Why Southall Black Sisters made the difficult decision not to attend the Palace’s domestic violence event

[IwantToRetire]

... During internal conversations, arguments for accepting the invitation ranged from: it would be a good opportunity to raise awareness of the discriminatory treatment received by migrant women when escaping violence; we need to make a distinction between an event to celebrate the coronation/monarchy versus an event to garner attention for violence against women and girls; increased visibility could lead to increased funding which was important for the services we run. Unspoken, but nonetheless apparent, was the human desire for recognition that such an invitation represented.

The arguments against included perceptions that it was a PR exercise for Camilla and it would make the Palace look good at our expense; there was no invitation to speak, only attend, which meant that we couldn’t even get our message across to the great and good; there was, no mention of funding attached to Camilla’s work on domestic violence (DV) on her official page. ...

Archived from an opinion piece in the "i" newspaper archive.ph/aVKqe

I was curious why this was in the "i" newspaper behind a paywall but not on their web site, but thought I would share as it looks at how women's groups, especially those from BME communities have, to choose between playing the game and sticking to principles / their politics.

But in checking their web site to see if maybe it had been published, I saw they have a statement up in support of Salman Rushdie, but not one in support of Sistah Space, so an now thinking maybe it was a bit odd to prioritise talking about why they didn't go rather than talking about the issue of racism. twitter.com/Sistah_Space/status/1597854380115767296

hmmmmmmm - so maybe there are two different discussions, institutional racism and compromises that women's group should or shouldn't take.

[Shelefttheweb]

Sistah Space have not come out of this as well as they hoped. It looked like a put up job. I can see why they might not want to align themselves with them.

[Brefugee]

Put up job or not (and I'm inclined to think they were being provocative) - SH should have stopped after "British I was born here" and this wouldn't be an issue.

[IwantToRetire]

I cant imagine how anyone would think it was a put up job.

Unless you think Lady whoever she is, is actually an agent for Meghan and Harry, who deliberately stepped over the line in the most socially (and politcaly) catastrophic way, to support their claims of institutional racism at Buckingham Palace.

Ngozi Fulani was a guest. A total stranger invaded her personal space by moving here hair, and then persisted in to continue to ask a question that is always instrusive, and would normally only come up in a situation where people had been talking for a while and might mutually decided to share information about heritage.

I knew as I posted the comment, I shouldn't have added the bit about Sistah Space as it was bound to end up victim blaming.

I should have stuck to my original idea of hightlighting the issue as outlined by Southall Black Sisters.

[Hooverphobe]

Camilla has been vocal about ending DV for decades - and yet you’re calling this “timely PR”? 🙄

[Hooverphobe]

Harry and Rachel would have to be fucking idiots to have done a “put up” job - because wouldn’t it be ENORMOUS hypocrisy were it revealed Diana asked Martin Bashir where he was “really” from.

[LadyKenya]

@Shelefttheweb

Sistah Space have not come out of this as well as they hoped. It looked like a put up job. I can see why they might not want to align themselves with them.

Care to explain how this could have been a put up job, as you describe it. I am all ears.

[RoseslnTheHospital]

I found it interesting to read about SBS and their rationale for not attending. I can see the pros and cons of both arguments, it's a valid discussion to have. I think I might have come down on the side of attending, in order to be able to talk to people with possible influence and to raise the profile. But I'm not in their position and can see how they came to their conclusion. It must be frustrating to be at events like this, politely shaking hands and making small talk when you know that the organisers and other attendees present could fund your organisation with their own personal wealth.

[frazzledasarock]

How on earth is Sistah Space, coming out of it looking bad?

they have done NOTHING wrong.

the racists want people to shut up and put. Well no, nowadays any type of negative behaviour is likely to be up in social media and going viral in seconds. No matter what the entitled racists think or want.

if lady racist didn’t want to be shown up as a racist that she is she shouldn’t have behaved in a racist hectoring manner.

[IwantToRetire]

@Hooverphobe not claiming I am the best writer in the world, but surely it was clear it was absurd to say Sistah Space hadn't come out of this well, when the Queen's favourite companion had behaved in a way that would never be acceptable in any situation. ie it was a JOKE although as we now know Netflix and followers have found it amazingly useful promotion for them.

And now I have done it. Gone down the derail rather than the issues raised by SBS. :'(

[BellaAmorosa]

@IwantToRetire
Camilla is genuinely committed to ending DV, but I think that's a reasonable decision by Southall Black Sisters. (The PR element would be about racism, not DV, @Hooverphobe)

Ngozi Fulani was a guest. A total stranger invaded her personal space by moving here hair, and then persisted in to continue to ask a question that is always instrusive, and would normally only come up in a situation where people had been talking for a while and might mutually decided to share information about heritage.

