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Feminism: chat

Another celebrity womb renter

169 replies

userxchhrfok · 24/08/2023 15:31

Name changed as I've commented

Why do women not see the issue with people renting wombs?

www.instagram.com/p/CwNiYZLNtIK/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

OP posts:
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7
Shadowboy · 29/08/2023 17:54

BiggerBoat1 · 29/08/2023 16:49

Why so nasty?
The woman who acted as a surrogate had the right to make that choice. She presumably did so as an act of kindness and love. They are obviously incredibly grateful to her and delighted with their babies. Struggling to see the problem here.

Edited

Delighted with their babies?

that sounds like when I bought my coat in the sale. I was delighted with my purchase.

I feel desperately sad for the babies. No idea when they grow up who ‘mum’ is. The pimping of them from the second they were born on social media. Commodities from start to finish.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:55

Snowflake2023 · 29/08/2023 17:48

Using the term abuse is now a really clichéd argument to try to stop people raising their voices and asking important questions. Its a mechanism to shut down conversations.

Luckily though it's been so overused it's now becoming more of an indicator that people are asking the right questions. So thanks for validating that.

OK then you aren't abusing them , you are merely being nasty to or about them. I trust that clarifies the matter.

VeronicaSawyer89 · 29/08/2023 17:55

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:52

When I say they aren't I mean they aren't renting her body part. I assume you don't know the story behind this particular case

Ok then, they're using a woman's body part. Same principle.

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 17:55

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:53

YOU CAN SHOUT ALL YOU WANT, IT DOESNT MAKE IT SO

IT IS SO, REGARDLESS OF THE CASE I USE. FACT.

POOR BABIES.

MrsColinRobinson · 29/08/2023 17:56

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:53

YOU CAN SHOUT ALL YOU WANT, IT DOESNT MAKE IT SO

And you can continually spout utter claptrap but your argument still doesn't hold water.

I'm still waiting to hear why you have superior knowledge in this case.

Delphinium20 · 29/08/2023 17:56

Surrogacy is a vile business. Separating the baby from its mother at birth on purpose.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:59

VeronicaSawyer89 · 29/08/2023 17:55

Ok then, they're using a woman's body part. Same principle.

Her choice.

People have different opinions. Respect her opinion. I can understand if it is something you wouldn't want to do but noone is forcing anyone to do this.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:01

MrsColinRobinson · 29/08/2023 17:56

And you can continually spout utter claptrap but your argument still doesn't hold water.

I'm still waiting to hear why you have superior knowledge in this case.

People can have opposing views on all sorts of matters. Just because mine doesn't match yours doesn't make mine claptrap. I could say yours is equally claptrap but I won't because it is just your view.

I accept people can have different views about different things. If we met in real life I suspect there are lots of things we would agree about. It's just this isn't one.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:02

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 17:55

IT IS SO, REGARDLESS OF THE CASE I USE. FACT.

POOR BABIES.

Except it isn't a fact...

TheWayoftheLeaf · 29/08/2023 18:02

Giving them the surname Locke-Locke when both their surnames are Locke is a bit strange

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:03

Shadowboy · 29/08/2023 17:54

Delighted with their babies?

that sounds like when I bought my coat in the sale. I was delighted with my purchase.

I feel desperately sad for the babies. No idea when they grow up who ‘mum’ is. The pimping of them from the second they were born on social media. Commodities from start to finish.

The surrogate in this case is staying a part of their lives.

VeronicaSawyer89 · 29/08/2023 18:04

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 17:59

Her choice.

People have different opinions. Respect her opinion. I can understand if it is something you wouldn't want to do but noone is forcing anyone to do this.

Do you say the same to women selling their bodies for sex?

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 18:05

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:02

Except it isn't a fact...

It is. It’s grim and utterly selfish. Fact. Surely you cannot argue that they did this FOR the babies benefit?

Jellycats4life · 29/08/2023 18:05

TheWayoftheLeaf · 29/08/2023 18:02

Giving them the surname Locke-Locke when both their surnames are Locke is a bit strange

It’s almost like the commissioning and trafficking of embryos and babies across the world and up and down the U.K. is about their egos, with next to no consideration of what’s best for the children at all.

