Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: chat

Why are there no violent femcels?

131 replies

Laneyy · 14/11/2022 11:39

I was watching a documentary about incels last night. It was quite scary how entitled some men feel entitled to sex of course with attractive women like they see on porn. They hammer their faces talk about killing and raping women. I think porn has a lot to answer for the rise in incels, they can't be bothered going out and talking to actual women. Just furiously wanking to women on screen..

Men and women are different it's easy for a female to get a meaningless shag which will probably be terrible but a meaningful relationship can be more difficult. I was pondering many women end up in dead end relationships ,we have a fertility time limit. Many men will waste a woman's time saying later not now until she's no longer fertile taking her chance to have biological children. Women don't then go on a murderous rampage.

OP posts:
TruckerBarbie · 15/11/2022 15:58

Laneyy · 15/11/2022 13:27

Yes men are physically stronger but women in the USA could get access to high powered weapons and kill , ram a vehicle. No mass shooters are female or those who ram vehicles. Women also feel lonely and left on the shelf, they are abused.. Why do some men feel so entitled to kill but it doesn't cross a women's mind to commit mass murder apart from Alieen Wurnos who was an abuse victim. She was then killed by the government

Well, there have been a fair few female suicide bombers. In the main though I think it's probs mostly down to much higher testosterone and the fact that for time immemorial it's been men's job to do the fighting.

namitynamechange · 15/11/2022 23:19

So the formula is :
Testosterone+being a terrible person+deep sense of entitlement=violent incel type.

Just testosterone by itself isn't enough, neither is being a terrible person, or feeling entitled (that just leads to AIBUs about parking spaces)

LoobyDop · 16/11/2022 15:24

TruckerBarbie · 15/11/2022 15:58

Well, there have been a fair few female suicide bombers. In the main though I think it's probs mostly down to much higher testosterone and the fact that for time immemorial it's been men's job to do the fighting.

How many female suicide bombers have there been who acted solely of their own volition or at the behest of an all-female group? All the successful suicide bombers are dead, we can’t check what motivated them- but I bet a significant portion were convenient cannon fodder for a plan devised by a man.

BlackForestCake · 16/11/2022 18:45

Women who commit violent acts tend to be highly politically motivated.
Not lashing out because they can't get a shag.

namitynamechange · 17/11/2022 02:10

Female suicide bombers are a weird phenomenon and I don't think you can just discount them as being "manipulated by a man". They have their own agency (not saying PP was suggesting otherwise). But I think the causes are somewhat different.
The closest thing to a violent female incel would be something like Valerie Solanas the woman who shot Andy Warhol - she was genuinely motivated by a hatred of men (the SCUM manifesto is deeply off-putting in the same way a lot of male incel screeds are) plus unjustified resentment of Warhol in particular. But the backstory to her being like that involved a history of sexual abuse, prostitution etc (and prob also a lot of drugs). Which doesn't justify what she did at all but is a much larger trigger than just not being able to get a boyfriend. Also it was over 50 years ago so still a much rarer event.

deydododatdodontdeydo · 17/11/2022 09:22

The only one I can think of is Joanne Dennehy who stabbed a number of men, killing three of them and did it for "entertainment".
She specifically targetted men because she didn't want to kill women.
It doesn't happen often.

MargaritaPie · 17/11/2022 23:36

Does this count?

www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/2022/04/06/russian-woman-planned-to-kill-boys-at-a-kindergarten-but-was-stopped-by-teachers-before-firing-a-shot/comment-page-1/

"On March 28[2022], according to Russian press reports,19-year-old Polina Dvorkina shot and killed her father at their home in Krasnoyarsk, Siberia, then headed to a nearby kindergarten intending to kill as many boys as she could."

TruckerBarbie · 18/11/2022 00:09

MargaritaPie · 17/11/2022 23:36

Does this count?

www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/2022/04/06/russian-woman-planned-to-kill-boys-at-a-kindergarten-but-was-stopped-by-teachers-before-firing-a-shot/comment-page-1/

"On March 28[2022], according to Russian press reports,19-year-old Polina Dvorkina shot and killed her father at their home in Krasnoyarsk, Siberia, then headed to a nearby kindergarten intending to kill as many boys as she could."

She sounds bonkers.

