Another year online?

[Ellewoods20]

Despite the easing of restrictions in June, some universities have informed students that lectures will remain online in the next academic year. What’s the point? :(

Thanks titchy - yes those publications. I was interested in that there is so much variation in how unis have handled things and what it all means for sept.

@Newgirls

Thanks titchy - yes those publications. I was interested in that there is so much variation in how unis have handled things and what it all means for sept.

I think the variation is largely a result of the different types of programmes and types of student. Imperial for instance is pretty much all Science, and UAL all arts, so I'd expect them to be doing much more in person than say LSE which is mostly able to deliver online. (My assumptions note - I don't actually know what they're doing.) A campus based uni will have different options available to it than one which has buildings all over a city. One which recruits mainly commuter students has a different set of student needs to cater for than one which recruits mainly 18 year olds who live in halls. And of course Scotland, NI and Wales are operating under different sets of rules entirely!

And of course in the early days there were local lockdowns - Uni of Leicester I think was particularly badly hit.

@Stirmecrazy Can anyone let me know if this is happening at their uni.

Yes, my son has had modules where the lecturer gave a "live" introduction for a couple of minutes and then put on last year's recorded lectures from a lecture theatre, and apparently that "counts" as a live lecture, simply because of the couple of minutes "live" introduction. The lecturer doesn't even return to do a "live" summary at the end. Some other modules haven't even had the "live" intro, just the ability to watch last year's lectures whenever the student wants.

It really does seem that there's a huge amount of difference between different Unis and even different lecturers.

@AllThatisSolid

they're expecting students (most of whom live near campus but off site) to go to the campus for 1 or 2 tutorials/seminars per day, but then rush back to their accommodation to sit and watch the lectures in between? How's that going to work?

Don't be daft. If we still have to do some lectures online, they'll be recorded and downloadable. So your fantasy of students "running back home" is just that - a fantasy!

My students liked me doing a couple of 20-30 minute introductions to our topics each week - it was clear from their seminar discussions, that they watched them & learnt from them - they asked questions, or raised points, based on my recorded introductions. It meant we could use the seminar time to get down to a detailed exploration of their thinking on that week's topic.

Not all students are lucky enough to have engaged lecturers who top and tail sessions - and learning online seriously compromises access to learning for students with ASD and ADHD - especially recorded lectures with dull voices and poor audio visual stimuli.

Big lectures are almost certain to be online. It’s impossible to have social distancing in a packed lecture theatre, so if restrictions come back in force it causes problems.

Smaller classes will be f2f either all the time or some of the time. We are planning for some restrictions to either still be in place/be reintroduced and are trying to plan so scheduled f2f won’t be affected.

Afaik, libraries and student study spaces have been open for all students whenever possible throughout. Also some labs, but those have been mostly for researchers and post grads.

I think unis will be reconsidering the big lecture model going forwards. All lectures were recorded and available online anyway and a packed lecture theatre isn’t a sociable place. Lots of teaching takes place in smaller groups and I suspect space to be repurposed.

@kazzyhoward I am blown away by this revelation. I honestly thought lecturers were doing live lectures online at least. I was annoyed before at the lack of F2F but could understand it. I think it is reprehensible that present year students are not even getting fresh material rehashed for online medium. I am sure lecturers upthread have said that online material is produced in a completely different manner and loads have been talking about the extra workload of producing this so some lecturers are defiantly doing this but shouldn’t all lecturers be as a baseline Can any lecturers on this thread advise what their policy is on this .
My DD has just shown me one and the quality is shocking with all the external noise of talking etc . She has also said that in some cases she is not even getting the lecture but just loads of PDF’s! This has ramped up since January (first term was ok with lots of fresh online material)
I am desperate for my DD to complain but she is worried about personal implications for her in regards to her degree. I think a lot of students feel this and are not happy but feel they can’t complain for fear of effectively being blackmarked
I honestly think a lot of lecturers on here have no idea how bad it has been for some students and how low the level of teaching interaction has been on some courses across the country . For online teaching a baseline needs to be established so students can at least be confident the quality of the online lecture is within guidelines especially if this is going to be the new norm because there is a massive divergence between online lecture produced for that medium and a group of pdf slides!

