Son not allowed to continue to second year at uni

[PocketSand]

DS2 has just completed his first year in an engineering degree. His results are all over the place from 1st in maths to 2:2 to required resits. He exceeded the A level grade requirements for MEng. He is autistic and has ADHD. He was un medicated prior to and during most of his first year due to shortages followed by referral to cardiology.

His DSA support didn't start til the spring term and one support worker provided 1 hour support when 30 hours was approved. He constantly tells the one he has seen that everything is fine and they believe him.

He always says everything is fine and doesn't ask for help. He has never been to the library and relies totally on lecture notes. He doesn't know what independent study is. I have always been his advocate but now he is expected to advocate for himself. No one at the uni knows these issues - he has not even contacted his personal tutor let alone disability services and just thinks he needs to work harder.

He found out today that he has failed his third submission of a lab report he initially submitted in February. He did not have DSA agreed support at that time so he didn’t have his own laptop. He borrowed another student’s at the time but when he had to resubmit no longer had access to his results and so he tried to cobble together a report using specimen (and maybe someone else’s results - not clear). He had previously received an email saying he couldn’t proceed unless he passed resubmission. I assume that’s where we are at now.

His feedback is harsh - shouldn’t study for a degree if not prepared to use feedback to improve his work. Trouble is he often doesn’t understand the feedback and he is unwilling to ask for clarification as he fears tutor’s anger. He says he doesn’t know who marked the work so doesn’t know who to talk to and seems generally clueless about most administrative issues.

I feel completely in the dark and don’t know where to go from here. Obviously I don’t want to just give up and accept his journey ends here as it seems very unfair but don’t know what I can do to try and enable him to fix this or if it can be fixed.

Can anyone who knows the system provide advice on next steps please?

Good advice about study skills. I have supported an ADHD student with study skills in my role within Disability and Inclusion at university. He needs structure and techniques, such as a calendar to manage his deadlines and workload and to help him prioritise. My son is also autistic and ‘not asking for help,’ was actually one of the traits which was evidence of his condition when the educational psychologist diagnosed him, so I can understand the profile.

I disagree. One of the main points of a degree, yes.

Please don’t take it as any criticism because it’s not. He seems stubborn and maybe tend to overestimate his abilities e.g. insisting he could manage with own laptop, not asking for support, or clarifications about feedback. It could be due to ADHD but you need to have a conversation with him. In real world in a job after university, he may not get multiple chances so he needs to get all the resources he can to complete his project or whatever he is doing.

Regarding him not getting DSA in times and only 1 session he needs to raise this with the university. Perhaps they would allow him to resist.

I would be astounded if the university does not have PCs that students can use, in several locations across the university.

I’m a first year course lead. I am not allowed to communicate with parents about students’ progress. We have an emergency procedure where a very senior member of staff can deal with parents in emergency situations, but not over submission of coursework etc. Something seems to have gone wrong regarding the provision of support, but if the student says everything is ‘fine’ it is very difficult for staff to provide support.

I have never encountered a student who refuses to use the library or who does not understand that private study is required. Many do very little, admittedly - but they know they should. What does he say when you tell him he should be following up references to academic resources given in reading lists/lectures, reading the work and making notes etc.?

I am autistic and did badly at uni the first time (I got a 2:2 in Physics, having got good GCSEs and A Levels). I wasn't diagnosed then (in fact I only realised I was autistic at 19, and didn't have self-awareness then anyway).

I mean the two abusive relationships during uni and the illness in my third year didn't help either, but it was mainly the unmet disability needs that were the issue.

I still don't know how to study independently (now 41, having done 2.5 uni-level courses and lots of others), and I never ask for help, and never use the library. So similar to your son in that regard. I also struggle with admin stuff (e.g. formatting and uploading assignments). But I do understand my needs better.

My other two courses (one in progress) were remote/online, which suited me much better than in person. And picking the right subject is also important (clearly maths is better for him). I got a distinction in my second one (a PGDip), and am getting distinctions so far in my current degree (another BSc) modules.

I did apply for DSA during my second course, and got a laptop and had some study skills sessions, which I used to go through assignments to check I'd understood what they were asking for (which is one of my major issues; not being sure what the question means). I haven't bothered with DSA this time though. Maybe that's one of the reasons he finds maths easier, because there are more likely to be clear right answers?