Hear hear.

You don't touch other adults without saying excuse me or something.Technically, under common law, even a hand on someone's shoulder, if uninvited, used to be an assault.

I get asked where I'm from despite my English first name and surname, boringly ordinary clothes, cropped hair and regional English accent. Because I'm black. So my betting is that Lady SH's questions were not prompted by Ngozi Fulani's dress or hairstyle.

People tell you you ought to support England sports teams etc but when push comes to shove you're not English..because you're black. You are "from" somewhere else that you and possibly even your parents have never been.

If Lady SH had genuinely been interested in Fulani's heritage, she could have asked that. Her questions seemed geared towards proving that Fulani isn't really English/British.

And how ignorant do you have to be to notice that there are Black English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish people? In the middle of the World Cup as well.
🙄

Yes, I've gone off on a tangent too, OP! 😀

[LadyKenya]

I hope that your thread can stay on track OP, I do not really know anything about SBS, so I am going to have a read up about them.

[IwantToRetire]

Southall Black Sisters is a long established women's support group. But it has also become well known because of the work of its recently retired director Pragna Patel, not just because of SBS but also Women Against Fundamentalism and other campaigns. southallblacksisters.org.uk/

And with all due respect to her it has meant that other established women's groups working with BME communities dont often get the name recognition they deserve. For instance there is the Asian Women's Resource Centre www.asianwomencentre.org.uk/

And there are many others, though not as many as they used to be, because funding cuts have meant specialist services for BME women have been a target on the basis that if there is "a" women's service why do you need a specialist one. (???!!!)

There's a list here of some of the surviving ones www.imkaan.org.uk/get-help

[IwantToRetire]

@BellaAmorosa You aren't really off topic as I did say there were two issues, I just didn't think the issue of institutional / inherent racism would become a suggestion that Ngozi Fulani being the problem!

[MsFogi]

@Shelefttheweb

Sistah Space have not come out of this as well as they hoped. It looked like a put up job. I can see why they might not want to align themselves with them.

They lost me when they suggested that Camilla's words were the equivalent of violence.

[BellaAmorosa]

Got you, @IwantToRetire

[IwantToRetire]

@fallfallfall - I can only assume you have been tuning in to GB news. Do you have evidence to support your slur?

Sistah Space, which for any women's group is a huge sucess, got a petition on the Government web site which led to a Parliamentary discussion as part of a sucessful campaign for Valerie's Law. melanmag.com/2022/04/04/has-the-sistah-space-valeries-law-campaign-made-significant-progress/

And for that one thing even if nothing else should be respected. Apart from the fact that they have support of women in the community.

Would hate for this thread to be taken down because of false allegations made by one contributor.

[Babasghost]

I've no comment to make but that I'm listening.
no group would be boycotting and potentially sacrificing influence unless it was important. So let's hear more about it.

[LadyKenya]

Same, I am listening, and reading to learn more.

[SueVineer]

Camilla has been a big supporter of domestic violence and sexual violence charities. I doubt very much attending would have made Camilla look good and a charity look bad. But of course if sbs take that view, it’s up to them. For me I think it’s important not to let dogma get in the way of helping people.

[fallfallfall]

i tried to link the petition but it's not allowing me at this time.

[IwantToRetire]

Valerie's Law petition is now closed but can still be read here.

Because it got over 100,000 signatures an MPs debate had to be held.

If you scroll down you can see the debate and the early response the Government gave after 10,000

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/578416

Totally off topic but a point of information if you are setting up a petition please dont bother with some viral internet site, which is like putting your postal vote into a rubbish bin, try and get a petition on the parliament site because after 10,000 signatures the Government have to respond, and after 100,000 have to have a debate.

In fact on a petition about DV a written response by the Government after 10,000 was sent back by the Petition Committee saying the response wasn't good enough!!!!

[Imnotavetbut]

This is something I keep meaning to spend some more time on researching properly. There have been some unfortunate snippets from videos of Ngozi doing the rounds with regards to how she chooses what clothes to wear and for what purpose, as well as 'insights' into why she's changed her name. I'm well aware that short videos can be edited accordingly and anyone can write nonsense about why someone might change their name so I really do want to put the time in to research it further - out of curiosity really, I have lots of unanswered questions. I worry that we'll end up in purity spirals though rather than keeping the focus where it should be; on violence against women.

[RoseslnTheHospital]

None of that is relevant to the situation at the palace though. Someone British, born and raised, might have a name from their heritage. Its not a reason to question them in the way that she was questioned. Ditto for the clothes.