Any old prolapse! Uterus/womb prolapse, rectocele, cystocele, enterocele, urethrocele, incontinence, pelvic floor, anterior and posterior repair, TVT etc part 5

[Piplysmelie]

This is thread 3 of a long-running series of posts from ladies suffering from pelvic prolapses to support each other through the process of diagnosis, repair and recovery.

Here are the previous threads:
Thread 1
Thread 2
Thread 3
Thread 5

Info from BBC Health

What is a pelvic prolapse?

As the muscles, ligaments and supporting tissues in the pelvis become weaker, they are less able to hold in the organs of the pelvis such as the womb (uterus) or bladder.

Gravity pulls these organs down and, in the more severe cases, may appear through the entrance to the vagina.

A variety of problems can occur, depending on where the weakness lies and which organs are able to descend, but in every case there is some degree of prolapse of the vaginal wall, which begins to invert (rather like a sock turning inside out).
Prolapse of the womb or uterus is the most common prolapse, affecting as many as one in eight older women to some degree
Prolapse of the bladder, known as a cystocele, is less common.
Prolapse of the urethra (the tube that carries urine out of the bladder) is known as a urethrocele.
Prolapse of the intestines is quite rare, and known as an enterocele or rectocele.

Symptoms

Symptoms depend on which tissues descend, and how severe the prolapse is.

They may include:
A sense of heaviness or pressure in the pelvis.
The appearance of a bulge of tissue in the genital area, which can be quite alarming, and is often red and sore.
Urinary problems, such as having to urinate more frequently, feeling the need urgently, being incontinent (losing control of the bladder) or, conversely, being unable to pass urine when you need to.
Pain in the pelvis or lower back.
Sexual problems, including pain and decreased libido.
Constipation.
Vaginal discharge or bleeding.

Treatment and recovery

Once a prolapse has developed, surgery to fix the affected organs is usually the only way to cure it effectively.

However, another option is to use a device known as a vaginal ring pessary. This is rather like a contraceptive diaphragm or cervical cap. It's made of silicone or latex, and placed in the vagina to push back the prolapsed organs and hold them in place. Many women happily manage their prolapse this way.

I've been referred to the pelvic floor clinic. Physio says there's a gap in muscle strength in my sphincter - and clearly a very sore part - and the "gaping" hasn't improved.

hairytale - hope someone comes along to offer some support from their experience. Since my bits started slip sliding and I've been on this forum I have realised how naive I have been about the female anatomy. Good luck - I hope they can sort things for you.

Sorry hairy not something I am familiar with hopefully someone else can aid you.

Drat drat drat I had a poke around last night to check for damage from all the coughing. It all feels ok but I started to bleed again, in seventh week post op, surely I should be able to have a feel without it bleeding?

Also where the stitches are (not nearly so many of them now) it is raised. Does anyone know if this goes flat or stays raised? If it stays raised it will not be too great for sex.

Having a bit of a wobble worried about having a scarred fanjo which will mean little or no sex in the future :(

Oh and also my cervix is tipped to the side really tipped to the side is that normal and will it go back to being centred.

Pip - don't panic, you will still have stitches (plus the ones you can't see which take longer to go and are underneath the vaginal layer) so you will defo still have swelling and feel a big ridge where the scar is. Mine was beginning to feel more 'normal' (or should I say less pronounced) about 6 months after first op. Also, depending on your monthly cycle, it can feel more pronounced around period time I think. If, for some reason, after a year or so you find you still have a hard ridge then that can be reduced through a quick procedure I believe (something like ablation??? I think..(?)) but this is not very usual. Still early days yet, and they never tell you this before the op - it takes about 12 months to feel fully functioning ... You will have a slightly scarred fanjo, but for some (so they say) makes for even better sex (! ) xxx

(please remember I'm no medic, have only spent the best part of a year completely obsessed by all this and could maybe even take gynae exams now with my new found knowledge!!! Lol! How sad is this, I can even tell you the names of the different fascia we have in our bodies !!!)What a saddo am I!!!

