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Declining 8 week vaccinations for my baby - experiences?

999 replies

Plasticpineapple · 24/07/2014 17:32

I don't want this to be about whether you should or shouldn't vaccinate your baby. I have chosen not to and I'm looking for experiences from others who have done the same. What did you say? What did the doctor say? Did you discuss vaccination once the child was older or flat out decline all vaccines?

OP posts:
bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 10:59

Re effectiveness etc (as the poster said) she didn't mention anything about desirability.

What am I 'wriggling' about?

Hakluyt · 28/02/2015 11:06

"ndeed even the scientists and doctors haven't quite got enough information, because advice tends to change from time to time as do estimates of effectiveness and so on."

"Advice" about what? Obviously not effectiveness because she mentions that separately. "And so on" what does this mean?

bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 11:12

It doesn't say anything about desirability though does it? Why did you ask that?

One example of advice changing would be number of vaccines required to confer immunity. Eg. When the MMR was introduced it was supposed to be 'one for life' then a few years later they introduced the second 'booster'. There was then talk of another booster potentially being necessary for teens because the mumps component was waning. That may or may not be introduced in the future. (Or perhaps they'll use a different, more effective mumps component)

Hakluyt · 28/02/2015 11:40

Yes- thwt's covered by effectiveness. What other "advice" has changed and what does "and so on" mean?

Hakluyt · 28/02/2015 11:47

"The one sticking point is that none of us has enough information to really know if, or to what degree, we are putting our children at risk through either course of action (vaxing or not vaxing).

indeed even the scientists and doctors haven't quite got enough information, because advice tends to change from time to time as do estimates of effectiveness and so on."

This is some more of that post. Which you agreed with.

Chchchchanging · 28/02/2015 11:55

Genuine question- why don't you want your children immunised?
I ask because it's never occurred to me not to for what I perceive to be obvious reasons, but wonder why I haven't considered the 'no' route either!

SnakeyMcBadass · 28/02/2015 12:19

I contracted measles at 4. My grandmother was a nurse and as a result she cared for me at home with regular visits from the doctor. I don't remember much, but have the damaged eyesight as a momento. My DC are fully vaccinated, and I am very grateful that we have a healthcare system which allows me to protect them.

SilenceInTheLibrary · 28/02/2015 12:38

Chchchchanging - because you're not into conspiracy theories or bad science. You're probably also not a 9/11 truther either.

Madamecastafiore · 28/02/2015 12:56

It is utterly beyond me why as a parent one wouldn't want to do everything in ones power to protect ones child from life threatening or potentially disabling illnesses.

bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 16:03

Hak, no, it isn't. The advice was changed (based on new knowledge about effectiveness.) If you want another example - advice re scheduling has also changed. The MMR is given earlier now than it used to be.

I quoted the part of Patter's post that I said 'very true' to. If you have more questions about what she's written maybe you should ask her.

Now, are you going to answer my question and tell me why you asked about 'desirability' in relation to that post?

Silence. Yeah, everyone else here is into conspiracy theories, 'bad science' and thinks 9/11 was a government cover up Hmm

SilenceInTheLibrary · 28/02/2015 16:28

Silence. Yeah, everyone else here is into conspiracy theories, 'bad science' and thinks 9/11 was a government cover up

Now, now bumbley. I didn't say that, did I? Wink I merely said that I would bet chchanging was not a 9/11 truther. You know, because her post demonstrated a rational of view of things.

PatterofaMinion · 28/02/2015 16:46

It boils down to whether you think you know better than scientists and doctors from many many pieces of real scientific research or whether you trust your own opinion informed from your knowledge.

I don't think it is as simple as this. I think that there are instances historically of medical science, and the advice pertaining from it, being untrustworthy and even one instance of that is enough to make us all even very slightly unsure about whether to trust it.

I would certainly not trust my own scientific knowledge as I have almost none.

Which leaves me with a judgment to make as to whether it is safer for my children (and others) to have them vaccinated, or safer not to.

I have to make that judgment based on other people's knowledge, with the knowledge that that may be flawed or wrong.

We are all in the same position, and we are all pro-safe children and anti-pathogen.

It's just that some of us make different judgments than others. All of us can never be right. I would not say I am pro vax or anti vax. I am just confused, like most people are. I try to compromise and weigh things up, but it is NOT straightforward when the medical establishment can sometimes be wrong.

bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 16:49

Because not considering (or even thinking about) other options in relation to vaccines automatically = rational person in your opinion? Interesting.

