We are going to end up with a Conservative government AGAIN at this rate, is that ok with everyone?

[MentholLoad]

following a thread on AIBU I think about who would vote Tories again.....the main (only?) reason people are citing for voting Tories is the GC issue. Women totally abandoning social politics over a singular issue. declaring nothing else matters, if Labour can't get this right then, they won't vote for them

I can't work out if these people were Conservative voter's anyway/actually do agree that Conservative policy and practice generally, is in our best interests compared with Labour

OR they are prioritising GC issues above and at the exclusion of all else? because alot more women will have a lot more issues, if we have yet another round of Conservative Government

And they are ignoring that Labour (finally!) defined women as adult human female

AND ignoring that this whole debacle has happened under the Tories 🤷🏼‍♀️

Basically given the importance I doubt any superfluous steps were done for a jolly

The KC is very well regarded and all looks legit

Oh the victimhood.🙄 No one has called the Tories evil. Incompetent, misogynist, corrupt, but not evil.

I literally would vote for whoever is not a tory, because what we have now is the most awful bunch of evil, selfish and incompetent chances I have ever seen.

@TooBigForMyBoots I’m happy to call them evil! 😜 Evil evil evil. Every fucking one of them. 🤬

What is really pathetic is that they will be bailed and back out until the hearing.

Given the pathetic rate of rape convictions it makes you wonder why that bothered to pick this particular crime since it will make very little difference to the substantive issue.

Victimhood? What?

Honestly, the reading comprehension on this thread.

I'm curious to know what those who are planning to vote Tory in order to protect the rights of women think about the latest guidance from the MoJ not to send rapists to jail because the prisons are apparently full. Is this OK with you as long as we're clear on biology?

The irony! Your own reading comprehension doesn't appear to be up to much!

I didn't write that article!

Of course we cannot circumvent the SC now and neither should we, its clear the govt didn't follow the appeals process and the ECHR, told us to do so, they stopped 1 person from leaving, the remain SIX appealed under UK law.

So lets forget about the ECHR, we had a bloody great plane, 24k migrants told they could be deported, up to 1000 places in Rwanda but we were sending SEVEN people, they d have been more flight crew on that plane!

Why do you think they were sending just 7 ? they knew very well there would be a legal challenge, like a lot of things, it was all PR & very poor planning, just as we saw on the 'Bibby.

Thats Labours fault, Blair didn't build enough prisons.

I didn’t say you did write the article. I’m not seeing anything to back up your view that any step could have been avoided.

They don’t actually need to send many, as soon as smugglers and those who pay them realise the outcome is Rwanda it will be hard to sell the journey for thousands £/€

Btw they won’t send people already here. It’s those who arrive only as it’s a deterrent. Not many would choose it

How much is the empty Bibby Stockholm costing? And the payments to Rwanda and the costs of all the court challenges? All that money just being spaffed up the wall for a performative "deterrent".

Lots of these people on small boats risk their lives to cross the Med and risk them again to cross the channel. If death isn't a deterrent, why would Rwanda be?

So thats dependent on the migrants knowing this would happen and if they know just a tiny % risk deportation and it doesn't apply to families who get here via unsafe means, i.e boats lorries.

Australia worked because everyone was sent back, all boats intercepted turned around.

Why would’t people know. They are in close proximity to each other and have personal devices

It’s not a tiny risk it’s a 100% risk if you are in the first thousand

Would you pay to end up in Rwanda?

doesn't apply to families who get here via unsafe means, i.e boats

What do you mean?

Because it’s not the U.K.

Well we might have to agree to disagree. I think if you've already risked your life several times over, a 1-2% chance (tops) that you will be caught and deported to Rwanda isn't going to be much of a deterrent.

If the first 1000 are sent it won’t be 1% it will be 100%

That’s how it works because you need the first 1000 people to pay to go to Rwanda

1000 people is less than a weeks worth of asylum seekers. And it won't be a deterrent as the journey takes months so the next people will already be on their way.
You are also still assuming we somehow intercept them all, which we don't and can't given our underfunded public services. What this policy does is provide a further incentive for people not to report to the authorities when they get here, which is counter productive (unless you are a bean counter focussed on making the recorded numbers go down, rather than actually reducing people coming).

It's a ridiculous policy, very easy to pick holes in and clearly designed to look tough, while doing very little. Typical of this government.

Govt policy is that families wont be spilt up (Rwanda is voluntary for them) and children getting here on their own wont be either but upon reaching 18, they might be!

