This illustrates why your vaccine choice matters to the rest of us

[CatherinaJTV]

one family's vaccine refusal killed one, another child, infected by the same unvaccinated pre-teen is still dying (since 2005):

justthevax.blogspot.com/2011/10/so-predictable-so-sad-natalie-dies-of.html

that should say HAVENT had mumps yet!

Having said that, it was after the DTP that she got sick - a DTP that has since been withdrawn for being 'too reactive'.

Whoops again!

Of course she had them at the same time, so I guess the combination of the unnecessary Hep B plus the 'reactive' DTP could be to blame. We will never know for sure because nobody gives enough of a shit to try finding out. Actually that is unfair - maybe people do give a shit but they don't want to be vilified and struck off.

but they give it to ALL of them regardless, surely they can test for std's and then give to the babies that need it, not all?!! god so glad i dont live over there tbh there maternity service scares me! i know not all births over there are like the ones shown on their tv prog, maternity prog, but so glad i had my 5 over here, natural births, no intervention, birth pool with 10lb 13oz ds4!, leaving the cord to stop pulsating and straight onto my chest when born etc.

intervention is great when its needed but it seems to be standard in the US?

seperate argument to vaccines, but we couldnt live in the US as my boys and dd arent vaccinated, or we could but only in certain states and if we home-school?

Bloody hell.
I am pro vaccination (for MY children) but I would baulk at vaccinating a newborn.

I heard that they dont take children in preschool if they havent had the chickenpox vac in the US.

I hate CP, it did terrible, awful, agonising things to my daughter. But even I think that is OTT.

I am very grateful for people who share their experiences of vaccination injuries on MNs. I know that my opinion differs but I want to know why people make the decisions they do.

When I say my opinions - I should say my actions. If I had the same experiences my opinions would probably be the same.

Hep B at birth (well, 2 days old) is one of the ones we argued against for dd1. sadly the nurse ignored us and went ahead anyway . we couldn't see the point of it for a newborn with parents in low risk categories, but it was the vax schedule where she was born, so that was all that counted.

we also argued against dd1 having the entire infant vax schedule as repeats when we returned to the UK when she was 5 months old. but it was the only way to 'catch her up' and get her in the right schedule.

so not only did she have unnecessary jabs as a newborn, she then had a shedload more at 5 months, on an accelerated schedule, including repeats of most of them, just in different combinations, to shoehorn her into the UK schedule.

so yes, what a rabid anti-vaxxer I am. dd1 had far more than she shoudl have done. what a lucky girl

My DS2 had loads in a short period of time. Whilst with his birth mother in a mother and baby unit he got behind on his schedule. His contact arrangements then precluded me from taking him to clinic for quite a while.

Then he seemed to be having injections every week for a while (I am not saying he DID but it seemed that way). They give the BCG in this borough so he had to have the pre BCG thing before the injection as well.

I had no say in any of it as I was not his legal parent.

It did seem a huge amount for one little tiny baby to cope with.

silverfrog.

It just aches doesn't it.

I was farkin well tested for Hep B during my pregnancy, and was negative, and yet my 8 week old baby still had the vaccine. Twice. Before we got wise and refused any more.

I hate, hate, hate, the fact that I took her for these vaccines, I held her whilst they jabbed her with stuff she didn't need.

I didn't insist when the doctor brushed off my concerns about her early birth, low weight, jaundice, reflux (turned out to be a dairy allergy) and her eczema .

What the fuck was I thinking? Ok I was tired and vulnerable and gullible but I should have questioned it more.

I have nightmares sometimes wondering what MMR could potentially have done to her if we had listened to the vaccine happy doctor and carried on.

Thank god for the internet and thank god for our current GP, who is pro vaccination, but is not a pharma sheep.

yes, it does sometimes, Beach. mostly I am ok about it - we made the best decisions we could, on the info which was readily available at the time (who knew we would have to question what we were told by doctors?). But I am furious about the misinformation we were given by the hv once we were back in the uk - told a pack of lies just to make her job easier (essentially so that she could tick the boxes in dd1's red book which said dd1 had had the right jabs - she all but ignored the vax list we provided from our previous doctor).

and I hate that we were ignored and written off as 'fussy parents' when we tried to refuse unnecessary jabs.

I didn't wake up from my gullible stupor soon enough, sadly. dd1 did have the mmr. I was, of course, stuck in a dx black hole by that time - dd1's lack of development and progress was being denied left right and centre, adn I was being noted as having severe pnd for not being 'delighted' with my lovely, content baby (she was, and is, lovely and content. she was also, at 10 months old, not interested in a single thing. at all. including me or dh. but it was me, looking for 'something to be wrong', not the fact that actually, something was wrong )

dd1 was clearly ASD pre-mmr. her development did arrest post mmr, and her gut health deteriorated further. that was what finally woke me up to the extent of the lies from health professionals. befor eher mmr, nothing I said wrt dd1's development was taken seriously. post, when I said it again (NOT linking to mmr, jut still searching for answers), I could not be told quick enough 'but these concerns were there all along - it has nothing to do with the mmr'. it was enough to make me start questioning, and researching, and uncovering the information I shodl have been given all along wrt dx process, gut health, etc.

the whole system is rotten to the core.

