Oxbridge Entry 2015

[Roisin]

Do we have a thread already?
ds1 has decided to definitely apply to Oxford to do Biochemistry. He will probably apply to St John's.

I feel for you webwiz. I am so glad that dd's has gone as I think she could keep faffing around with it until next year if she was allowed. Which college is your ds applying to?

Anyone know if you have to complete the payment section before sending it for references to be added or is that done just before pressing the final submit button?

We did it before it went to the school Decorhate.

Thanks

DD is applying for music, MrsBartlet. Does that mean she can spend quite a bit of space on her extra curricular activities?

I am not sure what books she should be reading as extension reading. Would it be OK for her to talk about her musical activities, and then talk about academic interests in relation to her other subjects? Or is she supposed to demonstrate a wider academic interest in music per se?

Any thoughts on how best to balance music and academic interersts would be welcome.

I don't know about music RandomFriend. Dd is applying for English but the advice that they were all given was that 75% of the PS should be on things to do with the subject that they are applying for (including demonstrating reading beyond the curriculum) and 25% on other things (ie their other subjects and extra curricular activities). Can her music teacher advise her?

I would imagine that she should show evidence of extra reading about music outside of the curriculum but I am only going on what dd is doing for English and music could be a whole different ball game. Hopefully someone will be along with some knowledge of this!

Randomfriend - given that the Oxford Music course includes a significant performance element, it's not just theory or history, then your dd's music performance extra curric are relevant and important and should be given weight.

Phew! ds1 has paid and submitted. :D

His predicted grades have been finalised as has his tutor reference. So he just needs a meeting with his tutor at school this week to agree it's all OK, for them to attach the reference and grades and press the big red button!

Advice please - dd2 has been advised to apply for Oxford. Her comprehensive school doesn't even appear on the list of schools that have had applicants in past. She rang the admission office & they encouraged her to apply. (Although she has two other universities which she loves if she doesn't get an interview)

She has to sit a HAT test (which looks mind boggling) and go into an interview (no idea what to expect). Should she get some help with any of this? Any advice?

Littleham - Oxfor do a lot of pre-testing, which is what the HAT test is. There's lots of information on it on the web here: www.history.ox.ac.uk/prospective/undergraduate/applying/the-history-aptitude-test.html

She needs to submit her UCAS form by 15 Oct (that means all her but incl personal statement) completed and submitted AND the school predictions and reference completed and submitted. This is a final, absolute and immoveable deadline.

For this reason many schools want early applicant (Oxbridge and VetMed) submitted to them by end of Sep, so she needs to get moving.

In addition to the UCAS form, she also needs to register for the HAT test.

What do you want to know?

Thanks, I've forwarded that link to her (she says thanks too).

She is registered for the HAT test already. She has written her PS & it has been checked by teachers. Just waiting approval of Head of Sixth form (meeting next week) & then she is ready to submit the UCAS form. She has seen two of her subject references, so they seem to be writing those. Her predictions have been set at A A A (but might be a bit ambitious to achieve / who knows if she will get those grades?)

She wants to know -
How likely is it that she will get an interview?
What mark do you need to get in the aptitude test?
Is there anything specific she should aim to include?
What is looked for in the interview?
Will a lot of other candidates have special training for the test & interview?

It seems a bit of a long shot to me, but I guess she has four other choices anyway, so if she wastes one application it won't matter.

Oxbridge tend to interview a high percentage of candidates. If your GCSEs are high (8 A or A, mostly A), your predicted grades are at least at the level of the standard offer, or higher, and your AS levels are similar, then you are likely to get an interview. Cambridge rely more heavily on actual marks achived at AS.

Loads of info available on the web, including videos of interviews. Interviews are largely academy, they want to see your interest in and ability for the subject.

No idea about HAT, sorry.

ds1 will have a mock intervew at school (biochemistry), but no other special training or preparation.

HTH

Thanks for the information Roisin. She should qualify on the GCSE's, so I hope she gets an interview. She would be really chuffed if she did!

