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Bright child has no friends at preschool

431 replies

Tetherless · 30/03/2022 18:59

My son started at preschool in September, having turned 3 last May (so is still 3). He’d never been to childcare before and we’d had a very isolated existence during covid as all family live abroad and we had to shield for the first lockdown. He struggled a lot settling in initially - wouldn’t sit with other children at meals, cried at drop off etc - but by the end of the first term he was joining in with everything, got on really well with the staff and seemed to me to have made huge progress.

He didn’t play with other kids at all at first but now does to a limited degree (apparently mainly when he can lead the activity). He much prefers talking to the adults. The staff have said that they are concerned with his social communication because he doesn’t have friends yet and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about.

DS is and always has been incredibly advanced - he met all milestones early, particularly those relating to communication (babbled with consonants at 4 months, pointing and first words at 8 months, sentences at 13 months). His maths is similarly advanced and he is extremely musical. He can read pretty well (on year 1 books atm). He is incredibly sensitive, imaginative, has a fantastic memory and sense of humour and is creative with a very wide range of interests. Motor skills wise he walked early, could ride a bike before he was 3, draws really well and starting to write. He has no sensory issues, eats and sleeps well and I have never considered him to have any kind of rigidness in terms of approach to routines. He’s generally pretty flexible but will sometimes kick off if he doesn’t get what he wants (which I thought was typical of his age). He is a bit of a stickler for the rules when playing games and that’s one of the things that nursery has cited (in addition to his preference for talking to adults) as “evidence” that he may be on the spectrum.

It has never crossed my mind that he is anything other than a bright but neurotypical child. Quite how bright I’m not sure. I feel that his issues making friends and preferring adults stem from a combination of natural shyness (DH and I both shy, academically high achieving kids), lack of practice due to covid and being used to being with adults, and difficulty engaging with peers whose language and interests are very different from his.

I feel that nursery has totally got it wrong but am conscious of course that they have a lot of experience (though possibly not with a child with this particular combination of circumstances). I feel slightly trapped in a parallel universe where they are seeing a completely different child from the one we see at home. They don’t seem to see his intelligence as a factor in his interactions with peers and seem keen to label him which seems crazy to me.

Should I be concerned? Is there anything I should be saying/doing with them or with him? Do I need to help him more with friendships or will it come with time? I feel slightly at a loss.

OP posts:
Tetherless · 31/03/2022 13:12

[quote toomuchlaundry]Are you just basing that on no-one being diagnosed in your family?

Are you saying because you went to Oxbridge you can’t be autistic?

www.varsity.co.uk/science/16439[/quote]
No, I’m not saying that. I’m saying that DH and I were bright, shy and not autistic. I think DS is bright and shy, like we were.

No one in our wider families have any autistic traits.

OP posts:
Nelliephant1 · 31/03/2022 13:12

@gamerchick

DH and I are both neurotypical

I wouldn't be too sure about that tbh OP.

Thought this too to be honest.
toomuchlaundry · 31/03/2022 13:15

The spectrum is very wide, what are you saying are autistic traits?

Tetherless · 31/03/2022 13:16

And I thought my son’s nursery were being too hasty in labelling him. Little did I think that you can get a diagnosis from a few posts online.

OP posts:
Tetherless · 31/03/2022 13:18

@Tetherless

And I thought my son’s nursery were being too hasty in labelling him. Little did I think that you can get a diagnosis from a few posts online.
…not only for me and my husband, but for unnamed people in our extended families!
OP posts:
TheOccupier · 31/03/2022 13:21

It sounds like he is functioning well, if he's happy then I would try not to worry. Presumably he'll be starting school in September? Wait and see how that goes. He may just be the sort of person who likes rules and structure - not everyone who has those character traits is on the spectrum. I think we are in danger of pathologising and labelling everything nowadays!

RussianSpy101 · 31/03/2022 13:22

Just because nobody in your family is ND, it doesn’t mean your son isn’t.

Just because your friends son is being assessed for ASD and is different to your son, doesn’t mean your son isn’t autistic.

If you’ve met one autistic person, you’ve met one autistic person.

Lots of your posts about your son resonate with me and my son has diagnosed ASD. Like yourself, we have nobody else in either family with ASD. It worries me that even if your son goes through assessment and they want to diagnose him, you will fight it as you don’t want him labelled as you want him to fit your image of the perfect child.

I personally feel there are lots of signs of ASD in your sons behaviour but you seem intent on fighting it.

doeadeeer · 31/03/2022 13:28

I don't understand your posts. If you don't want to explore autism and you think he is just like you, then don't! If your son doesn't need any additional support that's fine.
My son was diagnosed at 2 - it was obvious he needs a lot of additional help.

