Bright child has no friends at preschool

[Tetherless]

My son started at preschool in September, having turned 3 last May (so is still 3). He’d never been to childcare before and we’d had a very isolated existence during covid as all family live abroad and we had to shield for the first lockdown. He struggled a lot settling in initially - wouldn’t sit with other children at meals, cried at drop off etc - but by the end of the first term he was joining in with everything, got on really well with the staff and seemed to me to have made huge progress.

He didn’t play with other kids at all at first but now does to a limited degree (apparently mainly when he can lead the activity). He much prefers talking to the adults. The staff have said that they are concerned with his social communication because he doesn’t have friends yet and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about.

DS is and always has been incredibly advanced - he met all milestones early, particularly those relating to communication (babbled with consonants at 4 months, pointing and first words at 8 months, sentences at 13 months). His maths is similarly advanced and he is extremely musical. He can read pretty well (on year 1 books atm). He is incredibly sensitive, imaginative, has a fantastic memory and sense of humour and is creative with a very wide range of interests. Motor skills wise he walked early, could ride a bike before he was 3, draws really well and starting to write. He has no sensory issues, eats and sleeps well and I have never considered him to have any kind of rigidness in terms of approach to routines. He’s generally pretty flexible but will sometimes kick off if he doesn’t get what he wants (which I thought was typical of his age). He is a bit of a stickler for the rules when playing games and that’s one of the things that nursery has cited (in addition to his preference for talking to adults) as “evidence” that he may be on the spectrum.

It has never crossed my mind that he is anything other than a bright but neurotypical child. Quite how bright I’m not sure. I feel that his issues making friends and preferring adults stem from a combination of natural shyness (DH and I both shy, academically high achieving kids), lack of practice due to covid and being used to being with adults, and difficulty engaging with peers whose language and interests are very different from his.

I feel that nursery has totally got it wrong but am conscious of course that they have a lot of experience (though possibly not with a child with this particular combination of circumstances). I feel slightly trapped in a parallel universe where they are seeing a completely different child from the one we see at home. They don’t seem to see his intelligence as a factor in his interactions with peers and seem keen to label him which seems crazy to me.

Should I be concerned? Is there anything I should be saying/doing with them or with him? Do I need to help him more with friendships or will it come with time? I feel slightly at a loss.

Do you think your DC’s diagnosis was useful @5zeds?

It’s more because you refer to it as a ‘A serious life changing condition’ you don’t go from a non autistic life to an autistic life after diagnosis. well obviously. But you also don’t suggest life long disability without a lot of very specialist training. Even a GP can’t diagnose ASD.

They raised social communication skills not socialisation. The two are linked but not the same.

I imagine the nursery have some experience spotting those children that have suffered a lack of socialisation due to the pandemic.

But regardless they did not offer a diagnosis.

I expect they just thought their concerns were worth raising with the Op to see what she thought.

@5zeds

One

Oh. So you'll know autism diagnoses aren't handed out like smarties. And that a setting suggesting that there may be something more at play rather than lack of socialisation is pretty rare. As this thread shows - there hasn't been a single person who has come on and said that their nursery raised a concern and it turned out to be nothing.

And in my experience, a diagnosis absolutely does have an impact. If the school isn't making reasonable adjustments, then you have a lot more leverage to get them to implement them. And in secondary school, your child gets 25% additional time in exams which is invaluable.

It took years of pushing to get my child assessed. I don't view his diagnosis as a negative - I see it as a key to unlock his potential.

and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about. is what OP said in the first post. You’re welcome to think it’s fine but I don’t any more than I’d think it fine if a teacher observed a bump on my child’s leg and mentioned cancer.

That’s your experience not mine. I’m not sure why yours involves attacking mine. I know lots and lots of families with children with asd. They don’t have a uniform experience.

@Tetherless

My son started at preschool in September, having turned 3 last May (so is still 3). He’d never been to childcare before and we’d had a very isolated existence during covid as all family live abroad and we had to shield for the first lockdown. He struggled a lot settling in initially - wouldn’t sit with other children at meals, cried at drop off etc - but by the end of the first term he was joining in with everything, got on really well with the staff and seemed to me to have made huge progress.

He didn’t play with other kids at all at first but now does to a limited degree (apparently mainly when he can lead the activity). He much prefers talking to the adults. The staff have said that they are concerned with his social communication because he doesn’t have friends yet and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about.

DS is and always has been incredibly advanced - he met all milestones early, particularly those relating to communication (babbled with consonants at 4 months, pointing and first words at 8 months, sentences at 13 months). His maths is similarly advanced and he is extremely musical. He can read pretty well (on year 1 books atm). He is incredibly sensitive, imaginative, has a fantastic memory and sense of humour and is creative with a very wide range of interests. Motor skills wise he walked early, could ride a bike before he was 3, draws really well and starting to write. He has no sensory issues, eats and sleeps well and I have never considered him to have any kind of rigidness in terms of approach to routines. He’s generally pretty flexible but will sometimes kick off if he doesn’t get what he wants (which I thought was typical of his age). He is a bit of a stickler for the rules when playing games and that’s one of the things that nursery has cited (in addition to his preference for talking to adults) as “evidence” that he may be on the spectrum.

It has never crossed my mind that he is anything other than a bright but neurotypical child. Quite how bright I’m not sure. I feel that his issues making friends and preferring adults stem from a combination of natural shyness (DH and I both shy, academically high achieving kids), lack of practice due to covid and being used to being with adults, and difficulty engaging with peers whose language and interests are very different from his.