This is what Bristol are officially saying. Sounding more positive than what my poor DD's lecturers said. Think I've learned to see what happens and then get mad (although DD was so upset). And to not believe what the staff say as they might not even know the official line 😊

thetab.com/uk/bristol/2021/04/22/exclusive-bristol-uni-planning-to-scrap-social-distancing-for-september-45503

Unis also need to cater for overseas students - many of whom cannot physically return to the uk.

@titchy so record the lectures or live stream them 🤷‍♀️. And dial them in to tutorials and seminars. The majority of students can't wait forever for them to return.

Oh and for the record and certainly not that it matters my DD is at a RG university. Her best friend also at a RG university (the same one our universities minister attended) has also just confirmed she is also getting last years lectures streamed not fresh material (she has complained)

@Stirmecrazy that is ridiculous. What on earth are they paying for ? And yet they'll be expected to get the same levels in exams as previous years, even though they've had much less chance to ask questions and be taught. Videos are not teaching, not as I know it anyway.

[quote mumsneedwine]@titchy so record the lectures or live stream them 🤷‍♀️. And dial them in to tutorials and seminars. The majority of students can't wait forever for them to return.[/quote]
I agree the 1% can’t return so we have to maintain online for the other 99% is surely a weak argument . As you said just stream online concurrently.

@Stirmecrazy should try that at school. Sorry one person is away so you all have to go home because it's not fair I teach the rest of you without them 😂😂.

How are student going to meet other students on their courses if only seminars and practicals are F2F?

DD has made several friends on her course from meeting them at lectures. She doesn't have the same seminars or lab practicals with them and wouldn't have met them if it weren't for the lectures.

@RampantIvy they're not. Much like this year.

@mumsneedwine the more cynical side of me actually thinks that @FHOJfinf18 made a comment above about uni numbers being constrained by lecture theatre size capacity I believe this is why unis are so keen to stay online as they can increase Uni numbers
The problem is that our children didn’t sign up for this they signed up to live lectures and it looks like the quality of online is not regulated so students are experiencing a massive divergence in quality

@Stirmecrazy it is a bit suspicious that all Unis seem to suddenly have too small lecture theatres 😏. But can continue to increase course sizes.
I can't believe that students won't be complaining v hard and loudly come Sept if this mess continues. They've taken it this year as the rules said they had to, but if everywhere else is back to normal then I hope they cause merry hell.

To be honest the quality of on campus teaching isn't always regulated either.
I suspect if those offering crap online lecturers weren't delivering the most amazing on campus lectures either.

[quote mumsneedwine]@Stirmecrazy it is a bit suspicious that all Unis seem to suddenly have too small lecture theatres 😏. But can continue to increase course sizes.
I can't believe that students won't be complaining v hard and loudly come Sept if this mess continues. They've taken it this year as the rules said they had to, but if everywhere else is back to normal then I hope they cause merry hell. [/quote]
ALL universities???

@DelBocaVista whoops. Sorry. I know yours is doing well (would love to know where you are so I can tell all my year 13s to head your way).
Some Unis. Not all.

[quote mumsneedwine]@DelBocaVista whoops. Sorry. I know yours is doing well (would love to know where you are so I can tell all my year 13s to head your way).
Some Unis. Not all.[/quote]
I'm at a post 92 institution in the north of England - definitely not a Mumsnet favourite 😂

@DelBocaVista no favourites in my school. We send them everywhere ! You may have seen I'm not an Oxbridge/London fanatic 😂

@Ellewoods20

Despite the easing of restrictions in June, some universities have informed students that lectures will remain online in the next academic year. What’s the point? :(

There is no guarantee at all that everything will be normal from June. In fact the Boris backtracking has already begun. He sent Dominic Raab out to say that things like masks and SDing might continue after June 21.

@DelBocaVista

To be honest the quality of on campus teaching isn't always regulated either. I suspect if those offering crap online lecturers weren't delivering the most amazing on campus lectures either.

Yes but the point is they are not offering online lectures they are streaming last years on campus lecture! And you are right some of them are not very good but made even worse by the fact they are catered for a live lecture audience not catering for an online audience. So basically this years students are being given regurgitated material which was produced for a different kind of audience last year . Where is the value for money here and do you not feel this worthy of complaint?