Claimed her unsuccessful application to the nursery was 'discrimination against women' when all the workers there were female. 🤔

Changed her name to Dvorkina in homage to Andrea Dworkin.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 18/11/2022 11:11

So 2 examples of women exhibiting wanton, extreme violence

I read this recently and it stayed with me. Jacqueline Kirk was murdered by her partner who set her on fire, re-enacting a torture scene from reservoir dogs

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-63570131.amp

it took a bit of scrolling to find the article because of all the other news reports of men setting women on fire and torturing them

MargaritaPie · 18/11/2022 14:21

www.glasgowtimes.co.uk/news/19114475.two-women-jailed-torture-attack-teen-victim-johnstone/

"TWO woman who brutally attacked a teenage boy with a bottle and then stamped on his head were jailed today[Feb 2021].

The judge told Holmes: “You were the principal actor here and you used a bottle to hit the boy and cut glass on his body – a form of torture.”

Prosecutor Paul Kearney said: “Holmes began an assault by smashing a vodka bottle on his head.

She then dragged him from the couch and the two accused kicked, punched and stamped on his head then kicked and punched him on the body.
"Holmes repeatedly struck his head off a wall.”

The crying victim pleaded with the pair for the attack to stop, but was cut with broken glass.

The victim suffered a bleed on the brain, a cut to a vein and a broken nose.
Mr Kearney added: “The wounds will leave permanent scars. His life was put in danger and without medical treatment he would have died.

The motive was because they "heard a rumour" about him which may or may not be true.

namitynamechange · 18/11/2022 15:23

@MargaritaPie Absolutely horrendous, but I think a different sort of crime to the ones we were talking about. (I could be wrong but it sounds more like violence to punish perceived transgression of social norms). Which is still just as horrific for the victim but not necessarily the same motivations as incel/femcel type violence (and also still carried out more by men than women. Not that, that would be any comfort to the victim).
I think of course women are also capable of horrific violence just as men are, but on a much less frequent occurrence (even a look at the sidebar showing recent news stories alongside that article will show that).

MargaritaPie · 18/11/2022 17:46

www.glasgowtimes.co.uk/news/scottish-news/23134771.murderer-pleads-guilty-stabbing-billy-mcguire-clydebank-house/

This is from today, a murder (man on man) by stabbing. Motive seems to be over being called a "midget".

For some people it doesn't seem to take much to trigger them into acts of extreme violence. I'm guessing alcohol abuse or some sort of underlying problems.

Artygirlghost · 18/11/2022 17:55

I really think that men are more likely to be violent and get involved in criminal acts.

Many of them also don't see women as equal human beings.

Instead they think women as basically in this world to serve them and have sex with them. An object rather than a full person.

Also centuries of patriarchal societies and religions have reinforced the idea that women should obey/belong to men.

I think it is a lethal combination of historical factors and biology.

Ofcourseshecan · 18/11/2022 18:10

Kanaloa · 14/11/2022 15:28

Gosh, in the most polite way possible… I just don’t care. I do feel a bit sorry for whatever girl has fallen into this guy’s trap.

Do you notice he still has to turn it all round to how oh so hard it was for him? How the feminists and ‘alpha men’ just pushed him out so he had no choice but to be an incel? Even now he can’t comprehend that he made a bad choice that in many cases affects women FOR LIFE and look at that honestly.

Yes. I was struck by this man still believing, now, that pick-up artists and feminists had made him hate himself. Pick-up artists maybe. But why feminists? Is this just having to blame women for everything? Most teenagers, male and female, go through a patch of feeling ugly, unloveable, unwanted etc etc. Why does he as an adult give these feelings so much credence?

I find it disturbing that he says unlike feminists, [incels] won't stop you from feeling the fullness of your despair and your anger. That deep well of rage against women. It's more than disturbing, it is truly frightening. No wonder Margaret Atwood said men are afraid women will laugh at them, women are afraid men will kill them.

Ofcourseshecan · 18/11/2022 18:14

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 18/11/2022 11:11

So 2 examples of women exhibiting wanton, extreme violence

I read this recently and it stayed with me. Jacqueline Kirk was murdered by her partner who set her on fire, re-enacting a torture scene from reservoir dogs

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-63570131.amp

it took a bit of scrolling to find the article because of all the other news reports of men setting women on fire and torturing them

Yes, it's that: it took a bit of scrolling to find the article because of all the other news reports of men setting women on fire and torturing them

GreyCarpet · 18/11/2022 20:20

Ofcourseshecan · 18/11/2022 18:14

Yes, it's that: it took a bit of scrolling to find the article because of all the other news reports of men setting women on fire and torturing them

It's not often I'm moved to tears by a newspaper article. But fucking hell. That poor woman and her family.

And the absolute outrage that so many men are motivated to harm us.

Dreamwhisper · 19/11/2022 22:17

Just wanted to add my thoughts as a couple of years ago when the incel reddit was still up and publicly accessible, I developed a morbid fascination with this group.

