts2 · 31/05/2023 20:53

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 20:33

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 isn’t hindsight wonderful. Yes, I should have risked the beating I’d have got for suggesting I wouldn’t give his name or I should’ve known before procreating that he was a bad one even when he’d been wonderful until then. YES, I made mistakes in my life that I’m paying for now when I try to travel with my family. He is an abusive arsehole who faces no such consequences travelling. I take your point on board that I made mistakes but I massively resent your superior attitude that it’s all my fault when you have no idea what I’ve been through, as well as many women who have been thru similar or worse

I said that he needs permission which is true (unless court order in place). I agree that it is not fair that he is not being asked. The suggestion of putting parents names/parental responsibility on passports so you can easily see if they are traveling with the parents is probably a good one so that everyone gets checked but you have the issue of having what happens if that changes before the passport expires.

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 21:21

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 yes, he should need permission hence my initial post you challenged me on about how I need permission and he doesn’t. I get that my “solution” of both parents names on a passport doesn’t solve OPs dilemma and I agree there needs to be provisos in place, like a quick and cheap flag to a passport if a judge finds a parent absent or controlling until a child is 18 if a trip is less than x days, to a Hague convention country or if evidence of a return can be provided.

If it’s outside of these, as in you’ve got a father who comes from a non-Hague country or wants to travel to one, permission in writing for the other parent or court should be sought

LiquoriceAllsorts2 · 31/05/2023 21:35

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 21:21

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 yes, he should need permission hence my initial post you challenged me on about how I need permission and he doesn’t. I get that my “solution” of both parents names on a passport doesn’t solve OPs dilemma and I agree there needs to be provisos in place, like a quick and cheap flag to a passport if a judge finds a parent absent or controlling until a child is 18 if a trip is less than x days, to a Hague convention country or if evidence of a return can be provided.

If it’s outside of these, as in you’ve got a father who comes from a non-Hague country or wants to travel to one, permission in writing for the other parent or court should be sought

Do you have a child arrangement in place saying that the children live with you? If so, you don’t need permission (for a specified timeframe) and just need to show that.

toothbrusher · 31/05/2023 21:43

@LiquoriceAllsorts2 no, because for the reasons above he generally takes it out on me these days by refusing to return DD. I'm afraid I didn't seek a court order because of things I've explained upthread (he wouldn't have brought her back, I'd have been "reported" for whatever etc) Alao he's awful but he's an ok/valued dad to DD. Just cos he's a shit to me and continues ri control parts of my life like holidays with her doesn't mean now is the time for a court order. Again,maybe I should've gone down that route before but reasons above. Opting out now as this isn't a productive discussion but if OP/others want to dm for further clarity I'm cool with it. Not up for protecting my position anymore

OllyBJolly · 01/06/2023 06:32

My children have my name (so glad I insisted on that!) and I've been challenged several times travelling to Canada and the US (never for EU). I did carry a letter giving permission from XH (which satisfied immigration even though I could have totally fabricated it! ). Ironically, I had sole care and control as he didn't want to co-parent but I was told a letter of permission would be more acceptable.

Once in the US they didn't ask me but directly asked the DCs "Where's your pa?" Thankfully they said he had to work.

I did get taken to an interview room once at Toronto which was scary. There was a single dad with 2 DCs in front of me and they separated him from his DCs to interview. Mine came into the room with me (aged 6 and 4 on that occasion)

You don't need all this after a 7 hour flight with young DCs!

BreaktheCycle · 02/06/2023 00:46

11 years ago, we went to L.A. when DD was nearly 2. Even though DP, DD and I were travelling together, the staff member checking our passports at LAX Airport did not ask for DD’s Birth Certificate or ask DP to confirm I was DD’s mum, although they seemed annoyed that I had a different surname. LAX Airport have always had form for being difficult.

I’ve yet to travel abroad with the DC without DP, but will definitely be carrying their Birth Certificates and a letter after reading this thread.