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Feminism: chat

I'm asking Keir a question about women's rights on 5 live - how to phrase it?

818 replies

JanefromLondon1 · 28/06/2024 09:12

I want him not to be able to give me the flannel that we have to be kind to the woMen. I want assurances that we do t have to share our spaces. I want to not sound like the very nervous person that am I!

Any help appreciated?

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AlisonDonut · 30/06/2024 09:17

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Bollindger · 30/06/2024 12:35

No we are worried about Crown Jewels in the places they are not supposed to be....

Madcats · 30/06/2024 12:42

I know that many have poo pooed the idea that the Lib Dems are going to smash it this election, but I am really pissed off that Ed Davey is allowed to jump about on trampolines and swimming pools without being quizzed on his own policies.

It feels as if he is being shielded from having to open his mouth.

There are going to be a lot of yellow seats south of the M4 come Friday.

ResisterOfTwaddleRex · 30/06/2024 12:51

That's a fair point, Madcats

tothesea · 30/06/2024 12:52

Has anyone that emailed their Labour Candidates had any replies. Mine came back very quickly with the scripted answer including keeping’sex-based’ spaces safe for biological women.
So I asked the question that I wished Angela Rayner had been asked ‘Do you believe that transwoman are women and if so do you believe,as woman, they are entitled to access single sex spaces, services and sports’
My follow up question was ‘How do the Labour Party intend to protect women and girls if they support trans identifying men accessing the above spaces’

This was her answer..

Transwomen are transwomen

That’s it ..no other clarification.

I’m not sure what to think. I’m going down the road that she agrees with me but hands are tied. However making that statement in an email..😮

SlightlyJaded · 30/06/2024 12:55

This is brilliant and terrible all at the same time.

Brilliant for all the reasons already stated
Terrible because I genuinely now have noone to vote for.

lcakethereforeIam · 30/06/2024 12:56

I emailed mine over a week ago, heard fuck all back. It's a shame I was quite proud of my email.

Mylovelygreendress · 30/06/2024 12:57

@tothesea

This is the answer I received which was identical to the message a friend in a different constituency received !

I believe in singles sex safe spaces for women and girls and that there are only two biological sexes.

tothesea · 30/06/2024 13:05

Interesting…that’s the bit that needs to be drilled down into. It seems the word ‘biological’ may now also had its meaning changed by transactivism.
My candidate admitted that transwomen are transwomen
Surely in the Labour Party that is classed as transphobia!

SidewaysOtter · 30/06/2024 13:26

tothesea · 30/06/2024 13:05

Interesting…that’s the bit that needs to be drilled down into. It seems the word ‘biological’ may now also had its meaning changed by transactivism.
My candidate admitted that transwomen are transwomen
Surely in the Labour Party that is classed as transphobia!

Yes, in the way that someone - Windy, I think - said something along the lines of "I am a woman and I'm biological therefore I am a biological woman" Hmm

ifIwerenotanandroid · 30/06/2024 14:12

I like this answer:

'Bless him . He'll suddenly develop clarity on July 5th , of that I'm sure .'

Chariothorses · 30/06/2024 14:52

One thing this election campaign has demonstrated is that many of our potential MPs are totally without personal integrity, lie and mislead without guilt and will happily remove female basic human rights... Nolan principles anyone?

www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-7-principles-of-public-life/the-7-principles-of-public-life--2

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 16:22

srailfonaidraug · 29/06/2024 11:27

No meaningful solutions from any quarter for any of the catastrophic shambles the right have put this country in, including forcing the Labour Party to emulate them in order to avoid being beasted by a media that couldn’t even be trusted to extend basic decency to a dead teenage girl and her family.

Clearly no shortage of vacuously meaningless kudos to go round for visionless bickering, complete with strawman extrapolation and juvenile whataboutery, though.

We really are done for.

Not entirely sure what your trying to say.

But have no fear, starmer will be PM next Friday. Sadly.

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 16:35

ifIwerenotanandroid · 29/06/2024 15:36

I've been pondering this. Two things occurred to me:

  1. How would KS reply if it was a TW who rang in? Would we hear a clearer answer?
  2. When a party is as unclear about its intentions on an issue as Labour are about this one, so that no voter can say with any certainty WHAT Labour intend to do if they're elected, does that mean that a new Labour government can't claim they have a mandate from the people to carry out whatever it is they're currently not being upfront about? And does that also affect the agreement whose name escapes me but which has been mentioned this week, that if something's in the manifesto it doesn't go through the House of Lords because it's taken to be the will of the people, as they voted for it?

It seems to me that if a party's manifesto is unclear or self-contradictory, & voters question the future PM & he still doesn't resolve that but leaves voters not knowing what he will do or how he will resolve internal contradictions, then he doesn't have a mandate on those issues at all & he has no idea what the will of the people is.

