Son not allowed to continue to second year at uni

[PocketSand]

DS2 has just completed his first year in an engineering degree. His results are all over the place from 1st in maths to 2:2 to required resits. He exceeded the A level grade requirements for MEng. He is autistic and has ADHD. He was un medicated prior to and during most of his first year due to shortages followed by referral to cardiology.

His DSA support didn't start til the spring term and one support worker provided 1 hour support when 30 hours was approved. He constantly tells the one he has seen that everything is fine and they believe him.

He always says everything is fine and doesn't ask for help. He has never been to the library and relies totally on lecture notes. He doesn't know what independent study is. I have always been his advocate but now he is expected to advocate for himself. No one at the uni knows these issues - he has not even contacted his personal tutor let alone disability services and just thinks he needs to work harder.

He found out today that he has failed his third submission of a lab report he initially submitted in February. He did not have DSA agreed support at that time so he didn’t have his own laptop. He borrowed another student’s at the time but when he had to resubmit no longer had access to his results and so he tried to cobble together a report using specimen (and maybe someone else’s results - not clear). He had previously received an email saying he couldn’t proceed unless he passed resubmission. I assume that’s where we are at now.

His feedback is harsh - shouldn’t study for a degree if not prepared to use feedback to improve his work. Trouble is he often doesn’t understand the feedback and he is unwilling to ask for clarification as he fears tutor’s anger. He says he doesn’t know who marked the work so doesn’t know who to talk to and seems generally clueless about most administrative issues.

I feel completely in the dark and don’t know where to go from here. Obviously I don’t want to just give up and accept his journey ends here as it seems very unfair but don’t know what I can do to try and enable him to fix this or if it can be fixed.

Can anyone who knows the system provide advice on next steps please?

I thought the same. It’s very worrying then if it stops before 25, just because they make it to university.

@PocketSand I think you are doing an amazing job with your son. This post is a bit long but I hope you read it and dont repeat my struggles mistakes

He sounds very similiar to my son, eg great Maths skills, not writing enough discussion, losing marks even when he knows the subject, misunderstanding critical emails, missing hand in dates, not aware how much help he needs, always slightly immature compared to peers etc. I helped him revise, spent ages liaising with disability support, and he eventually got an average BEng degree, but nowadays thats not enough to get an engineering job, so the whole thing was a very expensive mistake.

Engineeing courses seem to require an above average maturity and self-organisation. It will only get harder in second and third year, with less and less new maths involved. The masters year is mainly subjects like law and project management, with a long thesis requiring lots of discussion.

Perhaps, instead of struggling to overcome things he finds difficult, he could take a step back and focus on his strong point, Maths.

From what you have said he wants to do engineering, but you recognise he'd be better doing Maths. You might need to insist, let him know you are immensely proud of him for the effort he has put in, ( I would be!) but it turns out that a maths degree would suit his skills better. There will be more interesting varied maths, fewer lectures, probably no labs, less discussions to write, more free time to rest and enjoy life. There are joint courses where he could do another subject with maths if that is of interest.

Maybe you could visit the potential maths department, to see what the course involved, and the fascinating jobs a maths degree can lead to, including many with software and analysis, so similar to the bits of engineering he enjoys and got good marks.

It may be difficult for ASD person to change, but it would be worth it in the long run, I wish I had known.

It sounds like, and I say this from a place of honesty not meanest and as a uni lecturer and apprenticeship coach, that he isn't suited to degree level study and should rethink his career plans.

Even with all the support (which I recognise may have not been fully implemented), ADHD and neurodivergent students will struggle. Sometimes it just doesn't work if we can't bend ourself to what the world expects - the world won't always bend to us.

My daughter had undiagnosed ADHD, a very unstable background, and extreme anxiety. She is also very stubborn. I supported and advocated for her until she was 18, although trying to hand some responsibility over to her, and suggest that this was her life, not mine.

At GCSE because of lack of attendance due to anxiety, she did not make the grades for A levels. As a result she did a BTech in childcare and realised this was an area she was passionate about and great with children.

After 18 I really did push responsibility back to her. If she didn't try to communicate her needs then this was not the right setting for her.