I'd say the main difference as others have already pointed out between incels and "femcels" is that incels have an intense and obsessive view of women as objects for sexual gratification, pretty exclusively.

They also have a strong belief in male entitlement and fundamental need for sex. Sex is a human right to them, they fantasise to each other about having government mandated girlfriends for all men, for example, and bemoan the loss of the "good old days" where they believe men were entitled in real life to a wife who could never leave him and was his subordinate.

The combination of hatred, objectification, lust, and entitlement is just not something femcels have. Women do not have the historical context of being entitled to men, or living in a world where men are sexual objects only, we are victims or rape not perpetrators. It's just completely different.

Even the examples i've seen on the thread of women being violent to men, it's more anger and hatred then the added incel motivations of subjugation, entitlement and sexual desire.

There's also the added issue of incel forums being a breeding ground for poor mental health. I have never seen such a cess pit of self pity, they basically encourage each other to harm themselves or others. They tell each other they're all genetically inferior, unlovable freaks. There is no building up or bolstering, there is only a miserable acceptance of each other's fate, which they deem unchangeable.

Because women are genetically programmed to go for Chads and "monkey branch" to more and more Chad-ish partners and hair and makeup and fashion means that women are all now so hot that even the "ugly ones" can get a chad. It is honestly the most rage inducing backwards thinking I've ever come across. You cannot reason with them at all. And men who are already mentally unwell, or misogynistic, or violent, or any combination of the 3, have those tendencies propelled and their world view validated by the rest of them.

aminabzz · 12/06/2023 15:20

I think it's biased to say all incels are violent. There are also incels who are just upset with their situation without harming any person.

MovinGroovinBarbie · 12/06/2023 23:49

Handyweatherstation · 14/11/2022 15:12

Interesting post, Liebig, but the question is about why there aren't violent female incels.

Men have about 10x more testosterone and are a lot stronger. People (and many animals) don't tend to attempt violence if they think they'll get their arse kicked.

You can guarantee most violent men wouldn't try it on with Mike Tyson.

MovinGroovinBarbie · 12/06/2023 23:51

Tbf the suffragettes were the closest to female incels. Trying to blow up theatres and churches/kill innocent members of the public etc because they were angry with men.

turbonerd · 15/06/2023 21:31

The sufragettes were angry with men for not having equal rights to own property, vote, have any form of rights within marriage etc.

They were not cross because they did not get sex on tap.

MovinGroovinBarbie · 15/06/2023 23:44

turbonerd · 15/06/2023 21:31

The sufragettes were angry with men for not having equal rights to own property, vote, have any form of rights within marriage etc.

They were not cross because they did not get sex on tap.

True, but they still attempted to carry out attacks that we're basically akin to the Manchester arena bombing. I just don't see how anyone can deem they acceptable, yet alone worship them as heroines. I don't believe anybody would if their children were killed by the bomb at the theatre.

pondsprite1 · 17/06/2023 19:37

I honestly think socialization is more sexist and extreme than a lot of feminists even realize because we're all so conditioned to things being this way from birth.
I'm in the US where many men think it's masculine to:

enjoy watching violence onscreen
get excited about owning weapons like knives and guns
show a strong interest in sex but not in romance or love
give advice more than take it, especially advice from a woman
show little empathy
not be vulnerable by sharing too much of inner world with others
compete instead of connect

and if they're not considered masculine they may be mocked and shamed. Toxic masculinity affects most men in a terrible way still. Women are taught to be the opposite in many ways. We're also criticized and held accountable more when we do something wrong.

MovinGroovinBarbie · 18/06/2023 02:04

pondsprite1 · 17/06/2023 19:37

I honestly think socialization is more sexist and extreme than a lot of feminists even realize because we're all so conditioned to things being this way from birth.
I'm in the US where many men think it's masculine to:

enjoy watching violence onscreen
get excited about owning weapons like knives and guns
show a strong interest in sex but not in romance or love
give advice more than take it, especially advice from a woman
show little empathy
not be vulnerable by sharing too much of inner world with others
compete instead of connect

and if they're not considered masculine they may be mocked and shamed. Toxic masculinity affects most men in a terrible way still. Women are taught to be the opposite in many ways. We're also criticized and held accountable more when we do something wrong.

Well, it kind of is masculine if you consider that men and most male animals are more violent by default.

caringcarer · 18/06/2023 02:51

There are violent females. Have you ever read about females who cut their partners penises off? Also what about the nurse who killed the newborn babies? I think there are far less violent females but they do exist. Just not so many of them.