It's your choice whether you pursue this, if you don't want to then don't!

BessieFinknottle · 31/03/2022 13:28

The problem where I am is the opposite. Playschools and schools are too slow to suggest autism to a parent, I don't think they're allowed? Obviously they can't diagnose, but I think they should be able to mention it as something worth looking into. As a pp said, they use vague terms such as 'behavioral issues', 'issues around language' and the parent is supposed to guess what to do then. As early intervention is so important, I wish they were able to be more direct.

I wouldn't dismiss what the nursery is saying Tetherless, they might be wrong or right, but maybe it's worth looking at things more closely. I find that many of the strategies used for children with ASD are very helpful for NT children anyway.

AlexaShutUp · 31/03/2022 13:34

The staff have said that they are concerned with his social communication because he doesn’t have friends yet and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about.

OP, you say that you think your son’s nursery are being too hasty in labelling him, but from what you've said, they aren't labelling him, they're just mentioning ASD as something that they are thinking about because of the social communication difficulties that they have observed. That isn't a diagnosis, and it isn't supposed to be.

Notonthestairs · 31/03/2022 13:46

It's only an assessment. There will be a waiting list. Ours took months to come around and by that stage he may well have settled into Reception without any difficulties.

I can absolutely say they'll do their best to discharge him as quickly as possible if there is nothing further required.

Swayingpalmtrees · 31/03/2022 13:59

How many siblings does ds have?
How often does he see children of a similar age in your friendship/family set up?
How much as a family do you value and get involve with others socially?
How much exposure to play groups, hobbies, sports etc does he have on a weekly basis?
What and who did you see outside over lockdown?
How often does he go to supermarkets and busy places with lots of children?

Can you tell me who looks after him when you are travelling and working? A nanny or a nursery or both?

These are very important questions before any thoughts can be made about ND.

You do seem very very focused on him being 'bright' and ahead of milestones which might not be helpful if he slows down/changes/loses interest - you could give him a sense that he is failing you/or from the same clever mold. Focusing more on his other achievements such as social skills/soft skills would be beneficial.

Swayingpalmtrees · 31/03/2022 14:00

**involved

Sweetpea84 · 31/03/2022 14:08

I work in a nursery with triplets who are all autistic. They’re can read and write and know a lot.

dollydimple123 · 31/03/2022 14:11

The main thing to remember is you have a lovely bright healthy son who is who he is. Just enjoy it, arrange some play dates and go to some soft play

BelleTheBananas · 31/03/2022 14:14

I went to Oxford and pretty much everyone around me was autistic to a greater or lesser extent, including me (I didn’t see it until DS1 was diagnosed). I considered myself comparatively ‘cool’ because I’d actually had teenage years (drinking, sex, etc.) compared to the many others who’d had little social contact pre-uni. My uni WhatsApp group is a rich seam for any clinical psychologists who might want some extra work Grin

OP, DS1 is 9 now and has benefitted SO MUCH from his diagnosis. He’s popular and really bright, and LOVES school. My in-laws, on the other hand, refuse to recognise ASD/ADHD, which has hugely affected their ability to understand and connect with him.

SallyWD · 31/03/2022 14:15

I haven't read all 190 posts but why is shyness a sign of autism? My DS was shy to extent that he was diagnosed with selective mutism. He was painfully shy at 3 (still is at 9). He really struggled to form friendships for the first few years at school. Now he's 9 and in year 4, he's very slowly growing in confidence socially and starting to make friends. No one has ever mentioned possible autism to us and I don't think he's autistic. I just wondered why they suspect autism just because your son is shy? Or is the fact he's gifted also a sign of autism? My son is bright but didn't develop any skills earlier than other children - he was probably a bit of a late developer to be honest.

Swayingpalmtrees · 31/03/2022 14:18

If you consider the impact of a two year lockdown on this age group, and factor in a lack of siblings or interaction - this really needs to be taken into account.

I agree re Oxbridge thing dh said the same.

thebabynanny · 31/03/2022 14:18

@SallyWD

I haven't read all 190 posts but why is shyness a sign of autism? My DS was shy to extent that he was diagnosed with selective mutism. He was painfully shy at 3 (still is at 9). He really struggled to form friendships for the first few years at school. Now he's 9 and in year 4, he's very slowly growing in confidence socially and starting to make friends. No one has ever mentioned possible autism to us and I don't think he's autistic. I just wondered why they suspect autism just because your son is shy? Or is the fact he's gifted also a sign of autism? My son is bright but didn't develop any skills earlier than other children - he was probably a bit of a late developer to be honest.
It won't just be shyness - lots of children are shy. The nursery will have noticed this child having particular struggles or difficulties beyond that of most typical children that age, that may or may not be due to autism.
Tetherless · 31/03/2022 14:23

@Swayingpalmtrees

How many siblings does ds have? How often does he see children of a similar age in your friendship/family set up? How much as a family do you value and get involve with others socially? How much exposure to play groups, hobbies, sports etc does he have on a weekly basis? What and who did you see outside over lockdown? How often does he go to supermarkets and busy places with lots of children?