Completely different from your son, apart from the fact that he is letting you take the responsibility for his refusal to address his needs. If he cannot even begin to take on that, then I would suggest university is not the place for him at the moment. More important than academic achievement, is growth in life skills. If you are the one compensating for his failure to address his needs, then he is not growing.

After a certain point, he has to take some responsibility for his actions or lack of actions. I do understand that the progress towards this may be slow. But, however academically gifted he is, it doesn't sound like he is growing in independence and personal responsibility, and I would class this as more important than academic success.

This. Definitely..

But if that is an option op ds needs to try to resolve the situation asap, ideally before Results Day next week, to secure a place. Op, is it a three or four year degree course? Does it offer any placements or has ds previously contacted Lotus or other potential employers to ask about internships or work experience?

BUT all the work and study MUST be done in working hours, is very supported and managed, and with appropriate employer support is typically more achievable for ND learners.

They literally are due to the EA 2010!

Bad employer and Provider if not.

From what I’ve read, your son wants to work in automotive engineering. Because he’s autistic, he’s likely to think that means he must get an MEng.

At this point I’d say that you need to get some advice from within the industry, because it’s likely that Maths or Maths/Physics will be very acceptable for some roles. And if he’s getting graded First for some courses and failing others then the blunt truth is: he’s on the wrong degree. You know it, but it’s persuading him that there’s an alternative route to what he currently wants.

He’s possibly also at the wrong university. Yes, it means he’s still at home and so not having to cope with an entire new environment, but if he’s at the university I think he is, there are other uni’s that would cope better with his needs.

See if he can defer for a year so he can mature, possibly get some work experience in the industry and have time to look at alternatives.

This is what his study needs assessment report is for. They look at what can be provided to help a student overcome his or her disability related study needs, eg software, non-medical help. The student really does need to engage with the recommendations and make best use of the support.

The needs assessment report does not cover anything medical at all, though.

Also a possibility - look at a foundation course which teaches study skills. If he does want to have another go at an MEng, something like the Open University’s foundation Engineering courses might be good preparation. They tend to assume the students don’t necessarily know how to study and will need to be taught time management, study techniques and library search skills.

First year is the easiest. Have a chat with your son and see if he really wants to continue on this course. Like previously suggested, maybe Maths might be more suitable? You don’t want him to continue, if he may fail. Work to his strengths and he will flourish. I had no involvement at all with my kids at uni. Studying techniques are developed at A level and as adults, they need to navigate the challenges themselves. He needs to look for the support, not have his mother doing it for him. When he gets a job, you won’t be able to keep popping in to demand things on his behalf.

No advice, but offering a HTH. My son is high-functioning autistic according to his (very brief) private assessment, though I’m almost 110% certain he has ADHD, which is what we got referred for in the process, but wasn’t flagged. However, as a late diagnosed teen, I felt that the test was age inappropriate, and… well, I have to live with him.

He got through high school with difficulty, but college is a whole different ball game.

The support is there in terms of a laptop, life coaching etc. but it doesn’t really get to the crux of the problem because laptops and extra time don’t help you if you can’t concentrate for longer than 30 seconds without getting distracted by dismantling your pen. We live in a frighteningly NT world withers people make all the right noises about ASD and ADHD, but the reality is endless waiting lists, an inability to prescribe things that might help with the right diagnosis, and a lot of parents tearing their hair out because it’s the most isolating and soul-destroying experience in the world.

i’m fairly convinced my boy will live at home until he’s 47, because he can’t life without assistance, though I think I might have moved out by then.

Sending lots of love and empathy.

We've just been given an EHCP. I was always told it was til he was 25, but school told me a while back that it's only for further education, not higher education. That's been backed up from other official sources, however our EHCP keyworker was adamant it included uni and was shocked when I showed her it only covers FE

There is no way my ASD son would be able to advocate for himself without parental support. I know they need to stand on their own two feet eventually, but it’s a totally different ballgame when you’re dealing with neurodiversity.

Having an ASD child, often times means watching helplessly whilst your child is not understood for who they really are (which they only share in their safe space) and the challenges that exist because the world is not inclusive.
This is multiplied when they're legally adults, as the people who truly know them cannot advocate for them.