Obviously it would not be fair for him to be ejected. He needs proper support/adjustments in place, but maybe also to be realistic about switching courses. Especially if he can't engage with support, so the subject itself needs to be the one he finds most accessible in the first place.

I work with DSA students in a specialist role and unless they commit to more hourly meetings there is very little we can do.
I text/email 3 times to try to engage student and follow this up once a month to see if they require support HOWEVER uni students are classed as adults and there is only so much we can do.

Can you ask him to logon to the uni website and you have a look through his info (including emails) to find the names of the people you need?

The problem with this sort of appeal based on autism and adhd etc
Is that he has already been given three tries at passing a piece of work
Universities that are prepared to give students a retake ( nearly all) allow one in August for example He’s already had two retakes and with the best will in the world no student has a right to a pass just because they are a student

So why did he fail the first time

• extenuating circumstance needed with proof

why the second time

• ditto

why the third time

• ditto

Having autism and adhd can’t get over the fact he’s already been given more chances than most and the extenuating circumstances have to be very time specific. Did he give any for example when he failed the first and second times. I dont know about your sons Uni but I have experience of three and they only got a second shot at a failed piece and only if the fail was just below the pass grade.

@fluffythecat1 I assume that academic staff are unaware of his disability. He just sees the harsh feedback and spirals and doesn’t want to make it worse with ‘excuses’. I agree he clearly needs parental involvement but the uni does not make this easy.

@Pegsmum I will ask the disability support team if they have been liaising with personal tutor and go through them.

@beetr00he wants to continue his degree. There is no cover sheet - work is submitted via an online portal. I think I am getting the full story as he understands it but he has a communication disorder so can be way off the mark.

@AlwaysFreezing I don’t know whether he enjoys uni. He only goes onto campus when required. I don’t know whether I can convince him that he has to engage with support/disability services. He attends the local uni as he wants/needs to stay living at home. He has no plan B.

@LIZShe has engaged with the uni in that he attended all required lectures, classes etc. He just has not engaged with disability support because he wants not to need it. Of course he could have done things differently if he wasn’t autistic. And would have done things differently if he knew what to do. We have been trying to teach him to ask for help since primary! He doesn’t even recognise that he needs help. You first have recognise that you need help and then there is the social communication barrier. Are you suggesting that autistic DC should not attend uni? Not being confrontational - just wondering where he could fit in given his strengths and weaknesses.

@Tippertapperfeet it would never have occurred to him to ask the uni library to lend him a laptop.

@TinyTeachrthe lesson might be harsh for the average NT student but I thought that disability services were intended to level the playing field so that above average ability ND students didn’t fail because of admin issues and not being able to advocate for themselves?

@ToucanfusingformeI think he may have chosen the wrong degree course as engineering is career focused. I think the ‘pressure’ of uni relates to that rather than academic pressure. He is dismissive of his 1st in the maths element saying he didn’t even try and did no revision. At 6th form his teachers at a specialist maths college said he should apply to Oxbridge to study maths. He ignored them. I think he could easily cope with a maths degree and then maybe a masters and PhD. This would give him space and time for his brain to mature. Plus no one really expects uber social skills.

@Agapornis oh yes I put in the application in good time. But they then emailed him to arrange an appointment. I kept asking him had he heard. Turned out he had skim read an email and not replied immediately and then forgot about it. Maybe he didn’t want support or maybe he did forget. He was off his ADHD meds due to shortage so a toss up. Regardless there was no follow up and the ball was left in his court. Bad idea. This was why DSA support did not start til spring.

@Arlanymorits a support thing. He is autistic. Academically he is ready for university. As far as I am aware readiness for uni is assessed on academic achievement rather than life skills.

@Tippertapperfeet I can’t from the outset ‘talk on my son’s behalf’. He has to try and make things work for himself first and only when that fails can I be given consent by him to communicate with him.

l have to go now but will be back later. Thanks for all the responses.

Just read another comment of yours OP

As he hasn’t been given an option to resit this is more serious
No option and only a fail means things really haven’t been going well for him

Has he really told you all thats been going on
Has he been attending all the lectures

OP you mention that he may have used someone else's lab results. If this is the case this may be classed as academic malpractice and is treated very seriously. Could this be the reason he's not allowed to proceed to the next year?

You certainly could have been nominated from the start to talk on your son’s behalf. With his permission. But that definitely could have been in place from day one and before even then.

