Wolf Hall discussion continuation thread

[AKnickerfulOfMenace]

Continuing the thread from Telly Addicts, just in time for episode 4

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/telly_addicts/2288038-Damian-Lewis-fans-line-up-for-Wolf-Hall-tonight?msgid=52500336#52500336

That was bleak. The grey chill, Anne shivering from cold and fear, her terror was palpable. And Henry, all backlit and bonhomie. Cromwell went from spider to fly at the end!

How brilliant. That last shot of Cromwell in Henry's grip really summed up his situation.

The execution scene was certainly powerful. The scene around Anne seemed almost sympathetic until the crowd gasped in horror as the executioner brandished his sword. How brave must a person be to remain kneeling, knowing what's going to happen any second? More people must end up crumpled in a faint, I'm sure.

That was so good. Claire Foy's acting in the execution scene was stunning. Anne had been such a cow in the previous 5 eps but I felt so sorry for her tonight as her situation became more and more desperate.

I also felt really sorry for poor Mark Smeaton

I wasn't pay proper attention to the BBC4 thing. Did they say HM is still writing the third book? I thought it was out this summer?

Citron, wasn't that portrayed well? I was practically yelling at them to shut up as they dug their own graves.

Definitely not out this year. I saw her discussing writing it two years ago and she is still writing it so it must be taking longer than she thought.

This is a good review, but I had to look up the definition of "casuistries":

'casuistry
?kazj??stri,-?j-/
noun
plural noun: casuistries
1.
the use of clever but unsound reasoning, especially in relation to moral questions; sophistry.
"the minister is engaging in nothing more or less than casuistry"
synonyms: sophistry, specious reasoning, speciousness, sophism, chicanery, quibbling, equivocation, fallaciousness; informalfudging
"the usual teenage casuistry about altruism always being ultimately selfish"
2.
the resolving of moral problems by the application of theoretical rules.'

How absolutely apt for Henry.

Crickey BOF I cannot think of any opportunity in real life where I could casually slip in the word " casuistry".

I shall do my best

The executioner distracted Anne by shouting, 'Boy fetch my sword.' I hadn't considered that he'd shout it in French, but Anne would have spoken French fluently, so it makes sense that he would.

I have read somewhere that there was no coffin ready for Anne so I was surprised to see the coffin on the scaffold.

No coffin you were right, 'twas a box.

My history teacher taught us that whilst Henry had ordered the French swordsman executioner to be merciful to Anne, he made a mistake and hit the knot of her hair cap thingy on first go, so it took 3 cuts to behead her.

I had my ears and eyes blocked at that bit tonight in case it was true.

History teacher was a bit strange, tbh so could have just wanted to horrify us .

I haven't been a fan of some of the natural lighting . But the natural sound as Anne gave her speech added so to the general atmosphere.

That sounds a little like Cromwell's execution, the many attempts

Latin wasn't it Mary Queen of Scots where it took three goes? There was a block and axe in her case as I recall, whereas the crack French swordsman was Henry being merciful (huh!) to Anne.

I missed BBC 4 programme what did Mark Rylance say about Robert Mitchum and Brad Pitt? Am interested in the acting styles he suggests as influences.

Historically says there wasn't a block for Anne. Not sure why. Henry brought in a special swordsman from France or somewhere for the execution. Perhaps feeling she deserved some sympathy.

It is thought TC was acting for the king but that didn't really come over in the programme I think. It was very complex. I have been trying to re read bit of history texts but depending on the author, you get a different view of TC. Generally Mantel is kinder to him than historically he has been shown!

Having re read some stuff there does seem to be suggestion that the allegations weren't true but who knows? I loved the way it showed last night the way he set them all up. Not sure how much of that was true though.

In previous film portrayals of TC he is shown to have used torture to get the confessions but that wasn't clear in WH. Does it in the book? I need to read the books now I think.

Yes but remember earlier in the series when Anne told TC to make someone say what she wanted & he replied 'Madam, we don't do that'. Also when TC was talking to Thomas More he brought up the young man More had racked in his own home & made a comment along the lines of More was lucky that they don't do that anymore. I was under the impression that torture was not involved but that may just be the author's view.

I'm really going to miss it, I will miss his sad eyes & quiet voice & moments of stillness. I never really had the sense of menace from the actor, when he was observing the play for example I had the impression he was just quietly filing it away in his mind rather than having a passionate wish to see them executed for it. Very masterful acting.

I think they should shown the spiked heads at Traitors Gate though when Anne was in the boat.

Yes but we saw her looking up though didn't we. That was effective.

Also when she is looking up on her way towards the execution and someone. (Who?) asks why she is looking and TC says she thinks there is still hope.......awful. Great drama though.

That final episode was stunning.