Son not allowed to continue to second year at uni

[PocketSand]

DS2 has just completed his first year in an engineering degree. His results are all over the place from 1st in maths to 2:2 to required resits. He exceeded the A level grade requirements for MEng. He is autistic and has ADHD. He was un medicated prior to and during most of his first year due to shortages followed by referral to cardiology.

His DSA support didn't start til the spring term and one support worker provided 1 hour support when 30 hours was approved. He constantly tells the one he has seen that everything is fine and they believe him.

He always says everything is fine and doesn't ask for help. He has never been to the library and relies totally on lecture notes. He doesn't know what independent study is. I have always been his advocate but now he is expected to advocate for himself. No one at the uni knows these issues - he has not even contacted his personal tutor let alone disability services and just thinks he needs to work harder.

He found out today that he has failed his third submission of a lab report he initially submitted in February. He did not have DSA agreed support at that time so he didn’t have his own laptop. He borrowed another student’s at the time but when he had to resubmit no longer had access to his results and so he tried to cobble together a report using specimen (and maybe someone else’s results - not clear). He had previously received an email saying he couldn’t proceed unless he passed resubmission. I assume that’s where we are at now.

His feedback is harsh - shouldn’t study for a degree if not prepared to use feedback to improve his work. Trouble is he often doesn’t understand the feedback and he is unwilling to ask for clarification as he fears tutor’s anger. He says he doesn’t know who marked the work so doesn’t know who to talk to and seems generally clueless about most administrative issues.

I feel completely in the dark and don’t know where to go from here. Obviously I don’t want to just give up and accept his journey ends here as it seems very unfair but don’t know what I can do to try and enable him to fix this or if it can be fixed.

Can anyone who knows the system provide advice on next steps please?

You have no idea what is involved in parenting a young adult with autism do you.

Some degree of parental involvement at primary is expected... but by University, he should be able to avail himself of the support facilities.

University is not just about the academics, its about learning to stand on your own two feet, ask the appropriate people for the appropriate support.

If he can't over come step one 'learn to ask for help'... then that suggests he is not ready for this level of self-led education. And in fact it looks like it isn't just that, but that he is actively refusing help offered to him.

I do understand how hard it is, I am AuDHD, with physical disabilities as well. If you don't ask for the help you need, the bottom line is always going to be that you won't get any help.

You need to find out what he actually wants, because if he is simply happy to be brilliant at maths, but work in Tescos stacking shelves... theres really no point pushing him to go to University. If he really does want a degree and a job that requires one, he will have to push himself to do things he finds hard.

@PocketSand has he done work experience in the area of engineering he is studying? It sounds as though he might not have, as if he had he may have realised all the various aspects of the work and study which are not purely academic/maths, it would have helped him map out what was required, eg good, effective communication, being organised, independent research.

If he has this dream there is no reason why he shouldn't go for it - he should, you are right - but the skills he is missing are those required in the professional world as well as succeed at university so he needs help to get up to speed with those skills - by someone who has those skills, which might be you, or someone else, and not DSA.

Is it possible to try to set up work experience if that might help, now? And to coach him through everything he needs to get his head around, the need to be very organised and coach him around communication so he ready to hit the ground running if they let him repeat the year?

My experience is that the professional workplace is gentler in terms of management and feedback, however, that might cheer him up a bit and help him to grit his teeth and do what is necessary to get through university.

A lot of students come across as uber confident which can be off putting for more introverted types, if this applies, coach him to not be put off by it, and to be more confident in himself

Knowing you are on the case in relation to skills coaching might even help convince the university

No I was just the young autistic person. I didn’t have mummy stood behind me to fix everything as it would have done me no favours.

I had to learn to do it myself.

She’s not saying that it’s important to her - but that this is what his abilities (and social skills) indicate may be an option for him and possibly a pathway to a career.

You don’t need advanced social skills for maths in an academic setting.

I don’t think it’s necessarily in his interests to try to appeal this.

1. is he being asked to take a year off? Or leave altogether? (My DS has several friends who have been asked to take a term or year off to get support for whatever it was they needed).
2. I wonder if Uni reached out to him during the year, and if he ignored? It’s possible that Uni can’t “help” unless he requests it. Aware that DS son submitted a “circumstances” form as his adhd meds were unavailable for a month. The Uni allowed him re-sits … but he needed actually organize & re sit..

Feom an academic point of view it is not a good idea to postpone as too much would be "pruned" from the brain/forgotten - and what do they do with those 3 years? It would be very counter productive from a career point of view too. Better to do a combination of accommodating needs and extra coaching in soft skills - management, being organised, communication, autonomy, research - I think.

I was in your position, ds also had 1st in maths in year one, but after 6yr battle and numerous appeals and resits, an engineering degree which is worth nothing, as there are not enough entry level jobs for the massive increase in student numbers. So my advice is to get him home and do not go back to uni.specially engineering.
The unis just want your 9.25k fees, they don't care about students, specially with hidden disability who can't advocate for themselves. Its not worth battling. The DSA and disability services cannot make it a level playing field.
Study with OU or part-time, or do an apprenticeship, or, if you want the experience of uni, choose a subject less demanding on workload than engineering.
He can choose any other degree as he's only used one year of the loan. If he goes back and fails 2nd year he won't have enough years of loan to do another degree.

OP, I used to be in higher education and I met several young people like your son.

It's difficult for the university to make the right accommodations if the student does not come forward to request them. They don't need to be absolutely on top of processes, but they need to read their emails, and they need to contact the disability support services.

He really needs a laptop - did he want the money for something else?

He should have a good case if he wants to appeal but there will be a bulge of appeals going through right now and he might not hear until the middle of next semester. The result might be resitting the first year.

