Is Liz Fraser helping all women or just herself?

[Cambridgebunz]

Liz Fraser boldly claims across all mediums that she aims to help all women live their best lives. However, there are suggestions, allegations, and evidence to the contrary.

What are your thoughts on the validity of her recent postings in the realm of domestic violence, parenting, mental health, neurodiversity, travel, running, holistic wellbeing and more, as a self-promoted "influencer"?

Keep your thoughts wholesome, relatable and current to her most recent postings. Do not mention ex-partners or her children by name. This discussion is to better understand the objective of and validity behind her “work” and words.

Unfortunately her frequent half naked selfies on social media make it difficult to take her seriously as someone who is supporting women. They seem very competitive/look at me.
If she really wants to support women she could use her platform to share and support them but as it is, it’s all ‘me,me,me’.

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i fail to see how she can be helping women by asking for donations then going on holiday and taking photos of doorways/ balconies and declaring that they’re helping other women.

likewise asking for donations pretending she cannot pay the bills then posting daily photos of her coffee in Missing Bean.

OMG those naked photos.

She is DESPERATE.

Perhaps take a leaf out of other SM users Davinia Taylor for one. She uses her platform to educate and does really valuable Q& A lives. It’s made me think about my relationship with exercise, food and alcohol.
She is also a Sunday Times best seller.

The woman from Carry On?!

A very good topic for this discussion. I have not seen evidence of her supporting or being an advocate for women in the 30 plus years I have known, and known of her.

I was interested in her latest Instagram post. I have no issue with nude shots in the right context and think it’s a good topic to discuss being comfortable in one’s own skin. But as one who has written so openly about her own self-harm and eating disorders in the recent past I find it interesting that she sees herself as someone who is so happy in herself when so often what she writes shows she is anything but. My own opinion is that it would be far more helpful to other women to own her mistakes and learn from them rather than always being right (or wronged) in every scenario. The only way that’s helpful to me personally as is an example of how not to live my life

Just by referring to ADHD as a mental health issue, she is actively NOT helping women.

@Pumpkinqueenz its interesting you bring in Davina Taylor. There are a lot of parallels.

Similarities:

1.	Both grew up in wealthy families with millionaire parents, which provided them with privileged upbringings. 
2.	Both have four children, with different fathers, indicating complex relationship situations.
3.	Both have faced personal challenges related to mental health and addiction issues. However, Liz Fraser’s struggles with mental illness and addiction appear to continue, whereas Davina Taylor has overcome her past issues and transformed her life, becoming an advocate for wellness and sharing her experiences to help others. To my eye, Liz advocates for no one but herself, certainly not for women.
4.	Both have written books that share their personal experiences and insights related to their struggles and journeys toward recovery. 
5. Both are seemingly fixated on physical appearance, weight and promoting body shapes and fitness levels hard to achieve and maintain for most women. 

Therefore, the £million question might be, can privilege create more problems for girls growing up than it solves?

I have read the ‘Coming Clean’ threads and seen her social posts. Liz Fraser clearly likes to attract attention (which surely social media is for?) and there are some long-running accusations of poor moral and social behaviour. But these accusations are all hidden in a cloak of anonymity. Plus a lot of
MN posts ‘picking apart’ every social post she makes, even on quite innocuous subjects (Breakfasts? Converse? Travel? Paragliding? Cycling? I don’t really see the problem, even if she does some of it without items of clothing that other people might see as essential). Some of the sustained criticism feels quite unpleasant and its motivation can only be guessed.

I wouldn’t gel with Liz Fraser, but she is a woman living her life, making her own choices and has not committed any crime, as far as I know.

If someone feels that there is a story in the public interest (as she has previously been a public figure of sorts) and can assemble information that a journalist will stand by, then they should do so.

If someone feels that any wrongdoing has taken place and has proof then they should report it to the relevant authorities.

I said my piece on Thread 2, but was quickly drowned out and accused of being a LF stooge.

In terms of ‘validity’, Liz Fraser is a woman, a mother, a runner and is as entitled to speak about those subjects as the next person. I think that could be seen as a feminist stance.

Though she very often makes moral judgements which seem to apply to everyone but her. I won’t outline the more recent ones here because it’s prudent not to do so but I think she would be wise to live by the motto if you live in a glass house you should not throw stones especially in the public domain. also if you are a public figure putting things on record in a public way (books, newspapers etc) it is useful to remember what you have said in the past so you don’t openly contradict yourself time and again. Again this is all in the public domain and often used to moralize

I don't think she helps anyone by talking about herself all the time, how would it?