Pocketfullofdogtreats · 29/08/2023 18:05

I wonder if this is the couple who were interviewed on Radio 4 last week? I think it it. All lovely, their good friend Bex offered to carry a baby for them, she will continue to be a part of their lives, etc etc. But what made me feel extremely uncomfortable was when they said they had bought the egg from the US and had chosen a mother based on particular characteristics - they wanted their dch to be artistic so had chosen the egg from someone into musucal theatre, and other criteria to fit their idea of the right child for them. It really did sound like shopping for a new e.g car.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:08

VeronicaSawyer89 · 29/08/2023 18:04

Do you say the same to women selling their bodies for sex?

I accept in some case women selling their bodies for sex is not their choice but kn some cases it is. That is an entirely separate issue though and as with this there are different issues at play in each individual case.

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 18:08

Jellycats4life · 29/08/2023 18:05

It’s almost like the commissioning and trafficking of embryos and babies across the world and up and down the U.K. is about their egos, with next to no consideration of what’s best for the children at all.

No no it’s really good for the children. @Spirallingdownwards can tell us why

sadaboutmycat · 29/08/2023 18:08

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 15:41

I think Ollie and Gareth will be terrific parents. Bex their surrogate has been and apparently will be continued to be included in their lives. I think its pretty nasty of people who can't see that she has done a wonderful thing for a gay couple who will love, care and provide for their children.

Edited

I agree. I also think that unless you have been in this position as any party, whilst you absolutely can and will have opinions on it, the hyperbole and vitriol is inappropriate.
I was going to surrogate for friends of mine when she became infertile following an horrific miscarriage. In the end they opted for adoption. Absolutely their choice. But I did not feel like tent a womb at any time.

MrsColinRobinson · 29/08/2023 18:08

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:01

People can have opposing views on all sorts of matters. Just because mine doesn't match yours doesn't make mine claptrap. I could say yours is equally claptrap but I won't because it is just your view.

I accept people can have different views about different things. If we met in real life I suspect there are lots of things we would agree about. It's just this isn't one.

Indeed they can. I however am not the person picking up on other's responses throughout the thread and claiming to know so much about this one particular celebrity occurrence.

It doesn't matter who they are, babies are still not something to be marketed.

DappledOliveGroves · 29/08/2023 18:09

The bottom line with surrogacy is that you are commissioning a baby, in the full knowledge that as soon as that infant is born, you are going to take it away from the most important person in its life - its mother. Newborns need mothers. They are biologically designed to need their mothers. And yet people create babies, knowing full well that they will be deprived of this most basic need, for their own gratification.

Yes, children are adopted. Children are taken into care. But no-one pretends that it's a happy outcome. It's a necessary evil to protect the child in some circumstances, where there may be violence or addiction issues. Or where a birth mother cannot take care of a child for whatever reason. But it's still a trauma to that infant. And yet surrogacy is somehow dressed up as some kind of act of altruism, without a thought for the poor baby, taken from its mother.

Pocketfullofdogtreats · 29/08/2023 18:09

In which case they are bound to be disappointed when little Tristan turns out to be nerdy and only interested in maths.

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:09

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 18:05

It is. It’s grim and utterly selfish. Fact. Surely you cannot argue that they did this FOR the babies benefit?

Unfortunately your logic is entirely flawed. Did you have kids or people you know who have kids have them for the babies benefit, or because they wanted to be parents?

Snowflake2023 · 29/08/2023 18:10

When do you think the first lawsuits from the surrogacy babies will appear?

I'm thinking 10-15 years, probably in the US. Maybe 14th Amendment violation (Civil Rights)? interested to see what angle you would see in terms of legal challenge.

It will be easy to piece together the intent using surrogacy contract and proof of payment. Any contract can be overturned if considered unlawful by a court.

sadaboutmycat · 29/08/2023 18:11

mikado1 · 29/08/2023 16:40

What is the point about seeing their surrogates face?!

I don't think likening surrogacy to rape is useful in getting across the view of surrogacy as problematic.

Consent being at the heart of that!

MoggyMittens23 · 29/08/2023 18:13

Spirallingdownwards · 29/08/2023 18:09

Unfortunately your logic is entirely flawed. Did you have kids or people you know who have kids have them for the babies benefit, or because they wanted to be parents?

No hang on. I said this is not the best thing for the babies. You said not so. So you answer me first. How is THIS way of being brought into the world good for the babies?