Academic malpractice is treated seriously but a first offence should not lead to being removed from the programme. It's tiered: repeated malpractice is taken more seriously, as is malpractice at later stages.

It might be useful to know the following:

1. students don't always tell their parents all the important details, and parents naturally want to think the best of their children

2. universities and employers are required to make accommodations, but not to set aside fundamental requirements. They can't just wave through failing students, or students who demonstrate repeatedly that they cannot cope

3. that said, he has legal rights to accommodations and if he builds a good case will be heard sympathetically.

I've also seen students make repeated successful appeals in successive years, and take out several student loans, only to drop out three or four years in. Sometimes the student was very close to meeting requirements, but had not completed a core piece of coursework, and just couldn't get it done. Once they have used up all their 'lives' the university may be bound by regulations.

In some cases the student just runs out of steam and doesn't submit an appeal that would have been successful. So, in many cases, students dropping out could have finished. But the university cannot know what it is they truly want and if they choose not to appeal, they cannot do it for them.

He's entitled to switch programme and would qualify for a student loan for the full programme. The Student Loans Company allows them one year of a false start.

@PocketSand I hope you know - and having reread the thread twice I am sure - that everyone here is trying to help. I don't think anyone is remotely trying to underestimate how difficult this is, but offer up practical, useful solutions that will help you to help your son to get to where he wants to be in a successful fashion.

This must be a really tough time for you both, but also a chance to have some very frank conversations that lead to a better and more reasonable way forward for him. Wishing you all the best.

Can't he repeat the year? Edited to say apologies if others have suggested.

OP, It’s mind boggling that he (and you) thought he didn’t need a laptop to do a degree - this not a university or DSA issue. This is on him and you.

This reads like he is not capable of seeking assistance to support his own needs in this setting, is actively discouraging it, and that he requires more assistance than was indicated on entry. Perhaps more than can be provided by the university on the grounds that he entered. The DSA can’t force support on him as an adult attending third level education.

Equality and equity are incredibly important in this space, but this is different from school and college. If he needs his parents to arrange his education in an adult institution, it suggests he needs carers to attend with him to get a degree, which is often beyond the scope of DSA support.

I’d have him repeat first year. Knowing what’s coming, and having the correct equipment such as the laptop, might enable him to get very high results across the board.

He seems exceptionally stubborn. To go to uni to do STEM degree without a laptop, when you offered to get one, is pretty damn pig headed and silly. Repeating first year might possibly teach him consequences. It might not though.

This is very sound advice.

This sounds like a very difficult situation for you and your son, but I think the fact that he didn’t think he needed/didn’t want a laptop highlights that there’s a lot of ground to cover before he can succeed at uni. How did he even manage high school without a laptop?

I think you’d do well to post for advice on forums/facebook groups for parents of autistic students to see how other parents are supporting. I was very pushy with my son, ‘you either let us support you or you have to leave uni’ harsh, but he could not get through it without some help navigating the system. DSA support was not good, makes no sense that they think young 18 year olds with autism are all going to be able to manage to organise appointments and know what support they need.

Does your son have elements of ODD?

It's hard for him, and you. I hope he is able to get some insight into what his needs actually mean day-to-day so that he can move forward.

I agree that finding advice and support from parents in a similar situation might help a lot.

On the support system - at my previous institutions, appointments went into students' calendars, and they could attend online. But they still had to enable their notifications and click to join the meeting.

Attendance rates at my one-to-one meetings (with online always an option) were lower than you'd think - some students really struggled with morning meetings.

As your statement so clearly proves, the capabilities of autistic people vary.

I review university appeals for a living…for my sins. Appeal on the grounds of inadequate disability support. These case are pretty clear cut in terms of how the OIA (Ombudsman) review – was the agreed disability support provided?

It's heartrending for any parent when DC's talents lie in an obvious direction, but they're determined to follow a path that you know is pretty much certain to bring anxiety, disappointment and failure. How much harder that is when your DC is ND I can't imagine.

With all the scaffolding and support in the world - is DS really cut out for Engineering? With all the complex admin, self-management and 'real world' challenges they bombard them with? Modern unis are Kafka-esque institutions for anyone, with systems seemingly designed to trip up students rather than help them.

My instinct would be to try and cut his/your losses where he is and try to get him on a Maths course - clearly his forte - in a college where there was more provision for his needs. If such a place exists, and if he were willing to accept the idea. I'd definitely look into things like the degree apprenticeships @Sue763 mentions.

Whatever the solution, it might be time to accept that the 'traditional uni' route is just not going to work for DS, however much he may excel in some academic areas.

Someone up thread mentioned that their ND son did Computer science, would your son consider something like this?
I work with Engineers- civil & structural and building services , we have 2 ND apprentices and they are just not coping. We had another one in planning who left after a few months as she couldn't cope with all the meetings.
Would a 'quieter' career be more suitable?
I would suggest that your son applies for work experience in Engineering and maybe IT to see what he likes best.

The uni would have asked his consent to pass on details of his disability to the lecturers at the start of the year . I also emailed my course lead at the start of my course and spoke to her about everything that was going on for me at that point and did for the following 2 years after when I did my masters . Regardless thou it isn't the unis fault he hasn't been allowed to proceed it's his . I went to uni for my undergrad and I also failed a year due to 2 very traumatic and life changing things that happened . I resat the 2 modules I needed and ended up with a 2:2 and a masters .

DSA mentoring sessions for me anyway were always booked at the end of each session and I had the contact details for my mentor and her manager to be able to chase the sessions.

That's very interesting @Captcha4903

I do hope @PocketSandhas noted your post, (some really useful posts can be missed in such a long thread) this could be a lifeline for her son.