Pip - forgot to mention the cervix - it will feel tipped to the side because of the way the fascia is pulled together when they stitch you up (is it tipped towards the sewing??) Once all the stitches have gone and the scar tissue stretched it will probably move back again (I would imagine) xxx

Thanks sure very reassuring

Good morning all.
Roseanne, hope the nightcap worked and you had a good night.
Fen, I had a tot and an anterior repair.
Sure, you certainly know your way around a fanjo now! :-)
I think my stitches must be well hidden as apart from the two in the groin where the tot has been placed I can't see any evidence of any at all. Have just finished my prescribed pain killers and antibiotics today so it will be interesting to see how things go from here on in.

Hi all

Have not posted for a while but just to let you know I pop in now and again to see how you are all doing.

Sure thanks for that post about the bladder prolapse, I can push on mine while I am weeing :) and it stops it. I have no difficulty seeing it or finding it as it is so large, yet when I went to the one of the consultants team ages ago he said it was a grade one and would leave it alone. Anyway I am back on Monday to see the actually consultant and hope to get a definitive answer as to what surgery I need and when. Hairytail, I have low anal pressure at rest and squeeze and am starting some sort of physio in a weeks time to try and strengthen the muscles as apparently low pressure has implications for the rectocele procedure - but to be honest I didnt really understand how or why, so hopefully after Monday I will have more understanding. And would you believe it I have my period (I have not had one since december) but I rang the hospital and they said not to worry (but I am) being examined is bad enough, but with a period ewwwww.

Hugs all round :)

Roseanna - how are you today? Bloody periods!! I feel like rubbish and am spending the morning on ibo/paracetamol and bed rest!! Also, my back is killing me and my cervix stinging :( Oh to be a man :) Lol! Jeremy Kyle is rubbish, sick to death of Jamie Oliver's recipes and am very bored of morning chat shows and house makeovers!!! x

Jackie62 - Hope you are better. Which make was your TVT (if you are still reading?) because I've found an article about J&J and four makes of TVT they have recalled (after informative chat with consultant). Compensation for you springs to mind????? (lots of cases going on in USA at the moment)

Hi all, feeling a lot better today thanks - just ditto what Sure said, could be writing that myself :o

Pip - cant help but hugs xx

Hairy - consultant explained to me that the walls are like tights or stockings and when you get a prolapse its like having a run in the stocking. In the same way that a run in a stocking makes the stocking weaker and wider, its the same for the vaginal wall. If you have a rectocele, apparently that is the 'widest' kind of run, and if you have rectocele and cystocele then it makes the walls wider still. That's why women with prolapse often complain of slackening or largeness of the fanjo and tightness if the edges of the repair are pulled too closely (he didn't use the word fanjo tho.:o )

I don't know about the sphincter part, but it might give some insight into the gaping. When I went to physio they came to the conclusion in only a few weeks that it was unlikely any amount of pfe would resolve the weaknesses.

Don't know if any of the above ramblings help at all ... just ignore if not!

Afternoon All
Had a bit of a rant yesterday with NHS as my consultant doesn't feel the need to see me before 3rd Sept, since I'm having daily pressure/dragging pains which are worse when I sit up, meaning I couldn't go back to work for another 7 weeks :( & im due to go on holiday in 3 weeks. The consultants secretary advised me to get a referral from my GP & go our woman's hospital A&E I did this, Dr on duty told me my cystocele was only a grade 1 which was the same before my rectocyle repair, which isn't true as this is the first time I've seen the thing hanging down, after a few tears ;) she agreed to email the consultant to get me an appointment next week, her secretary called me today to say she's received this & will call Monday if an appointment can be sorted out, in the mean time I have made an appointment for a private consultation for Monday with my original consultant...

Can anyone clear this up for me please, Whilst at my GP yesterday he advised that I might be offered a pessary which may help the pain, he told me I would be better getting it from the woman's hospital as they have various types & sizes, I asked the Dr at A&E about this & she said I could use one as I've had a Hysterectomy....anyone using one who's had a Hysterectomy?? If so do they help with the dragging pains ?