On a calm day over 800 have and do arrive, in the 2 weeks that it will take to process anyone sent to Rwanda, 1000s will arrive.

Its no deterrent at all, its all politics.

They leave from the French border it doesn’t take months

The channel is a pretty busy path, if the RNLI can detect to help with what little they have it can’t be that difficult

i know many don’t want it on mn but the world is getting more volatile and climate is impacting so the electorate will likely demand more action

I stumbled across this blog yesterday by accident and it sums it up for me: “Fellow moderates, let’s not be too late to the party.I consider myself pretty much the middle of the middle when it comes to politics. I’m way left of hard right and way right of hard left. I haven’t always voted the same way and I’ve never considered becoming a member of a political party but I’ve suddenly had a mega watt serious realisation that I’m wrong (it doesn’t happen often). And as converts always need to convert others I’m going to try to persuade every moderate I know get with my bold ‘new’ idea and join a political party too.(For those who only read the headline plus two pararaphs of articles, the punchline is this; if us moderates don’t get involved and join parties, it’s going to be the nutters at the extremes of politics who will choose our leaders and our country’s direction.)I’m not talking to everyone here, just people who consider themselves pretty middle of the road politically. People, who, like me have found themselves thinking things along the lines of;1. I could never publicly declare myself to be a labour/conservative (delete as appropriate) supporter because I find the voice of the extreme edge of the party so hideously contrary to everything I believe in and those voices seems to be all anyone talks about these days. I can’t be associated with these people/opinions!2. Politics is so annoying and sad and broken it’s hopeless. As far as I can work out every single problem we face as a parish, a district, a county, a country, a continent and as a world is incredibly complex and there are no easy solutions. The more I look into anything, the more it seems impossible to come up with the headline solutions that are demanded of politicians in today’s world. It’s all just too hard.3. Is it even fair to say that all politicians we ever hear about at the moment seem to be out of touch/egotistical/sinister or totally out of their depth?4. What the hell difference will I be able to make? I have little enough time as it is, do I have time to get engaged politically anyway?So you lot who are still reading, please just read a bit further. Every single one of those four things are the way they are because us moderates are too moderate to get off the fence. I’m going to say at least half the country are moderates. We massively outnumber the hard left and we massively outnumber the hard right. But because we all stick on the fence looking cool and being oh-so-balanced our voices are not heard.Recently I’ve got to know some politicians. Through my various roles I get to meet quite a number of district, county and national politicians from all over the place and all over the political spectrum. Nearly every one I’ve met is more impressive than I would have expected, working properly hard for the benefit of their constituents, and really so much more 3-D than any press/social media headlines/cartoons would have us believe. If you don’t believe me, have a little look at Tom Tugendhat (MP for Tonbridge) or listen to any of the back catalogue of Nick Robinson’s Political Thinking Podcast.And as I say, finally I plucked up courage to join a party. I genuinely don’t think it matters which one, I just think it’s important to join one if you are a moderate. It’s dead cheap and you don’t have to do anything at all if you don’t want to. I went along to a parish meeting where a new district councillor was being chosen to replace one who was retiring. There were twenty people in the room. TWENTY PEOPLE people! Twenty people were voting to choose between the five candidates and at the end of the hour-long process Kemsing’s candidates for that party for the forthcoming District Council elections had been chosen. This is echoed all around the country, tiny groups of people making the vital decisions about who will represent us. We should be flooding those rooms with moderates to vote in moderates to represent us at every level of government. Let’s join the party.”

They leave from the French border it doesn’t take months

It takes months from leaving their countries of origin.

The channel is a pretty busy path, if the RNLI can detect to help with what little they have it can’t be that difficult

Migrants phone the coastguard in many cases.

i know many don’t want it on mn but the world is getting more volatile and climate is impacting so the electorate will likely demand more action

We all accept this, its what will work thats up for debate.

So since Covid the numbers of people classed as in poverty by the UN has gone up by 100m, the UK has halved its foreign aid budget, which has real terms affects on people, other countries done similar.

Most people do not want to leave everything they know for a very uncertain future, helping them in their own countries is one way to reduce migration (obv doesn't work for war zones) but we could be doing more to try and stop conflict.

Yes i agree voters will demand more, its likely as not we will see push back in the Med before too long.

The traffickers will pay 1000 Rwandans to come to the UK in order to be deported and job done, back to business as usual.

The Rwanda Scheme is nonsense.🙄

Where are you seeing families can stay?

Reading the bill overview it’s obvious that any loophole that encourages people to use children has been considered.