Well if I ever get chance to ask starmer myself, I'll be a transmen for that time.

I think it was SNP that were fuzzy about what they were doing in their manifesto, but then took voting for them as a yes you can do this. And did it.

Although I know nothing about a second house or anything else in Scottish politics.

ifIwerenotanandroid · 30/06/2024 16:56

@Bodeganights You could be a TW. I think it would be interesting to see whether KS stuck to avoiding the question, or whether faced with a TW desperate to know who was allowed in the Ladies, he'd be all reassuring. You trap more flies with honey than with vinegar, as they say...

srailfonaidraug · 30/06/2024 18:04

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 16:22

Not entirely sure what your trying to say.

But have no fear, starmer will be PM next Friday. Sadly.

Not everyone gets it and that’s fine.

Everyone and their dog knows that and it’s plenty reason to fear. Sadly.

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 18:33

ifIwerenotanandroid · 30/06/2024 16:56

@Bodeganights You could be a TW. I think it would be interesting to see whether KS stuck to avoiding the question, or whether faced with a TW desperate to know who was allowed in the Ladies, he'd be all reassuring. You trap more flies with honey than with vinegar, as they say...

Well if you hear of an opportunity to ask him questions let me know soonest. I'm willing. I have a pretty deep voice for a woman, I could pass either way.
My question will be the same though

We can have single sex spaces, or we can believe people can change sex, which is your party going with?

ifIwerenotanandroid · 30/06/2024 18:49

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 18:33

Well if you hear of an opportunity to ask him questions let me know soonest. I'm willing. I have a pretty deep voice for a woman, I could pass either way.
My question will be the same though

We can have single sex spaces, or we can believe people can change sex, which is your party going with?

I'm always late to the party, so I hope someone else can tip you off if an opportunity arises.

I think there may be a problem with your question, though, in that it's possible to believe both those things at once. I was thinking more of saying that you're worried by some of the things that have been said on TV & you're seeking reassurance that you'll be able to use women's spaces & will you need to get a GRC to do that? And will you be able to use women's spaces straight away, as soon as you apply for one?

FlirtsWithRhinos · 30/06/2024 19:29

I think my question for Starmer would simply be "Do you agree with people who think men and women have different types of mind?"

Bodeganights · 30/06/2024 19:32

ifIwerenotanandroid · 30/06/2024 18:49

I'm always late to the party, so I hope someone else can tip you off if an opportunity arises.

I think there may be a problem with your question, though, in that it's possible to believe both those things at once. I was thinking more of saying that you're worried by some of the things that have been said on TV & you're seeking reassurance that you'll be able to use women's spaces & will you need to get a GRC to do that? And will you be able to use women's spaces straight away, as soon as you apply for one?

Right, well we have a while to refine the question.

Any more ideas. I'd like to make it short, and only a yes or no answer. If I get the chance of course.

lcakethereforeIam · 30/06/2024 19:39

I'd like to ask about the GRC secrecy clause, if you can't ask to see it then how can you tell which men have one and which don't? I think this has contributed hugely to the defacto self id. Well, that and the 'proposing to undergo' gender reassignment in the EA, which has been interpreted that some bloke doing nothing more than idly considering it becomes protected.

UpThePankhurst · 30/06/2024 20:48

The point is, that you can't.

You therefore have to assume that any man who walks into a woman's space has one.

It's totally unworkable, and needs to mean that no men in women's single sex spaces, at all, ever, regardless of surgery, paperwork or anything else, and third spaces provided for those who do not wish to use the provision of their sex.

It's also irrelevant, as a man having a piece of paper makes no difference to the experience of the woman needing to use that space, and makes no difference to the women who cannot use a mixed sex space - which the man has made it by walking in. Which means that he meets his needs at the expense of hers, and excludes her from all provision so that he may take his preferred choice from all the provisions.

And it becomes an action of male dominance, sexism, exclusion and harm, and excludes some women from all provisions and equality of access to society.

Mr Starmer does not want to talk about those women, at least not in front of the electorate before an election. But considering he is deeply concerned about the indignity to a man of a paperwork procedure but not at all about the indignity of a woman having to undress and pee beside any random man who wishes to be present, and seems to feel that the woman having to do this somehow helps and makes it up to distressed men and women should just accept this, it's not difficult to imagine why this might be.

DuesToTheDirt · 30/06/2024 21:15

@UpThePankhurst It's also irrelevant, as a man having a piece of paper makes no difference to the experience of the woman needing to use that space, and makes no difference to the women who cannot use a mixed sex space - which the man has made it by walking in. Which means that he meets his needs at the expense of hers, and excludes her from all provision so that he may take his preferred choice from all the provisions.

Very well put.