Page 10 | Who and how much to tip (USA)

SleepDreamThinkHuge · 2023-03-28T10:52:00+00:00

Hi, I am thinking of going to USA maybe this summer or early next year. Thinking of New York or California. Of course the USA has a different tipping culture to UK. In the USA, when you go how much do you generally tip, who do you tip?

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 03/04/2023 11:04

The problem is that, if some people do tip 30-35% - whether to be extra generous/grateful for decent service, out of a worry of 'undertipping' and being seen as mean or any other reason - if enough people start to do this, it will become the norm that 'standard' tips are 35% - so that somebody then 'only' tipping 30% will be condemned as a tight-arsed miser!

As has been said upthread - by me and by others - it makes no logical sense to keep increasing a percentage, when inflation and market forces already mean that the existing percentage will keep rising too. Can you imagine if governments tried to justify increasing tax rates (as a percentage of your earnings), using the excuse that £1,000/$1,000 buys far less than it did 30 years ago?!

KatherineJaneway · 03/04/2023 11:17

This argument always comes up on any thread about tipping - whether in the US, UK or anywhere else. It's not at all that people are too mean to pay the full price; they just want to knowthe full price, so that they can efficiently and pleasantly pay for an agreed business transaction, without any awkwardness or uncertainty, or otherwise can decide not to request the goods or services in the first place if they can't afford it or deem it not worth it to them - it's a simple matter of honest transparency and having the knowledge that you need in order to be able to budget effectively.

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

SofiaSoFar · 03/04/2023 11:50

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

What about the tax?

Let's say someone looks at the menu outside to see whether the prices are in budget and they choose 2 mains, one at 28.99 and one at 33.49 then 2 sides at 5.00 each.

In the rest of the world I'd look at that and in a couple of seconds think ~73.00. Easy.

In Ohio, which I'm most familiar with, it's the same quick, rough working out as above and then...

~73.00 + [5.75% of ~73.00 (state tax)] + [~2.0% of ~73.00 (local tax)] + [20-25% of ~73.00 (the tip)]

So...

~73.00 + ~4.00 + ~2.00 + ~17.00

Which is ~96.00

Just state the actual price on the menu, FFS.

SpareHeirOverThere · 03/04/2023 12:21

SofiaSoFar · 03/04/2023 11:50

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

What about the tax?

Let's say someone looks at the menu outside to see whether the prices are in budget and they choose 2 mains, one at 28.99 and one at 33.49 then 2 sides at 5.00 each.

In the rest of the world I'd look at that and in a couple of seconds think ~73.00. Easy.

In Ohio, which I'm most familiar with, it's the same quick, rough working out as above and then...

~73.00 + [5.75% of ~73.00 (state tax)] + [~2.0% of ~73.00 (local tax)] + [20-25% of ~73.00 (the tip)]

So...

~73.00 + ~4.00 + ~2.00 + ~17.00

Which is ~96.00

Just state the actual price on the menu, FFS.

Thank god you're here to sort this out for a nation of 330 million useless feckers who couldn't see reason. Why could no one in the whole of the USA see that your system is better? Have you considered recolonising? They need your help.

SofiaSoFar · 03/04/2023 12:36

Thank god you're here to sort this out for a nation of 330 million useless feckers who couldn't see reason. Why could no one in the whole of the USA see that your system is better?

I have absolutely no idea. It's not rocket surgery, is it.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 03/04/2023 12:57

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

So do they advertise on the menus or on signs that the full price is the menu price plus an extra 20%?

Or are you just expected to know this, even when you may never have been told about it and come from one of the very many countries in the world where you're used to businesses giving you the complete price in order for you to obtain what they are offering?

GulfCoastBeachGirl · 03/04/2023 14:12

TizerorFizz · 03/04/2023 09:59

I think there is an issue exposed here that Visit USA is clearly not suggesting huge tips. Their view for tourists is much more measured and sensible. The charge for the waiting staff at 35% is exceeding the cost of the food and chef payments. This cannot be right snd I’ve never seen 35% suggested anywhere. I went to the USA last year (twice) and never felt 20% or double the Tax wasn’t ok. So do go and do not let some of the rubbish on here put you off.

20% is fine. I can assure you that most Americans are not tipping 30-35%. If they want to, that's fine but it certainly isn't expected.

Dining out is expensive and is getting more expensive all the time. The cost of food is certainly a factor in whether or not a vacation is affordable, but the way to trim costs isn't to forego the tip. Agree with it or not, that's how wait staff are paid in the US.

But outside of tourist destinations like NYC or Disney you can find nice, reasonably priced restaurants with good food. New York City has some of the most outrageous food and lodging prices in the world, I'm afraid.

CarolinaInTheMorning · 03/04/2023 14:50

30-35 % is not expected anywhere for restaurant service. 20% is still fine. But I wouldn't go much lower than that.

