Feminism: chat
Why Southall Black Sisters made the difficult decision not to attend the Palace’s domestic violence event
IwantToRetire · 06/12/2022 15:51
... During internal conversations, arguments for accepting the invitation ranged from: it would be a good opportunity to raise awareness of the discriminatory treatment received by migrant women when escaping violence; we need to make a distinction between an event to celebrate the coronation/monarchy versus an event to garner attention for violence against women and girls; increased visibility could lead to increased funding which was important for the services we run. Unspoken, but nonetheless apparent, was the human desire for recognition that such an invitation represented.
The arguments against included perceptions that it was a PR exercise for Camilla and it would make the Palace look good at our expense; there was no invitation to speak, only attend, which meant that we couldn’t even get our message across to the great and good; there was, no mention of funding attached to Camilla’s work on domestic violence (DV) on her official page. ...
Archived from an opinion piece in the "i" newspaper archive.ph/aVKqe
I was curious why this was in the "i" newspaper behind a paywall but not on their web site, but thought I would share as it looks at how women's groups, especially those from BME communities have, to choose between playing the game and sticking to principles / their politics.
But in checking their web site to see if maybe it had been published, I saw they have a statement up in support of Salman Rushdie, but not one in support of Sistah Space, so an now thinking maybe it was a bit odd to prioritise talking about why they didn't go rather than talking about the issue of racism. twitter.com/Sistah_Space/status/1597854380115767296
hmmmmmmm - so maybe there are two different discussions, institutional racism and compromises that women's group should or shouldn't take.
Reugny · 16/12/2022 15:19
TooBigForMyBoots · 16/12/2022 16:14
It's a call to the racists to stop. I'm not sure they'll listen.
I'm a bit 
at the amount of posters taking the ranty, intimidating twitter post to be the truth. It's a common enough MRA tactic, regularly used against women who speak out that I thought the readers of these pages would be familiar with it.
TooBigForMyBoots · 16/12/2022 16:28
HaveYouSeenNancy · 15/12/2022 07:20
I can't help but wonder why NF did the whole media round. To court so much media attention with so much to hide just seems bizarre.
But that's just it, none of it was hidden. She hasn't been hiding anything. There will be an investigation and until that is complete, we don't know if she did anything wrong.
Ngozi Fulani and the clients and staff at Sistah Space are being subjected to racist and misogynist abuse by creepy internet neckbeards. It's fucking disgusting and is an attack on all women.
Shelefttheweb · 17/12/2022 23:21
TooBigForMyBoots · 16/12/2022 16:28
But that's just it, none of it was hidden. She hasn't been hiding anything. There will be an investigation and until that is complete, we don't know if she did anything wrong.
Ngozi Fulani and the clients and staff at Sistah Space are being subjected to racist and misogynist abuse by creepy internet neckbeards. It's fucking disgusting and is an attack on all women.
HaveYouSeenNancy · 15/12/2022 07:20
I can't help but wonder why NF did the whole media round. To court so much media attention with so much to hide just seems bizarre.
Are you saying you don’t believe the women who say they were denied support because they were mixed race?
IwantToRetire · 18/12/2022 18:49
Shinyredbicycle no idea what you are referring to, and as I dont believe that find it hard to accept I said it. However I do know that writing clearly is something I struggle with so if you can identify where you think what I wrote implied that would be happy to clarify.
RoseslnTheHospital · 18/12/2022 19:06
Shinyredbicycle · 18/12/2022 07:48
IWantToRetire I can't quote because I'm on my phone, but early on in this thread you say that SBS are the reason that other services for black or Asian women struggle to receive funding.
Are you being serious?
I think you've completely misunderstood and misrepresented what the OP was saying in her post from 6th Dec 17:53 which was:
"Southall Black Sisters is a long established women's support group. But it has also become well known because of the work of its recently retired director Pragna Patel, not just because of SBS but also Women Against Fundamentalism and other campaigns. southallblacksisters.org.uk/
And with all due respect to her it has meant that other established women's groups working with BME communities dont often get the name recognition they deserve. For instance there is the Asian Women's Resource Centre www.asianwomencentre.org.uk/
And there are many others, though not as many as they used to be, because funding cuts have meant specialist services for BME women have been a target on the basis that if there is "a" women's service why do you need a specialist one. (???!!!)
There's a list here of some of the surviving ones www.imkaan.org.uk/get-help "
IwantToRetire · 19/12/2022 17:04
Dear oh dear, you seem all out to pick a fight Bicycle!!
I was talking about how the media like to isolate one indiviudal from what is a group effort, because part of their agenda is to underplay the power of group working.
I was also pointing out, that not just the media but groups who make decisions based on name recognition rather than substance, will go for a name. Pragna Patel became known, as did the other women who were part of Women Against Fundamentalism, a group set up in the wake of the Rushdie affairt. So being sloppy and lazy the media, and some groups, just go lets get SBS involved because they have name recognition not the work they do but because the Director has a high profile for an entirely different campaign.
And obviously the media chooses who they do or dont report. How is it possible that you could imply from what I said that somehow they had fallen under her influence. Just ridiculous.