I feel that nursery has totally got it wrong but am conscious of course that they have a lot of experience (though possibly not with a child with this particular combination of circumstances). I feel slightly trapped in a parallel universe where they are seeing a completely different child from the one we see at home. They don’t seem to see his intelligence as a factor in his interactions with peers and seem keen to label him which seems crazy to me.

Should I be concerned? Is there anything I should be saying/doing with them or with him? Do I need to help him more with friendships or will it come with time? I feel slightly at a loss.

Hyperlexia / Being advanced with communication at really young ages is a symptom of ASD so if his nursery is willing to support a referral you could ask for one. You probably won’t get get an appointment for a year or two depending on your area - so by then hopefully his symptoms can become clearer.

@5zeds

and have mentioned ASD as something they are thinking about. is what OP said in the first post. You’re welcome to think it’s fine but I don’t any more than I’d think it fine if a teacher observed a bump on my child’s leg and mentioned cancer.

Funny you say that. Five years ago I did spot a bump on a toddler’s neck, expressed my concerns to the parent, and it was ignored. I repeatedly expressed my concerns every week for six months at which point he was formally diagnosed with Cancer. The parent tried to blame us for lack of care but I had the evidence in black and white to formally say we did our best. Some parents, like yourself, don’t respect us at all. Think all we are are glorified babysitters when actually I know more about kids / early years / what is unusual and what is not in a child than you will EVER know.

I think you are quite lucky that his nursery are on the ball. Most pupils slip through the net and never end up with a diagnosis; generally teachers knowledge of SEN is very limited, and training is virtually non- existent. I teach in secondary schools and in every class I spot at least 3 pupils who are clearly either autistic/ have adhd/ dyslexia - and yet there is no diagnosis or support in place. These pupils have suffered unnecessarily for their entire schools lives.

@5zeds

That’s your experience not mine. I’m not sure why yours involves attacking mine. I know lots and lots of families with children with asd. They don’t have a uniform experience.

I'm not sure why you're so angry about it. They're not diagnosing it, they're raising it. The OP can just ignore it - no one can force her to get an assessment.

And no one gets autism through being assessed either.

Mentioned. Hardly a diagnosis. And well worth a reading more around the subject, talking to parents who have experienced similar, a follow up discussion with the SEN worker and potentially an assessment.

Presumably now they are recording their concerns in preparation for transition to Reception - maybe the Op shouldn't be told about that either.

The Op is in charge. She can withdraw, push for an assessment or wait and see. I'm not sure anything on this thread is that controversial really.

@Ozanj that couldn’t be further from the truth, but if I’ve lead you to believe I don’t think early years professionals are valuable and skilled then I apologise. I just don’t think you are consultant peadiatricians. Actually observation from school (or another non home setting) are extremely important in the diagnostic process.

It does like a very caring nursery so I hope you can figure out the best way to proceed.

They raised social communication skills not socialisation. The two are linked but not the same

One flows into the other. If there is very little socialisation at a young age the child will have problems communicating with peers.

@5zeds

I wish playschool staff had been direct with me to be honest. Looking back, the signs were certainly there in my DS in preschool, but nothing much was said. School said nothing either. He's the eldest so we had no frame of reference, and we only suspected something was seriously amiss when he began showing signs of severe anxiety aged almost 7. Wasted years which I bitterly regret. I do wonder if things would have worked out a bit differently if we had known earlier. He's not in a great place now. And I see the same thing happening to others still.
I really think it's worse for an experienced professional to say nothing in this situation than to voice their concerns. And for a person like me (who knew nothing about autism) you need to be direct. Just let them say what they're worried about, hints aren't enough. It's difficult to interpret the 'code', the terminology of autism when it's all like a foreign language to you. Plain language is best.

There’s no need for code though if you just say we’re concerned he is struggling more than we’d expect to form relationships with peers.

I wonder if I’d asked this question on a different board id have got a different response;

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/parenting/4476758-3-5-year-old-doesn-t-have-any-friends

I didn’t notice the topic - I just saw it in active.

But the difference is that that poster didn't report any concerns from the nursery. The nursery has raised concerns not you, the parent.

[quote Tetherless]I wonder if I’d asked this question on a different board id have got a different response;

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/parenting/4476758-3-5-year-old-doesn-t-have-any-friends[/quote]
I'm really not sure what your point is. Assessment isn't going to make your son autistic. And if he is autistic, if you don't get him assessed, he'll still be autistic.

I guess you'll move him because you don't like what you're hearing.

I didn't notice the title either, just saw your post on the trending now page. I have never been on this board before.

Also that’s not the same question at all.

Look, a concern isn't a diagnosis. You asked what to do. Go back, talk to them some more. Support him where you can. Ask them for more advice and support (if you trust them.) Read up.

Nothing else has to happen immediately.

Maybe it's something, maybe it's nothing. Whatever it will all come out in the wash. You've got a lovely boy and you are a good parent. It will work out.

Ps also a diagnosis isn't the end. It's just the opportunity to access whatever help will benefit him best.

Thank you @Notonthestairs.

Hello,
As a teacher with years of experience, I can assure you that they will not have simply thrown autism into the conversation without thought. As a pp said, teachers are very wary of sharing this with parents because of their understandable reaction.
Many parents say the same as you- but he's fine at home, but I don't see the problem.... But school / creche is not like home. Children who are high functioning will manage well at home but the differences, noise, lights, changes in routine, etc etc, outside can be very stressful and end up with different behaviours.
The list of flags does sound very familiar but also bear in mind that autism can have so many different ways if presenting itself - the internet checklists cannot represent all autistic children.
Listen to what they say and see how things go. But try not to close your mind to the possibilities because that may harm his development school if he is on the spectrum.