One of the reasons that percentages went up a bit when restaurants re-opened after lockdown is that it was very hard to hire waitstaff and so many places were understaffed. Pent-up demand for going out to eat made some people (me included) overtip for a while, recognizing that waitstaff were sometimes putting themselves at risk to go to work. That situation has been changing, although more slowly than we would like, and tipping has been returning to normal in most places.

KatherineJaneway · 03/04/2023 15:07

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 03/04/2023 12:57

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

So do they advertise on the menus or on signs that the full price is the menu price plus an extra 20%?

Or are you just expected to know this, even when you may never have been told about it and come from one of the very many countries in the world where you're used to businesses giving you the complete price in order for you to obtain what they are offering?

You do some research before you go. Unless you have been living under a rock, you know tips are expected in the USA. I just did a bit of research and found the right percentage for meals, housekeeping etc. It's not exactly rocket science.

KatherineJaneway · 03/04/2023 15:10

SofiaSoFar · 03/04/2023 11:50

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

What about the tax?

Let's say someone looks at the menu outside to see whether the prices are in budget and they choose 2 mains, one at 28.99 and one at 33.49 then 2 sides at 5.00 each.

In the rest of the world I'd look at that and in a couple of seconds think ~73.00. Easy.

In Ohio, which I'm most familiar with, it's the same quick, rough working out as above and then...

~73.00 + [5.75% of ~73.00 (state tax)] + [~2.0% of ~73.00 (local tax)] + [20-25% of ~73.00 (the tip)]

So...

~73.00 + ~4.00 + ~2.00 + ~17.00

Which is ~96.00

Just state the actual price on the menu, FFS.

Then you factor the tax in as well. If you do your research in advance of your trip, you'll have all you need to make an informed choice.

CarolinaInTheMorning · 03/04/2023 15:12

Also doubling the tax is not going to work well in many places. Sales tax where I live is 6.5%; 13% is not enough.

TizerorFizz · 03/04/2023 16:03

Well you are lucky it’s 6.5%. Elsewhere it’s higher. Visit USA is not suggesting more than 20. % for tourists so where tax is higher, double the tax and round up is fair.

mathanxiety · 03/04/2023 16:16

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 03/04/2023 12:57

For a meal you do know the full price. Looks at the menu and what you like, then add 20% to give you a rough idea of the final bill.

So do they advertise on the menus or on signs that the full price is the menu price plus an extra 20%?

Or are you just expected to know this, even when you may never have been told about it and come from one of the very many countries in the world where you're used to businesses giving you the complete price in order for you to obtain what they are offering?

It's all a cunning trick designed to fool British tourists. Americans love laughing their heads off at the bewildered expressions.

mathanxiety · 03/04/2023 16:18

SofiaSoFar · 03/04/2023 07:16

The multiplicity of ill-informed posts regarding the US from a great number of posters here - all basically denouncing the US for not being Britain...

No, people are denouncing it for not being every other country on Earth.

Every time you make your argument for waiters being paid completely in tips and thus the massive tip is absolutely necessary, you're arguing against the regularly made point in this thread that 20% should be added to the original bill and then, for exceptional service, a customer can choose to give a tip if they wish.

If that's what you're seeing in my posts, then you're seriously misreading them.

mathanxiety · 03/04/2023 16:27

RampantIvy · 02/04/2023 20:45

When it's expected/asked for/demanded/complained about if not received, it's absolutely not a 'tip' in anybody's reality - it's nothing more than deliberately obscured (maybe even fraudulent) pricing.

And it's so transactional.

Correct, it is transactional. It's the cost of having your food schlepped to your table.

It's not noblesse oblige.

mathanxiety · 03/04/2023 16:34

Snoopsnoggysnog · 02/04/2023 05:24

What? It’s their job to show up surely? I don’t mind leaving $10-20 at the end of a stay but I don’t feel I need to leave $10 a day just to encourage them to show up to a job they are presumably employed to do!
some of these posts are bonkers.

Show quote history

I once worked in a hotel, and the housekeeping staff definitely earned every single penny they made plus all the tips left by guests.

For every guest leaving a room in a manageable condition, there were frequently three who left their rooms amd en suites like pigstyes, and for every decent guest leaving a tip, there were many who didn't bother. It's mainly women with very little education and prospects who work in housekeeping, often middle-aged, with bad feet, hips, and backs.

They work hard to get their allotted rooms finished. They do a lot more than just 'show up', and their work is spot checked in many hotels, with no excuses taken for poor quality results.