Yes. It is.

Silverfrog I had people suggest I was suffering from PND too because I wasn't 'enjoying' my baby.

The poor thing screamed night and day with the pain in her gut, the weeping eczema and the constant explosive diarrhoea.

So no, I didn't much enjoy things as my baby failed to thrive, screamed in pain and the nappies filled with mucus and undigested food kept coming.

I cannot believe what was done to your DD - except I can because I know how shit the system is.

If it hadn't been for the autism community, I probably would have taken DD1 for her MMR. I thank all those who speak out on this, daily - my child is ill, but she has not suffered the same extent of damage that so many other poor wee souls have. The appointment for MMR is in her health book but I didn't show up for it.

And still there are the lies and the denial and kids like ours getting jabbed with stuff they can't handle .

And you know what, I feel so lucky.

I feel lucky that my child was badly enough affected by her baby jabs that it made her sick enough for us to stop the schedule whilst we looked into things.

What sort of fucked up public health system is that?

A truly fucked up one.
I don't beleive for a second that ds3 would be NT had we not given MMR Bbut my gut says AS like his sibs and every other asd person in our family- a heck of a lot. there are three things that could ahve caused the regression in my mind, all with medical links:

Little ds1 took him from his cot and dropped him fron a bunk aged about 2, we took his to hospital but he was given all clear- did he sustain head injuries?

He was supposed to be on a casein free diet, ds1 and I (and subsequently ds4) all have casein intolerances that caused temporary FTT as newborns; years later I found we'd been prescribed the wrong formula, one that DID contain casein.

MMr.

All, a mix, none who knows. Nobody, that's who.

When ds4 was due his MMR we made the decision to give measles as Wales was having quite an outbreak but we cried in true fear that day and ahd to cancel; in the end DH took him as I physically could not, I wanted him to have the jab but... i'd give him rubella like a shot if we'd had the cash and mumps at puberty if it were available.

He may have MMR at school age; through lack of cash for separates and the sheer harassment we got from school with ds4 more than actively wanting MMR.

It bothers me that he has not had rubella, but even my Mum- whose baby had to be terminated from rubella damage (my brother) after she had already had a stonking 4 stillbirths- gets it.

It bothers me that he's vulnerable to rubella and to a lesser extent mumps and that he could pass it on to otehr people but ultimately if he was vaccinated and regressed, knowing what I do after ds3's regresion, i don't think I ciuld live with myself and I have to be able to do that, it's Dh and I who have to do the work, not anybody lecturing me across a wifi connection.

Still here for the mo and feel very at your posts, and at the ridicule, dismissal and sneering directed towards people who have the public spirit to tell their stories despite all they've got going on in their lives.

I have read the story linked to. Hugely sad that these children are dying of SSPE. I think it is a bit dubious to use their stories on a blog with an agenda but perhaps the parents gave permission?

I'm a bit surprised by the lack of curiosity on the part of the blogger, but then it is often this way with people who like to make out that complex issues are black and white.

Coupla things that are missing from the post - two children developed SSPE as a result of measles infection. SSPE is very rare, two children developing it from the same exposure source, needs investigating.

Secondly, the children who caught measles were young enough that they should still have been protected by maternal antibodies. The blog post does not comment on the vaccine status of the mothers, whether they had measles as children and whether the babies were breastfed or not.

It is just far far too simplistic to blame this on an unvaccinated child - and not a little cruel.

They are so many potential factors at play here - one thing that has been concerning some people for a while, is what will the long term result of mass measles infection be on the population? We know that measles is more dangerous in newly exposed populations for example.

Beachcomber

Natalie was 11 months when she contracted measles - maternal immunity doesn't last that long.

Micha was 5 months old at that time, maternal immunity has been reduced to 3-5% of the original antibody titer at that time.

SSPE is rare, but not that rare (1 in 2000 at that age in Germany), so the index case may have had a particularly aggressive measles strain, or this may have just been very bad luck. Just because the probability for something is low, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

And finally, I do not blame the child at all and I feel very sorry for the parents, who will have to live with this for the rest of their lives. I am sure they were not aware of the risks when they took their son to the doctor.

90% of children whether born to vaccinated mothers or mothers immune through disease have lost all their antibodies by 12 months. In pre-vaccine times there were plenty of cases and deaths in infants (mostly in the second half year of life).

I do not blame the child. If you wanted to take the metaphor further - you would not blame the knife, either.

catherinaJTV

No. No one wants to take the metaphor further.
No one wanted you to use that metaphor in the first place -it is entirely the reason your OP was so odious.

Your apologies on here are worthless. A decent human being would have realise they had over stepped the mark and withdraw the comments.

A total self absorbed twat with a seedy, myopic blog to plug wouldn't.

It is pretty simple really