Can you tell me who looks after him when you are travelling and working? A nanny or a nursery or both?

These are very important questions before any thoughts can be made about ND.

You do seem very very focused on him being 'bright' and ahead of milestones which might not be helpful if he slows down/changes/loses interest - you could give him a sense that he is failing you/or from the same clever mold. Focusing more on his other achievements such as social skills/soft skills would be beneficial.

He’s got 1 sibling who is 2.5 years younger, 18 months.

Over lockdown (from when he was 2-3) we saw basically no one else for the actual lockdown periods but he went to a few toddler groups when it was permitted. We didn’t see any family in person for basically a year but he was fine when he did see them again.

He doesn’t do any hobbies atm (I had felt up to now that he was too young but have been considering sports recently) and we only meet up with friends with similar age children occasionally (as I said he tends to enjoy it when we do). He has a nanny when he’s not at nursery and she has no concerns - has reported that he has started approaching kids at the park quite recently.

His nursery is very big - 100+ children - so was a real shock to his system when he started. He has settled in well there now in terms of getting used to the environment and participating with the other children.

I feel very bad that I haven’t prioritised his social development myself and am making a concerted effort to address this now.

OP posts:
Tetherless · 31/03/2022 14:26

DH and I did arts/humanities and the student characteristics were different on the whole to those studying STEM subjects.

Whilst there may well be a lot of people with ASD who went to Oxbridge it’s a bit of a stretch to suggest that going to Oxbridge in itself is any kind of an indicator. There were a lot of posh people at Cambridge with me too and that doesn’t mean I have family money.

OP posts:
AlexaShutUp · 31/03/2022 14:26

@SallyWD

I haven't read all 190 posts but why is shyness a sign of autism? My DS was shy to extent that he was diagnosed with selective mutism. He was painfully shy at 3 (still is at 9). He really struggled to form friendships for the first few years at school. Now he's 9 and in year 4, he's very slowly growing in confidence socially and starting to make friends. No one has ever mentioned possible autism to us and I don't think he's autistic. I just wondered why they suspect autism just because your son is shy? Or is the fact he's gifted also a sign of autism? My son is bright but didn't develop any skills earlier than other children - he was probably a bit of a late developer to be honest.
I very much doubt that they suspect autism because the child is shy. Or because he is clever.

They have identified social communication difficulties which might include being shy but might also manifest themselves in other ways in terms of how he interacts with his peers. The OP's interpretation is that it's just shyness, but the nursery may be observing something a bit different from that.

It's really hard to tell, because the OP appears to have taken the nursery's comments as a criticism of her child, rather than as a suggestion that might help him, and she has therefore leapt into defensive mode without realising that she actually doesn't need to defend him at all.

BelleTheBananas · 31/03/2022 14:29

OP I did music! Musicians are over-represented in the autistic community Grin You’re assuming (wrongly) that autism is stereotypically science-geeky and male. Female autists are more likely to be creative/literary/poetic/artistic/musical.

the-art-of-autism.com/females-and-aspergers-a-checklist/

Tetherless · 31/03/2022 14:33

[quote BelleTheBananas]OP I did music! Musicians are over-represented in the autistic community Grin You’re assuming (wrongly) that autism is stereotypically science-geeky and male. Female autists are more likely to be creative/literary/poetic/artistic/musical.

the-art-of-autism.com/females-and-aspergers-a-checklist/[/quote]
But are talented creative/literary/poetic/artistic/musical people more likely to be autistic or neurotypical?

My DS is/is likely to be all of those things but as far as im concerned that’s totally irrelevant because none of it is any kind of indicator one way or the other.

Reading this thread one could come away with the impression that everyone is autistic, they just don’t know it yet.

OP posts:
AlexaShutUp · 31/03/2022 14:44

But are talented creative/literary/poetic/artistic/musical people more likely to be autistic or neurotypical?

Good question. Based on my experience of studying at Cambridge, I'm not sure. I would say that a very high proportion of my peers were almost certainly not neurotypical. I certainly don't think they were all autistic, certainly, but neurodiversity has many forms.

It would be interesting to see some stats, but neurodiversity so often tends to be under diagnosed in academic high achievers that it would be hard to get accurate data.