(Not that I think you're irrational chch :) )

PatterofaMinion · 28/02/2015 16:50

Hakuyt apologies, regarding 'desirability' I don't think I can answer as that was not the word I used.

Effectiveness as in the widely discussed and broadcast percentage figures, which have changed several times I believe in recent years, in regard to how effective the MMR is at protecting against the illnesses it is intended to protect against.

countessmarkyabitch · 28/02/2015 16:57

Of course there are instances when science and medicine makes mistakes. Thalidomide, for instance: big mistake. But thalidomide was given to people with the intention to help them, when it was shown to harm them it was with drawn and everything done as it should be. That was medicine and science making a mistake, admitting it, and the same people working to help the situation.
What you have here is not one small study or a few drs saying that vaccines are the absolutely best way to keep our children safe and improve global health outcomes. You have many many years and thousands upon thousands of studies and drs and scientists. Pretty much all of them.

And up against them you have a few discredited studies, bad scientists, tinfoil conspiracy theorists, and some unqualified parents who don't know the science from a hole in the ground.

We need to treat these people in the same way we treat aids deniers, those who advise people not to take drugs for their HIV/AIDS because they firmly believe it all the be lies and they know better. They are on a par with those that preach that condoms aren't the way to stop HIV. The arguments put forward by the anti-vax brigade are chock full of outright lies, half truths, misunderstood science and twisted actual information.

We're not really all in the same position. Many non-vaxxers are not pro-safe children, they are pro-safe their own children and other peoples can go hang.

Yes, some of us make dif judgements than others. Some are right and others are wrong. Not all opinions are equal and not all decisions have the same outcome.

IsabellaofFrance · 28/02/2015 17:10

DS2, who is 8, didn't have the preschool booster (more circumstance than choice as he has Autism). The only person who ever mentioned it to me was his Paed. None of our GP's have ever mentioned it, and we see them a lot!

SilenceInTheLibrary · 28/02/2015 17:13

It's basically the scientists, the WHO and the medical profession, versus These Guys and Dr Google. Very dangerous.

countessmarkyabitch · 28/02/2015 17:23

Problem is, they like to see it as a David and Goliath thing, when really its nothing of the sort.

Alyosha · 28/02/2015 17:25

Hi Bumbley! Thanks for replying to my post.

It's great to hear that you're in favour of vaccination. Thanks for clarifying that. Just for the benefit of the OP, can you summarise in a paragraph why she should vaccinate her DD/DS and help us clarify once and for all that you really are in favour of vaccination for the 99.99% of the population that tolerates them well and has not been advised by their GP or other medical professional to avoid them?

Just because most of your posts seem to be encouraging OP in her desire not to vaccinate her child (who must now be 8 or 9 months old), so I think that's the source of the confusion re: your support of vaccination.

Thanks!

bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 17:43

Hi alyosha!

I'm a bit curious about why you think it's my responsibility to tell someone to vaccinate their child. There are plenty of other people doing that to her on here already. If she doesn't listen to them then why would she listen to me? Personally, I would feel very uncomfortable telling someone what to do. Ultimately it's their decision. I'm not going to change my position on that just to prove something to you. If you read through my posts you would see that I'm not anti-vax. If that's not enough for you...

What part of 'I don't agree with a one-size-fits-all approach to vaccination just as I don't agree with a one-size-fits-all approach to medicine in general' do you need clarified?

Thanks!

SilenceInTheLibrary · 28/02/2015 17:52

slippery as an eel.

Alyosha · 28/02/2015 17:56

OK Bumbley, explain in a paragraph why you're not anti-vax for the vast majority of the population. Don't direct it towards OP, that way you won't be telling her what to do. I just want to clarify your position :)

Alyosha · 28/02/2015 17:57

As i'm not the only one having difficulty seeing your pro-vaccination posts, I think it would be really useful for you to put it here, just to help us out a bit?

MrsTripTucker · 28/02/2015 18:05

This reply has been deleted

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bumbleymummy · 28/02/2015 18:10

Alyosha - you can read my posts yourself. How you interpret them is obviously up to you. :)

I have to say though, people who are actually anti-vac wouldn't consider my posts to be anti-vac at all Grin