Good luck to your ds1 for biochemistry.

Littleham which subject is your DD considering - History?, although I may have that mixed up with another thread. Is she only considering Oxford rather than Cambridge, and if she is being pushed by the school is their only logic relative geographic proximity, as opposed to best fit course? Cambridge put more emphasis on AS (actual scores not just grades) and tend to interview a higher proportion of applicants than Oxford - something around 80% for Cambridge. Cambridge seem to have more reliance on interviews than any pre-application tests, and many colleges, for Humanities subjects at least, just want recent written work.

Hi boys3.

She is applying for History & the school were encouraging her to try for either (they were not sure which was best, although Oxford is closer as we live in the SW), so she rang both admissions departments & Oxford were way more encouraging. She has to submit an essay.

It is possibly more likely that a meteorite will land in our back garden than her ending up with an offer (or even an interview) from Oxford, but I am very proud of her for having the sheer gumption to give it a try! Think I will be more terrified than her if she gets an interview, so have come on this thread for some moral support as this is outside my comfort zone.

Fortunately, she also loves other universities & is realistic.

she has nothing to lose and all to gain - or at least the opportunity - so best of luck to her!

Littleham there are considerable differences between Oxford and Cambridge. Even if your daughter has made her choice perhaps you should explain to her school that Cambridge interviews everyone with a reasonable chance of admission, Oxford doesn't. Cambridge requires high ums at AS level and is better for late developers, Oxford focuses more on GSCE and suits those with a lot of A GSCE. Cambridge takes a high percentage of those applicants who go on to get 3AS and above, Oxford either is not as good at picking out these people or looks for other things. If your daughter is predicted A*s at A2 and has good AS ums she would get an interview at Cambridge and would have a good chance of a place, Oxford is less predictable. Cambridge central admissions aren't always very good, better to talk to admissions tutors.

Too late for your daughter but I wish more schools told their pupils about this shadowing scheme for those wondering whether to apply www.applytocambridge.com/shadowing/ The shadows generally have a good time, although there is a bit of a problem with medicine. I think they weren't allowed to attend dissection and therefore weren't always with the student they shadowed.

Advice on Cambridge history www.hist.cam.ac.uk/prospective-undergrads/apply-to-cambridge She may find some you tube videos of interviews.

Yes some people do get a great deal of help with interviews, personal statements and tests but despite claims from the companies selling such services I don't think there is any real evidence that they help.

Thanks alreadytaken. Didn't know about this information (or the shadowing scheme), so I'll let her know & check whether she talked to Cambridge central admissions or the History department. She got over 90% in her History AS and similar in her second subject, but I don't think she will get higher than an A in her third one, so that may have been the problem for Cambridge. Might make her borderline for both places - don't really know.

What 'other things' does Oxford look for?

Your last paragraph is reassuring.

This is interesting: "In the last admissions round, the average Cambridge applicant scored about 90 per cent on this measure, while the average successful Cambridge applicant scored nearer 95 per cent. Note that both these figures are averages – applicants don’t need to have achieved a certain score in every module and aren’t required to achieve 90 per cent or above in all modules. There were successful Cambridge applicants who had UMS averages in their best/most relevant three subjects below 90 per cent."

www.study.cam.ac.uk/undergraduate/apply/requirements/thefacts.html

Littleham I have two Oxford History DC. One has just completed a masters there too and is starting a PhD. Don't worry about ASs for Oxford, your DDs ASs are fine and over 90% in that sort of subject is great, especially with this year's odd marking.

For the HAT she can do no more than look at the website and the advice it gives there. Don't touch any 'Oxbridge' companies with a bargepole. She'll need around 62 in the HAT to get an interview, if GCSEs are average for Oxford (very very rough rule of thumb). In other words, a low 2.1, as the HAT is marked along undergraduate lines.