• Because she's an inspiring role model on "succeeding despite"? no, because despite what? She was born with everything, and she is apparently still fixated at nearly 50 on how skinny and pretty she is. And what is she succeeding at?
• because she's "raising awareness" of things which are difficult and deserve attention? But the awareness makes her, and everyone else by extension, look terrible. If I had ADHD I would be desperate for her to shut up about it.

This is kind of unfair because she has written a handful of books and appears to have had a serviceable writing career in corporate stuff too. So I guess you couldn't call her useless, or a failure. It's just her soc-med is such a car crash it's wildly out of proportion - she posts all the time about nothing except feats like Making Breakfast or Nearly Getting Dressed so it's easy to forget that having written some books is something that actually happened.

I think she is very damaged, reputationally but perhaps more deeply, like literally psychologically damaged, by social media. If I was close to her I would do an intervention and basically get her into rehab off soc med. If there is such a thing.

She positions herself as a survivor of domestic abuse. Does she mean the stuff she writes about in Coming Clean?

@trytopullyoursocksup yes the domestic abuse claims are the ones raised in Coming Clean. From that book it was a mutually abusive relationship with appalling behaviour from both of them,

Despite being written by Liz , arguably I would say she comes off ( from her own accounts) as the more ‘abusive’ one, coercive control, hysterical control, screaming abusing and she references them both being physical and aggressive.

major difference is one was extremely unwell with addiction and the other 12 years older and very much chasing the relationship.

it was very uncomfortable reading either way especially when she was taking the baby into rowdy bars to look for him at night and putting up house in friend’s parents houses ( instead of hotels she could afford or her own local parents) and then getting kicked out for screaming abuse on the phone to the point of neighbours complaining. LF also got investigated by social services after her GP contacted them ( all public information in the book)z

the ‘abuse’ narrative bizarrely/interestingly came after the book was published and Liz had been ‘left’. Because the end chapters of the book call ‘m’ amazing, incredible, brilliant , amazing dad and stepdad etc..

As pointed out in the other thread @BadSkiingMum many are worried about influencing vulnerable women and asking for donations inappropriately with a misrepresentation of facts

likewise, calling yourself a parent expert despite literally being checked by child services

its murky behaviour that goes quite a bit beyond lots of harmless selfies..

Exactly @Burgundybrin. ADHD is not a mental illness. Liz, how many times must we tell you this? How many times will you continue to spread a false narrative that fuels the stigma. A stigma that continues the narrative that ADHD is not a feminist issue. #f@ckthestigma? My AssDHD Liz!

In other words, we know some people view ADHD as a less relevant or important issue in feminist discussions, possibly due to misunderstandings or stereotypes about ADHD.

This perspective ignores the intersectionality of ADHD, which means that it can affect people of all genders and backgrounds and that understanding these intersections is essential in addressing the challenges faced by individuals with ADHD from feminist and social justice perspectives.

Adult ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder) is not a mental illness. It’s a neurodevelopmental disorder and it’s not one size fits all. It manifests differently in individuals.

Symptoms, severity and how it affects daily life can vary from person to person. The presentation of symptoms can vary based on the specific type of ADHD (Inattentive type, Hyperactive-Impulsive type or Combined type).

Additionally, the severity of symptoms can vary from mild to severe. This is why diagnosis and treatment should be conducted by a qualified healthcare professional.

Also because while ADHD is a standalone condition, people with ADHD often have comorbidities, including anxiety disorders, depression, learning disabilities, oppositional defiant disorder (ODD), conduct disorder (CD), substance use disorders, bipolar disorder, borderline personality disorder (BPD), Tourette syndrome and sleep disorders. Addressing these alongside ADHD is crucial.

ADHD itself does not cause individuals to make poor decisions, just as a broken bone doesn’t. You might choose to make a poor decision while in a cast, but the break is not to blame.

ADHD is ADHD. A broken bone is a broken bone. A substance use disorder is a substance use disorder. One may have an addiction alongside a broken bone and/or ADHD, but ADHD isn’t why the drink was taken to cause a person to fall to break the bone…

People advocating for individuals with ADHD must emphasise to the rest of the world that ADHD is not a "get out of jail free card."

