An update- struggling with my trans friend.

[Llamallamadingdong]

An update to my previous thread which many of you kindly commented on.

I finally told my friend that I don’t feel comfortable helping him shop for women’s clothes.

The first response I got was “well I’m going to cancel my next gender clinic appointment then as you obviously don’t think I’m on the right path”.

I stayed calm, stated that if my friend does feel that they are the wrong gender, they shouldn’t need my (or anyone else’s) validation to follow what they feel is right for them.

I then got a bit of emotional blackmail on Friday night which I ignored and then last night at 1am got a long essay about why I need to give reasons that I am uncomfortable about it. I didn’t reply as I was a) asleep and b) rattled by that demand.

I replied saying that in my heart I don’t feel it is possible to change gender as regardless of the hormones we take or clothes we choose to wear, nothing can change our DNA on a chromosomal level. I am a scientist and I believe…well…science.

I also said that I feel uncomfortable about the agenda of some trans people towards women who dare to question them and that I feel women’s rights are being eroded in some cases by the behaviour of some (not all). Clearly had my weetabix this morning as I wouldn’t normally be this confrontational.

The outcome: I was told I am a “normal” women who has been corrupted by terfs on the internet and listen to the “bile that they spew on social media”. I was also subsequently called a TERF and told that I need to spend more time with trans people so I can properly understand them and that I should know him well enough that he doesn’t have any agenda.

I haven’t replied, he is now spamming me with the same messages to my WhatsApp and texts. I feel so conflicted. Part of me wants to just block and delete and the other part of me is shaking with anger.

Trans people already legally have every possible degree of human rights to live freely without discrimination except:

• the right to force other people to share their belief system
• the right to force other people to act as if they share that belief system if they don't
• the right to force other people to set aside their own rights where those are incompatible with that belief system

When someone is fighting for more trans rights, these are the rights they are fighting for.

You do not owe this person your obedient service @Llamallamadingdong - you have not done anything wrong.

He sounds self-absorbed and demanding.
I would hate to go clothes shopping with a trans friend because...I'd hate to go clothes shopping with a female friend. I find shopping for other people's clothes really boring, and shopping generally very boring. You don't have to cosplay 'girlie fun' you don't genuinely feel and if he is a friend, he should respect this..

It does sound like your friendship has run its course. This happens at times, don't let it all get to you and move on perhaps? He, sorry, she cannot demand you feel differently, just as you cannot demand he understands your views.

Tbh, doesn't sound like a particularly nice person anyway.

I don't think this friendship is meant to be. Please end it in as civil manner as you can OP if you haven't already done so.

Your DH is right @Llamallamadingdongand this person isn’t a friend. There’s nothing here about how you feel. Real friends wouldn’t do this. Sending hugs 🫂

As a scientist why are you talking about gender when you mean sex?

Gender's a social construct and there can be an infinite amount of them, and you can change every five minutes if you want.

Sex is what can't be changed no matter how much a person wants to.

Tell him to fuck off.

That was my reaction. Bern there with one of these men. It never ends well.

I believe it involves a ‘stepford wives’ or ‘lolita’ fancy dress costume, very heavy make up and exaggerated camp mannerisms including a super sassy walk.

No domestic labour is required.

Holy shit @QuenchedSquirrel you are NOT ALLOWED TO SAY THIS!

even though its true.

Well done for being so reasonable and not saying "fuck off Dave, you're a bloke". Send him one last message-sad that this has come between us, I'll always remember you fondly. If you need me you know where I am, etc etc. Then block.

OP, well done in making your boundaries clear. If it was me, I think the reaction you have seen will have changed how I viewed that person. His treatment of you was abusive.

Having been in an abusive relationship in the past (it’s my last ever believe me!) once you know the signs of being manipulated, you never forget it. Someone trying to cajole and wear you down so that you eventually just capitulate to their demands or needs is exactly this. If they insisted you believe the same religion as them and they tried to bully you into joining the faithful, it would be seen as ludicrous, bullying and manipulative. And yet, there it is…….

Protect yourself from people who don’t believe you have rights too.

Haha I hope you’re joking. It’s in the ops best interests to not leave him a door back in!

@Llamallamadingdongregardless of your friend's biological or chosen gender, they are treating you in a very unkind, disrespectful way. That friendship would be over for me, not due to the gender issue but due to the blatant disrespect with which you are being treated. Name calling, late night demands and harassment aren't things you do to a friend. Your friend sounds like they're spiralling and could do with some mental health support

Be TERF and proud. It’s not an insult. This man is a total bullying bellend. And will always be a man (child).

Then he needs to get that, not use OP as his emotional support man

When someone tells you who they are, listen to them.

Your ‘friend’ is telling you how they see you: not as an individual whose friendship is worthwhile in its own right, but as a validation tool. Your value to your ‘friend’ is only what you can bring to them. You have no agency is this relationship. You are not seen as an individual with your own ideas and ideals. You are nothing to them.

What has this person told you about who they are?

Human dammit. Sorry @Llamallamadingdong

I didn't suggest OP remain friendsor get the MH support for him. I clearly said if it was me, that friendship would be over. I only mentioned that it sounds like the "friend" may have poor mental health because that's how it sounds.

Nothing makes a man angry like a woman who dares to disagree with him.

Not only that, I would imagine that the average middle aged family man who comes out as a TW has LESS time to actually do household chores and child care than the average (probably pretty damn useless) man.

Not being funny, but if you tell someone "If you need me you know where I am" and then block them, is there not a real risk they will simply turn up on your doorstep?

If the clinic didn't force men to prove that they were dedicated to adhering to regressive sex based stereotypes and destroying women's rights, spaces and language, how on earth would the clinic be able to distinguish between a hairy-arsed, beer-bellied male builder who is actually a woman and a hairy-arsed, beer-bellied male builder who just walked in off the streets in his normal male work clothes for a bet?

@Llamallamadingdong Well done. I love your shiny spine!
He sounds like thinking of himself as a woman is his sexual fetish. Well done for not letting yourself be forced to participate in it!