It's worth knowing that different colleges interview differently for History, so she might want to look into which ones do a conversation type interview based on the coursework she's handed in and her PS, which ones give you an extract on the day, which ones send a vast tract to read a day or two ahead etc. Of course they can always mix it up - nothing is certain :)

Good luck!

The average HAT score for an offer is a few marks higher. But these are only averages of course.

Littleham, my son is also reading History at Oxford. He absolutely loves it, if that's any help! Cambridge interview more people, yes, but I believe I'm right in saying that if you get an interview at Oxford you have a 40% chance of an offer (across all subjects, don't know if it's markedly different for History) whereas it's not such a good chance at Cambridge.

The other big difference in the interviews is that Oxford invite all interviewees to stay in their first choice college for at least one night (often three). This is helpful in giving them a better idea of what the place is like. Applicants who aren't going to get an offer from their first choice college may get an interview at a second college and this is all done during that residential period, so when you get your letter in early January with the outcome of the application, it's a final answer - 'Yes' from your first choice college, 'Yes' from another college or 'No'. (Very, very rarely apparently it's 'Yes, you've definitely got a place, but we'll tell you the college in August'.)

At Cambridge there are two rounds of interviews, so when their letters are sent out in early Jan, the answer may not be final - you could get 'Not sure yet, please come back for interview at another college on....' and then still end up with 'No' a few weeks later. I'd have found that tougher.

(There's a huge amount of information about admissions on both the Oxford and Cambridge websites which might be worth a look, if you have time.)

My son did get some support from his school with preparing for the HAT and the interview, but even if your daughter doesn't get much support that may not matter very much. As I understand it, the most important thing is to have done some wider reading and to be able to talk about it in an informed and critical way. Both the HAT and the interview, as I understand it, are designed to identify those who will get on best with the tutorial system, which is central to teaching at both universities. There are sample interviews on the web for both places, and those are definitely worth a look.

Good luck!

Hi, I'm a year 11 student predicted 10a* at GCSE and thinking about Oxbridge - what sort of extra curricular things do you need to be putting on your personal statement?

At Cambridge there are two rounds of interviews

DS1 starting at Cambridge (History) next week, and this is not the case - for History at least. Cambridge do have a winter pool, but that is not the same as a second round of interviews. Those who do get pooled may well get "fished" without any further interviews. The website probably has stats on numbers as well, however relatively few get pooled and even fewer get fished. Also worth noting that at Cambridge the admissions process is managed by each individual college, and each will have a slightly different take on things, and have varying degrees of helpfulness - presumably the same at Oxford, but those with DC's studying there will know better than me.

Whether it is Cambridge or Oxford worth a shot though. Being widely read, especially beyond the A level (or GCSE) curriculum is advantageous, as is being able to hold one's own in a discussion where there may well not be a definitive right or wrong answer. Cambridge do seem to like high scoring UMS across all subjects, and place high value on trajectory.

Thanks everyone. She is absolutely set on applying to Oxford as they were so encouraging on the phone. She has done loads of extra reading (& forced me to read some of it too!) and has dragged the whole family on visits to look at various sites mentioned in these books.

I'm very relieved that you say to avoid the Oxbridge preparation companies. No time anyway.

It is interesting what you say about Cambridge Roisin, as she was very much told by Cambridge that all the AS's had to be A's (and her third one is borderline, but still predicted to be A in the end - she didn't mention the context on the phone mind you! I have only tracked down one person that went to Oxford from her school in the last decade & none to Cambridge). She is quite happy with that information, as at least she knows where she stands.

Molio - you are right about this years marking. A lot of her class got much lower. How does she find out which colleges do a 'conversation type interview'? That is another problem - no idea about a college, other than the one she was taken on a day trip to see by the school (Lincoln). Would that be an appropriate college?

AllMimsy - thanks for that information. I presume they don't do the interviews until the HAT test is marked? She won't get much help for this (I think one teacher is kindly looking them over with her at a break time), but dd2's view is that she will never know unless she tries & she knows there is a large chance of not making the first cut.