The majority of us, who are living, parenting, working and maintaining monogamy with ADHD while advocating for the ADHD community, do not present markedly different to anyone else. We have had to acquire the skill of masking to conform to a 'neurotypical' world. Our primary challenges are directed inwardly and frequently, we are often the ones evading confrontation and conflict because we simply don’t have the energy.

Having closely followed Liz Fraser and experienced the challenges of my own and my child's encounters with domestic violence, financial abuse, mental illness and the escalating cost of living while working full time as a single parent and navigating redundancy, nothing in her claims to help "women like me" is proving beneficial. In fact, it's triggering because it feels so distant from my own experiences.

Let's consider the aspect of travel, for instance. Liz suggests that I should explore the world. How? I am working full time, single-handedly parenting my child, dealing with minimal disposable income, coping with a chronic health condition and ADHD and feeling depressed and overwhelmed by all the hardships life has thrown my way.

NHS waiting lists are so lengthy that my disposable income is allocated to private diagnoses, counselling and private prescriptions. In the past ten years, I've taken fewer holidays than she has in this current year alone. I suspect I’ve earned a lot more and paid more taxes too, but I can’t circumvent the NHS like she appears to do.

I don't think it helps women that she portrays herself as if her main value to herself is being pretty, desirable and thin. I think it encourages others to see women in the same way. She would deny that these are her values which is why I say "she portrays herself as if -" - of course I can't see into her heart but her insta looks and reads as if nothing matters more. Most of us are average looking or plain, so where does that leave us? She can't help being pretty of course. It's just that she keeps doing these smirky selfies and bikini shots.

Other than taking money off women for nothing (if she has), and the car crash of her personal life, which has obviously taken some toll on individual women, I think that is the main thing that she does that actively damages women: playing into and amplifying a patriarchal value system that sets us against each other on the basis of sexiness and thinness.

@Umbrellaisback
@GreekDogRescue

Re the naked and semi-naked shots, once again she has totally missed the point! Far from being relieved that "the case is already closed down" she decides to post an openly goading and provocative message to show that she knows best.

Back in September I was very close to writing to Ofsted about her behaviour in the public domain and my concerns about her being on the governing body of a primary school. I decided against because I don't have an axe to grind against the school but it does leave me with serious questions about their awareness of the safeguarding agenda, appropriate behaviour and adults as role models.

As far as her role as a governor of a school is concerned her relationship with her body (healthy or otherwise) is totally irrelevant. Her behaviour in the public domain, however, is not. The images she posts are on an open public platform potentially seen by staff, parents and children at the school (and Ofsted should they care to look}.

It is also a matter of concern that in September she accused a person, whom she named, of being a c*t for mildly suggesting that she caption her videos for those with access needs. And more recently she publicly "named and shamed" a follower and called her a btch. She has threads taken down on here for less than that.

She also regularly posts pictures of her child and friends in their school uniform which is a breach of those children's privacy.

If anyone on here has the ear of the headteacher at her child's school they might like to mention this before another complaint is made.

Re post above - ignore the bold bits. I forgot that the asterisks give an instruction to bold which only happens once the post goes up 😡

@Intriguedbythis
I have read the threads and do understand that people have concerns about influencers asking for money, but the Fundraising Regulator or an investigative journalist would be the place to take them.

How does anyone know who someone is or the truth of what they say online?

Until that point is reached, I am just not sure that it justifies dozens upon dozens of MN posts picking apart Liz Fraser’s clothing choices, croissant-eating, running, swimming or even her choice to cycle more ‘exposed’ than most.

This is the feminism section and I would suggest that there are bigger threats to women than Liz Fraser.

@BadSkiingMum

I take the points you make, and I would agree, if it weren't for my personal experience of the "Liz Fraser Treatment". What she did to me and my life was unforgivable and she compounded her bad behaviour by being remorseless and punitive and twisting things to make is sound as though she was being victimised by me. Nothing could have been further from the truth; I would have been overjoyed never to have had Liz Fraser anywhere near my life, ever (I used to bargain with the universe for that to be so!)

I wrote a long piece about it on the last thread that was taken down. I was very effectively silenced by Liz Fraser and it took a lot for me to say something publicly. It was MY LIVED EXPERIENCE! Not spite, jealousy or abuse which is what we get accused of.

This thread helped me to feel that I am not alone. That people see through the "Liz the saint and martyr" facade. And you have no idea what that feels like (at least I am assuming and hoping you don't).

@Verity44
Absolutely, if you have genuine concerns, make it official.