How involved should you be once child at uni

[swimmer4]

Son isn’t revising for exams. Do we say anything?

Notifying someone to make a check doesn't breach any rules about confidentiality that should have read - because it's a one way input of info, which no-one would ignore. But that's for very serious concerns.

I've dived in a car on more than one occasion Needmoresleep, if that helps.

"Millicent you're making assumptions which it might be better that you didn't."
I made no assumptions. You, on the other hand did.

Millicent you made the assumption that I am spouting nonsense from a position of ignorance. MN doesn't require every poster to bare their soul.

Stranger, it did!

I saw a lot of the M4 last term. It is a long way to go to have a mooch round TKMaxx followed by a blow out at Nandos, but my instinct was that 'normal' was what was needed.

So a simple answer is that you dont stop being involved when a family member is at University (if anything the sibling relationship seems to have got stronger because of shared experience and mentoring). The more difficult question is what a parent can do if they sense a crisis.

"Millicent you made the assumption that I am spouting nonsense from a position of ignorance"
No I didn't. You made the assumption that other posters thought their children's mental health issues could be addressed with flowers, chocolates and a chat. I pointed out that you might be wrong in that assumption.

I've said repeatedly that sometimes nothing can touch those in a crisis which is very different from assuming people on this thread think chocolates can!

Yes quite, it's an exceptionally difficult one Needmoresleep.

You have to try and talk, don’t you? If the young person will let you in. That’s the big problem I feel. There is no guarantee that they will be able to do this with a parent or anyone else. I too would have been available had I known I was needed. When both of mine did have problems, neither told anyone! No-one. Friends definitely had an inkling but no adult who could have helped was involved. When DD1 was having difficulties, it was largely caused by a teacher! There was no way around that.

Yes Bubbles, but MN is a bit like this as well. The way you tell it, your DD is having a ball surrounded by all her boarding mates. In contrast, DD hestiated for far too long about asking for a move, partly because she felt admitting that she could not handle it would be admitting failure. After all University is meant to be such fun, everyone is having a wonderful time, and the minor inconveniences like no sleep and the normality of drug use, are part and parcel of the experience.

I know she is not alone because others have PM'd me. One whose DD was on the verge of droppng out of the same course for the same reasons. And DD is lucky because she likes her course, her University and the City. Not enjoying the course and so having even less reason to perserve would be hell and potentially very isolating. And I suspect it is common for unhappiness to be masked by behaviour (not engaging in studies, too much partying) that might be mistaken for the underlying problem.

I am not sure young people really reach out. The lesson we learned perhaps was the importance of the safe and familiar. Home, no demands, favourite food, repeats of Suits or Grey's Anatomy, and a chance to gain perspective. And then, and only then, some gentle probing into what might be wrong. DD reckons it was a big mistake not to come home at all in her first term. Things are a lot better now, but she is still treating herself to a couple of days home, before her exams. And luckily she is not too far away and can afford to do so.

One life lesson is that when you are in a hole, you need to stop digging. But to do that you also have recognise in the first place that you are in the hole.

I have a sibling who works with MH patients. From this and other experience I think that e.g. depression etc is very insidious in that it creeps up on people. I would not say to OP at all that not revising is a symptom of e.g. depression, it may be as not sleeping , sleeping too much may be , avoiding lectures may be . But University I think is a strange kind of limbo between being a school child and an adult & if there are people about who can spot when a person is not behaving as themselves , that is a good thing. I have a son at Oxford and you cannot close a loo door or walk down a corridor without seeing a poster which offers help / welfare etc. But there is a difference between seeing it and thinking you need it. Or maybe sometimes people choose the wrong course and find it hard to admit it , or find living on their own hard , or take being away from home a bit too far , or or or . Not sure supportive ( rather than pushy) parents are a problem . Anyway I wish your DS well. Depending on his year then if it is just that he isn't putting enough work in, a conversation may work as to what his options are after his degree. If he is not doing enough work in 1st year ( and no degree marks count) and the next 2 are more important , well he may shape up, after the first flush . If you suspect a deeper problem - well different.

I think you have to let him know you are there OP and be as involved as he will let you. I was concerned by lack of revision in Year 2, so threatened to drive to the UK with a sleeping bag and camp out in the sitting room of his shared house to ensure revision, proper nutrition and to take the PS4 away.