Yes, authorisation+ contact disability support. Exactly what you already know. He's lucky to have you...have his back. All along...and now and always. 😍😘🤗

It sounds as if he has several grounds to appeal OP. Support not in place, and off his meds seem like the main ones. There will be an appeals process with a deadline so he needs to get onto it.

Apologies if

• it has been suggested already
• it isn't helpful

but what about studying with the Open University? It solves the 'must stay at home' problem and (as someone who did a BA and an MA with them on retirement, they were great).

www.open.ac.uk/courses/engineering/degrees

You may not like what I am writing, but have you thought that it might be better if you gave up the university idea? Whether they are marking students down because the student does not have the ability, or that the state of universities at the moment is such that students are leaving university with degrees and cannot find work when they leave, I don't know, but it was announced on the news only yesterday that thousands of students are leaving university and going straight onto benefits, with little hope of ever paying their loans and being in debt for life.

All those students were hopeful, and yet, despite achieving degrees, they are unable to find work. University is not proving successful for employment. It was also said on the news that the emphasis on degrees is not proving successful, that students are better off going for jobs with their A levels from school.

You are naturally disappointed that your DS cannot return to university for another year, but you can turn that around to his benefit. If there are no apprenticeships available for him in your area, and there are no relatives who can take him in where there are apprenticeships, your best bet is to sit down together and discuss what he is interested in.

It is better for him not to set his heart on earning a high salary, because that would mean a high position which may prove too much for him. He must have had some very good grades at A level to be able to go to university last year, so he is obviously able, and that is what you must concentrate on: what he can do with his school A levels.

You need to lower his and your sights, and aim for something which is not too stressful for him. You could find him another uni place, but he could still leave with no job to go to.

Absolutely

I suggest contacting the university's mental health officer, they should have one or at least someone who liaises with the students and parents on special needs. As the mother of a child with autism who studied at university, I think your son needs to be made to understand that he can only continue with support. It could be put to him that once he understands what he needs to do, he will probably need less support. My son had a DSA but did not need to see a support worker more than once a month. He also got a free basic laptop which was fine for his student needs.Communication with the university as a first step is really key though. And yes, your son does need to give you permission to talk to people.

Hi, I really feel for you and for him. Ignore all the negative people here.
i think the ADHD is the main problem… no executive functioning and an immaturity to recognising what the issues are. Some ADHD brains have particular areas of executive functioning which never fully mature so you can get a 1st in maths but have the emotional stability and executive functioning of a kid in primary school.
its a very common ADHD thing to say everything is fine. The brains looks for the quickest way out of a situation and saying everything is fine to a counsellor is the easiest answer.
it breaks my heart that an intelligent person may not be able to achieve what they deserve to because the uni doesn’t have the right support in place. This degree is the gateway to progress in life as hes clearly intelligent so I hope you can find a way to help.
realiy understanding what parts of his executive functioning he struggles with the most will give you the best chance to support him. That level of detail will help you tailor plans to guide him and know where his stumbling blocks are. This will also help lay the foundation for his working life.
sending you and your son best wishes

I don’t know why his school didn’t pass on info that your son has autism/ADHD. My son has Asperger’s (level one autism) and his school provided the university with all relevant information, as did my son himself. I believe he had to send proof, so I scanned his CHAMS diagnosis. He has a mentor he met with weekly to start with, then it went to fortnightly, at my son’s request. My son is studying Games Development, is about to start his 2nd year, and also loves his Maths. He also attends one of the local universities and still lives at home.

I hope your son manages to talk to the university and continues his course!

The best place to start would be his university’s Students Advice Service for independent advice and guidance on the university’s procedures.

You could also check the university’s website for information on procedures and policies regarding matters such as examination allowances, mitigating circumstances, appeal processes, and so on. There’s always something useful there.

He should not give up on his studies.

It will by this point be completely out of the hands of whatever tutor marked it. If he's received a letter such as this, the marks have already been ratified by the exam board. Go straight to the programme/ course leader. He might not know who this is, but you can easily find out if he's given you access to his VLE (online learning environment) where you'll be able to find his programme handbook. Or go straight to academic appeals (will be a central uni dept), who will be able to clarify the process of how you either appeal or what his options are re. retaking the year (retaking with or without attendance)