Oh Gail - how frustrating for you. Sorry I can't help with pessary advice as I haven't gone down that route, but it might be good to tide you over the holidays. How they grade cystoceles is beyond me as they always look at us lying down with legs up, when they disappear back up. They should have us squatting over a mirror and straining to get a proper picture!!!! Fingers crossed that you get some answers xxx

I read about the J&J recall in an article in an industry newsletter at work a few days ago too (I work in a vaguely related field). Anyone who is awaiting mesh treatment, it might be worth asking your consultant about this.

Gail - I haven't had a hysterectomy but did use a pessary prior to repair for rectocele. It absolutely saved me as it hugely relieved the symptoms and kept me going to the operation. They weren't going to give me one until I asked - a friend had said how well it had worked for her. As they reported my uterus is in a good position and well supported I can only assume it did 'pull things up and straighten things out' re the rectocele. I know you need to hear from somebody who's had a hysterectomy but thought I'd chip my bit in say it worked well for me. Not the most pleasant thing but it alleviated the dragging considerably, I'd say by about 75%.

What is it with these consultants saying our lumps and bumps are only small - do they expect them to be down to our knees!? We seem to all be experiencing the same diagnosis.

Thanks ladies for your replies, I genuinely think they want us to carry these cystoceles around in our hand bags.

tinkxx65 just tried stopping my wee like you described, well that just made me laugh :) So much!!!!

Ah, but did it work!!!?

Surewoman ...Yes

I found it quite fascinating, in a bizarre kind of way (stopping and starting with no feeling at all, like turning a tap on and off!!!)

But should we be able to do that if there is no prolapse? And Sure was your cystocele a grade one and they still operated? I am just trying to get my facts ready for Monday.

Just going to Burger King for tea (blaming my lack of enthusiasm for cooking on my period)

Tink my cystocele was a grade one and I managed to persuade my consultant to operate. I would suggest that you harp on and on about the symptoms at your appointment or just keep harping on at him/her to get it done.

Have just discovered a new symptom (promise you won't laugh!) - I can't wear thongs any more as they rub on the bobbly bits! Will the hospital take this into consideration do you think????

Tink - my post op notes say 'small cystocele with some deficiency of the perineum and a small low rectocele' resulting in anterior and posterior vaginal wall repairs followed by tvt procedure. The consultant originally had me down for tvt only, but I phoned a month before the surgery to say that cystocele was getting worse and could he fix that too (hadn't known that rectocele was back!). So don't really know what 'grade' it was (and anyway, as far as I'm concerned a cystocele is as big as the amount of urine in your bladder and we all go to the loo before being seen don't we?). Drink a litre of water before your appointment and see what happens!!! . Mine was causing big problems by the end of the day, rubbing, bulging, obstructive, etc. etc. x

Hello ladies just marking my place really and a quick update. Mention the fanjo situation quickly after an appt for ds and gp basically she doesn't expect full recovery from cb for 1 year, I am to do the exercises and come back in 2 months if still concerned.

So am trying to remember but have just gone back to work ft any suggestions?

Fen welcome to Big M&S Knickers

Sure Great idea about the litre of water! Although could be if the consultant presses the bladder on examination & it starts leaking

I'm working my way through the threads ready to join you. I'm a namechanger but only to reflect how I feel and so I can keep my 'saggy' posts separate from the rest of my MNing

Brief history - menopausal, ventouse 15 years ago, chronic constipation and impaction last year. Slow diagnosis of slow transit constipation and even slower prescription for appropriate medication. As soon as they got my bowel moving it decided it was going to relocate. :(

Anyway I'm certain as anything can be that I've got a rectocele and probably a cystocele as well although my GP sees no evidence of one. It takes 3 or 4 goes to empty my bowel :(

I'm due to see a gynae physio towards the end of the month but I'm just so miserable I thought it was time to jump on this thread. I hate the way I feel at the moment and I'm hoping that something will sort me out at some point.

I don't seem to have stress incontinence but there's definitely a stale urine smell around in the evening. Is this possible? Is it a sort of low grade leakage over the course of the day?