And he will have been told in lectures and seminars at the start of the year how to borrow a laptop.

@PocketSand Academic ability is certainly one part of it - but read any university website and they will all talk about helping young people to develop life skills - critical thinking, problem solving, building confidence, preparing to stand on their own two feet, how to engage with the world. Maybe Open University might be a better bet for him at this point alongside some volunteer work or paid work experience?

Also. Just to this

readiness for uni is assessed on academic achievement rather than life skills.

if this is what you think of uni you are doing your son a great disservice. And misunderstanding what university is about. A big part of uni is learning the life skills needed and developing them, with additional support where required. But being emotionally and “life skill” ready is every bit if not more important than the academic ability.

No not at all. Just that he seems to have missed out learning basic skills and strategies beforehand which would enable him to cope better with the demands of the course and uni life. A foundation year often bridges those gaps and offers a stepping stone to independent study. The mentor would also help him access such support, some unis provide it through sessions at the library or learning centre to any student regardless of additional need or none for example, and help keep him on track. But agree he needs to recognise his issues to access and engage with support. It is never going to be enough to just turn up for taught sessions.

OP, university isn't for everyone and I think the issue here is your son has not been able to display any independent study skills and lacks insight to realise this. I would consider not pursuing another two expensive years of university.

one thing is clear that the DSA system, and paperwork and getting mentor/help or letting Uni know you are struggling are ALL things ADHD people don’t do well.

ADHD students must easily fall thru the cracks,

University is about academic achievement but a big part of that is being scholarly and studying independently. It isn't about just being 'taught' - it's about being able to study and learn independently. If that basic skill isn't there, he will always struggle as no one is going to lead him through his degree. Disability support - yes. But not absolute management or even close to that. He will be academically able but he has to do it under his own steam at the end of the day. It sounds like he is nowhere near able to get through the course to be honest.

The problem is unis aren’t geared to teach life skills to students with ASD and ADHD as they are not specialists in the area. Particularly if the student is not willing to divulge the extent of their disability and ask for help.

It’s not clear whether this uni is not willing to engage with his suite of disabilities or whether they are not aware.

If he’s plagerised another students works the University will have identified that in their letter to him.
Surely.

An apprenticeship is not necessarily easier as he would have to work and study, we've had 2 ND staff members really, really struggle despite a huge amount of support from the uni and colleagues.

I really hope you can persuade him to consider a change to Maths, do you think the uni would support him in transferring courses? I am no expert but several of my family have studied engineering and it requires a lot of organisation and project management. It just doesn’t sound right for him, even though it might appeal to him, and it’s not as if he is likely to become a practicing engineer as that would also not match with his skills. Very difficult, I do sympathise with both of you.

It’s a learning curve for him - he thought it could wing it without disclosing the full extent of his disabilities - but they are too marked; without getting proper support in place and asking for help; without reading emails properly; without a laptop etc. He can’t - and that’s important information for him. As is the question as to whether engineering is an appropriate degree for him.

I think taking an engineering degree without needing to use a laptop would be impossible, disabled or not. How did he imagine he would cope without one.

DSA wouldn’t ‘persuade him.’ His study needs assessor will have recommend some software to help him overcome his disability related study issues and, if a student doesn’t already have a laptop suitable to run this software, one would be recommended for him. Most students are expected to need a laptop for their course nowadays, so it’s not like they just give away free laptops.

I think he should speak to the university to discuss his best options. Maybe they’ll let him repeat the year, providing he engages with his study support? Maybe he could suspend his studies for a year and learn more about what is expected of an undergraduate student. Or possibly he might decide to withdraw from this course and/or try a different subject.

Check the university website regarding appeals. He may be able to appeal on the basis that the required support was not in place. There is likely to be a time limit, so act fast.
Support your son to contact the Student Union to ask for help writing the appeal.
Support your son to contact the Programne Leader via email. Explain that he has extenuating circumstances, ask for an online meeting to discuss. Get him to say in the email that he wants you to be present at the meeting.
Same with Disability Services.
When you speak with them, make sure you have a coherent list of the issues relating to your son’s additional needs and why he didn’t ask for help.
Be clear that you are asking his previous assessment attempts be rolled back so that he can resit.
For information, if he is successful in appealing then he will likely have to sit out the year to resit the failed module as there may not be time/opportunity to make it up before the start of the new academic year.