This how the media and other have undermined what was the power of Women's Liberation. A large number of small groups that creating a network of women working against the patriarchy. The didn't need big names, they just did their work and campaigning by focusing on those who could help make change, whether it was local councils, funders, advertisers, MPs.
So for instance even though Germaine Greer basically wrote a book where she just cobbled together ideas already published by women with an established feminist background, the media made it seem like Germaine Greer had started feminism.
Just out of interest have you ever read a report or heard any describe what SBS actually does?
IwantToRetire · 19/12/2022 19:20
Just posting this because it seems similar to those eager to trash Sistah Space:
... The Kid's Company’s closure came shortly after police launched an investigation, which was later dropped, into unfounded allegations of abuse and exploitation at the charity following the broadcast of a BBC Newsnight report.
Last year, a bid to ban Ms Batmanghelidjh and seven ex-trustees from being company directors was rejected by a High Court judge.
Mrs Justice Falk said the public “need no protection from these trustees”, calling them “highly impressive and dedicated individuals”.
The commission had said it agreed with Mrs Justice Falk that there was no dishonesty, bad faith, or inappropriate personal gain in the charity’s operations.
In a joint statement, former trustees – including the BBC’s ex-creative director Alan Yentob – had said Mrs Justice Falk’s finding “made clear that there was no basis for concluding that there was mismanagement in the conduct of the charity’s affairs”. ...
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/camila-batmanghelidjh-kids-company-charity-commission-high-court-justice-b2247957.html
All a bit reminisant of Jeremy Clarkson. This hyper rage at WoC who they think are getting a bit above themselves.
Shinyredbicycle · 20/12/2022 03:42
Yes, I'm very uncomfortable with the 'exposes' about Sistah Space.
Having worked in and had contact with the charity sector for years, there are plenty which would crumble under the degree of intentionally critical scrutiny some Twitter accounts are putting SS under.
Picking on Sistah Space seems to be motivated by something other than wanting to ensure an appropriate use of public funds.
There was no doubt room for improvement in the way Kids Company was run, but not proportionate to the degree of abuse that it's CEO received.
TruckerBarbie · 21/12/2022 23:13
Shinyredbicycle · 20/12/2022 03:42
Yes, I'm very uncomfortable with the 'exposes' about Sistah Space.
Having worked in and had contact with the charity sector for years, there are plenty which would crumble under the degree of intentionally critical scrutiny some Twitter accounts are putting SS under.
Picking on Sistah Space seems to be motivated by something other than wanting to ensure an appropriate use of public funds.
There was no doubt room for improvement in the way Kids Company was run, but not proportionate to the degree of abuse that it's CEO received.
Either you're embezzling funds intended for the unfortunate or you're not. The fact other charities do it doesn't make it OK.
Alltheprettyseahorses · 22/12/2022 08:37
I've had a look at that twitter thread. 8 rambling and almost unreadable tweets before the amazing revelation that a woman called Rosanne sometimes signs herself as Rose. I mean, WOW! She's also had 2 surnames apparently and it's not like women often change surname from their maiden name on eg marriage is it? There are no details whether they're interchangeable which is standard professional usage anyway. I gave up at that point. How people ate giving that drivel the slightest bit of credence is beyond me.
SueVineer · 23/12/2022 00:22
TooBigForMyBoots · 16/12/2022 16:28
But that's just it, none of it was hidden. She hasn't been hiding anything. There will be an investigation and until that is complete, we don't know if she did anything wrong.
Ngozi Fulani and the clients and staff at Sistah Space are being subjected to racist and misogynist abuse by creepy internet neckbeards. It's fucking disgusting and is an attack on all women.
HaveYouSeenNancy · 15/12/2022 07:20
I can't help but wonder why NF did the whole media round. To court so much media attention with so much to hide just seems bizarre.
Who is abusing NF Or any staff? The twitter thread that was linked to earlier was factual and objective. It’s quite clear from the evidence posted that there are serious issues to be investigated.
SueVineer · 23/12/2022 00:27
TooBigForMyBoots · 22/12/2022 11:23
It reminded me of the ranty bollocks that was written about me and my colleagues when I worked with DA survivors.
Abusive men hate women, particularly strong women who speak out for and help other women.
people who oppose using a domestic abuse charity to defraud public money are not the misogynists here. Quite the opposite. If you support someone despite there being good evidence of misuse of public funds by them, you need to ask yourself why. Especially as there is little evidence the charity was ever doing anything charitable.
SueVineer · 23/12/2022 00:29
Shinyredbicycle · 22/12/2022 05:27
Indeed not.
The point is that other charities don't come under the same level of Twitter scrutiny.
And neither did SS until Ngozi had the audacity to publicly name the racism she experienced at BP.
It’s irrelevant even if true. Using a charity for black female victims of abuse to grift and defraud public money is utterly vile. Whether or not others are doing it is utterly irrelevant.
SueVineer · 23/12/2022 00:35
IwantToRetire · 16/12/2022 15:50
Thanks for the link. Unfortunately I dont think it will stop the twitterati now that they have got started.
I wonder if Sistah Space will ever re-open.
I think all it professed to do was run a shop selling overpriced items to people. Doubt there is really a great need for that.
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