Ds got the message and a First for his BA.

I know when something is up as he will ring me to talk to a real adult (his words) and there will be something in his tone that I pick up on. I do whatever he needs, from reading essays and making suggestions about paragraph order, thrust of the argument etc, to proof reading his dissertation, or being a general sounding board for things.

Ds was away from 16, as he went to sixth for in the UK, so university wasn't a shock to the system. What does floor him at times is the whole notion of being adult, and the myriad of things this entails. Mind you, that still gets me at times, and I'm 52. I think that we are so used to being adult and dealing with all the stuff one has to, that we forget this is the first time for them. I remember having to explain how to pay the water rates, and the gas bill to him, as he had never had to deal with any of that before. It can be things like that, which to us are second nature, that trips the kids up.

Ds is currently doing his MA, and I still have to kick him on the occasion to get his arse in gear. He talks a good game, but turning that into action is sometimes his problem, as is the inability to have two or three things on the go at once.

OP, have you given your DS the option of dropping out of this year and then restarting his second year. He could even have a year out if his mental health needed it, or if he just needed some time to get himself together and decide whether he definitely wants to do the course. If he has genuinely got problems and is unlikely to achieve even close to what he is capable of, then this is a very realistic option.

Oddly, I have found that with universities it is generally more advantageous to the students overall degree score if they do not sit the exams and then retake them. Retaking exams often means the overall score for the year is capped. Dropping out before exams typically allows the entire years results to be scrapped and the year redone without any score capping. It also allows for students to revaluate their choice in degree course/university/employment.

It will mean your DS has a larger student loan to pay off and that fees will need to be paid again, however if you are genuinely wanting to help your son, this is an option you and he should be aware of (and check with his university for certainty!) and consider alongside the other available choices.

I do whatever he needs, from reading essays and making suggestions about paragraph order, thrust of the argument etc, to proof reading his dissertation, or being a general sounding board for things.

See, I find this mental. Is this at masters level?! It should be 100% his own work by now, surely? At what point does he do his own work? Will you reorder his presentations when he's working? Proofread his emails?

Well, he could equally get comments from peers, boss, and it'd not stop it being his own work? Unless the parent is a specialist in the field, of course.

IME the problem with a parent offering comments from reading essays etc., is that (again, unless parent is a current specialist in the field), these suggestions tend to do more harm than good. 'My dad told me never to use the passive' or 'my mum thought it would sound better to write in the third person'. Or, 'my mum did English Lit for her degree and she says ...'.

I remember it being the most demoralising thing, as a student, when my dad would insist on reading my essays and offering 'just a comment ...'. Which would then descend into an argument where he'd insist he must be right, or he'd claim that no one would understand me because I was saying something far too improbable/too obscure/simply illogical. In fact, I wasn't any of those things, and god knows why I listened to someone who'd given up the subject years ago. But I did, because he thought it was appropriate to 'help' in this way.

Now I am a teacher at university level, I am very wary of students who claim their parents offer helpful comments. Yes, it's good to have someone read your drafts or proofread or be a sounding board. But it's much better for that someone to be a peer, who will 1) know a bit about the subject as it is currently taught and 2) won't have a parent's arrogant assumption that s/he can, but of course, help a student with a degree s/he never studied, or studied years ago.

LRD - absolutely

Bosswitch I proofed his dissy for mistakes - spelling, syntax, punctuation. It was all his own work. I proof read MA dissertations for non native English speakers, so it was no issue to do this for ds for his BA. I have proofed my db's MA dissy and dh's as well. No comment was offered on factual content, just clarification on what was meant, when it wasn't clear, and (in ds's case) where it was leading. As ds won the departmental prize for his dissy last year it must presumably have been OK.

I might suggest that paragraphs makes more sense in 'x' order, but it's up to ds if he takes that suggestion or not.

As for reading his essays, that is usually after they'd been marked and returned, as ds wanted to know what I thought of it, or I'll ask to read something to show that I am actually interested in what he is doing.

He is wary of letting a peer proof read his work, especially in light of the plagiarism that does go on, and most of them were also writing theirs at the same time. I had the time, so I did it.

The sounding board bit is not always related to academics - it can be letting off steam about things, or a general rant about life, or that he isn't sure how to approach something, and wants some advice. Isn't that what parents are for?