IheartBTS · 03/04/2023 16:36

When we arrived in New York 18yrs ago, we arrived at the hotel, tired and jet lagged. The bellman picked up our luggage and headed for the lifts. A senior member of staff said something to him, then he dumped our luggage on the spot! This was all happening in the foyer.
At the time, we couldn’t work out what we had done/said wrong, as he hadn’t even taken our luggage to our room, but guessed we hadn’t offered the tip early enough? I would have thought it would have been ok to tip after the job was completed, but obviously not!

mathanxiety · 03/04/2023 16:37

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 01/04/2023 09:29

So yes, if a series of customers stiffs them, they're allowed to whine, because the IRS is going to go after them for what they should be making.

Part of 'owning it' as a top paying job is paying the taxes you owe for a certain tax band.

Then that is an issue for which the IRS needs to be challenged. I presume all waiting staff are clamouring to notify the IRS when a celebrity/very wealthy person gives them a huge tip? It can't be that unusual for some people - whether well-off, very satisfied or (I suspect more likely) tourists who don't really understand it but who are frightened of accidentally causing offence - to give considerably more than the expected tip. Do waiting staff run after somebody to tell them that they have overtipped and offer them some money back? I think I can guess on that one.

You keep talking about customers 'stiffing' them, but how can this be in an industry (which I accept isn't designed that way by any one individual worker) that states a price and then expects people - including foreigners - to know that they're expected to pay $X/X% more than the supposed advertised price? Either you're genuinely grateful for extra money that people give you by way of gratitude; or it's part of the price, in which case it should be stated as such.

It's always a gamble when you agree to sell something but understate and don't confirm the price you're wanting for it in advance, in the hope of getting more money overall: many you will win, but some you will lose.

The anglocentrism is pretty strong there. 'America is so weirdly and determinedly backwards...'?? Or maybe just different?

I agree with you that it is very unfair and completely unhelpful to slur an entire nation based on one cultural practice that some foreigners find bewildering; but it works both ways - 'somebody' upthread effectively slurred all Brits by claiming we don't 'do' or understand being nice or kind to each other.

Oh for the love of puppies.

Yes, let's tackle the IRS. The whole system offends British sensibilities. It must be changed. Good luck.

Ever heard of swings and roundabouts?

IDontWantToBeAPie · 03/04/2023 17:30

People it's pretty much mandatory to tip: restaurant, housekeeping, luggage guy.

People I don't ever tip in the US: coffee shops, bartenders. They've never said anything.

Theelephantinthecastle · 03/04/2023 18:03

I asked my aunt who runs a fairly mid range hotel in the US. She says the vast majority of people don't tip housekeeping

Now I am sure that despite pontificating on all things UK in other threads on the basis of British friends and family, that won't be good enough for @mathanxiety but there we are.

Theelephantinthecastle · 03/04/2023 18:13

NY times survey said 30% of Americans top hotel housekeeping:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/business/hotel-housekeeper-tipping.html

Personally the approach that I take is that if I have made a mess of any sort for whatever reason, I tip, if not I don't. The time (not in the US) I had horrific food poisoning I tipped very substantially (and obviously did my best to clean up)

GulfCoastBeachGirl · 03/04/2023 18:49

@Theelephantinthecastle I am really surprised that more people don't tip housekeeping! Not doubting you (obviously your aunt has first hand knowledge). I wonder if it's a generational thing? Maybe younger travelers just don't bother anymore? Interesting.

But as I posted earlier in the thread, between worker shortages and post-covid changes to the hospitality industry, I've found housekeeping services to be very patchy at best. I tip based on the service I receive which frankly hasn't been all that impressive my last few hotel stays.

BackToWhereItAllBegan · 03/04/2023 19:05

I don't think the US is going to overhaul their entire tax system to keep a few British tourists at Disneyland happy.
Just add 20% in restaurants and bars, everyone pays by card at the bar now so you don't need to have lots of dollar bills ready for that.
I guess America will never be totally cashless but I can't remember the last time I actually used cash for anything. I try to keep a small amount with me in case I end up using a valet service for parking but the ones around me take Venmo now so I haven't used real money for a long time!
It's not something to lose sleep over, just leave a few dollars for housekeeping and take your own luggage to the room if you don't want to tip the bellboy.
Taxis usually take cards now, so add it on when you pay and Uber has a function in the app the add tips.
Stick with the 20% and nobody, anyone will be offended or chase after you for more money!!

Theelephantinthecastle · 03/04/2023 19:07

@GulfCoastBeachGirl yes, I think it's generational differences to some extent. Her hotel is in an area where most visitors are either millennials doing hiking or retirees sun seeking and it's definitely the older guests who tip.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 03/04/2023 19:24

Correct, it is transactional. It's the cost of having your food schlepped to your table.

It's not noblesse oblige.

At last, we agree on something! Tipping IS very much noblesse oblige, and as you have confirmed, these are standard costs of buying the goods and service - so why continue to call it tipping?

Would you be happy if you worked hard all month and then your boss gave you an envelope with your wages in and said "Here, I want you to have this as a token of my appreciation"?