Need support but mn keep deleting my posts

[elementofsurprise]

and I dont understand why.
It has really helped me being on here the last couple of days. Theres a man who I thought was a friend not treating me very nicely, but I need his help so I kind of stuck. But having people on here to talk to ws helping.

MN keep sayng to seek real life help, but I have and have detailed it on these threads. it feels so horrible, I feel so worthless and hopeless and s alone I cnt even post on an anonymous forum. I have written abut how services are responding, I have said I am going to contact MIND and things, why aren't i allowed support on here?

I would like MN to tell me what they think the servces are going to do, cos it sure as hell isnt supporting me like kind MNers have been doing. Do MN think there is a lovely kind supportive hospital place waiting for me or something?

I want to go and see the abusive man cos I feel so alone and he might be nice and hug me. I know its not a good idea in othe ways so i came on here to talk about it only to find my thread deleted. I just dont get it, ther people can post about v v dodgy abusive realtionships and get support, why cant i? I cant post in realtionships cos MH is a big aspect, whereas in MH my post is tumbleweed.

This meant a lot and i just do not know what to do, the services wont/cant offer much help, even if they agree to take me on it'll be months til I get an appt and then it'd be fortnightly or something, my GP isnt in today, and even calling MIND etc, its just not the same as this site which is 24/7. What are MN expecting to happen when I seek help? it seems so cruel and really hurting me to delete my threads, what the hell do they think will happen? feel like im being bullied, kicked when im down, cut off as a worthless human being.

[DeirdreDoo]

I wonder if you are doing something called transference. Look it up. It's like when you have strong feelings towards someone (you past abuser/arent/whoever?) and you kind of project them onto another person in that 'role' if you like, so your therapist, or someone you expect is there to care for you or deal with your emotions (which a therapist is)

some will see transference as part of the treatment, you are meant to get attached to them

others won't
other times it becomes far too overpowering and they don't feel safe with you, or helpful working with you

If they are a private therapist I imagine they can stop seeing you with less hassle than an NHS one can (I had an NHS one not warn me when sessions were about to end - I got cross about that, and an apology I think but it was painful as I was deeply into the psychodynamic relationship and suddenly it stopped. That's not really supposed to happen. I didn't lose it with him though, or shout at anyone as that would have been out of order on my part, and I'm not like that. I just lodged a minor complaint about it as I didn't think it was right, and got to talk to someone about it, and there was nothing more they could really do.

I think in the space of 18 months if things were not improving, well, maybe there was something about your situation that they felt they could not work with. Or maybe they were just taking your money and not trying very hard.

It's impossible to say. But at least consider the part you may have played in it - it is a two way street after all. Most of life is. I'm not saying you did anything wrong, but that's for you to decide on reflection.

At the end of the day, no one is God, no one is more powerful than you, no one can heal you or cure you. They can only listen and try to help by suggesting things, maybe, though n psychodynamic therapy they are there just to listen and possibly be your transference person.

[Shakey15000]

Hi element. I only have three things to share with you, none of which is advice-

1. I have been suicidal before
2. I have also totally lost it with a psychiatrist
3. I am giving you a massive, online, virtual cuddle as you read this because I think you bloody well need and deserve one.

X

[NameChange30]

It's not all your fault but you do need to take responsibility for your own behaviour.

The therapist said it was ok for you to feel angry with her but I suspect she felt you crossed a line which is why she decided she couldn't continue to treat you.

Your feelings are valid, of course, and you are entitled to them, but you are not entitled to lash out at others and expect them to accept it. Everyone has their own boundaries to protect themselves.

You say no one gets it, it's true that I don't understand why you're ignoring or arguing with the suggestions on here. Earlier in the thread, people asked what you want, and I said it was ok for you not to know what the answer is, but it's only ok if you're receptive to suggestions and help. If you say everything is wrong then people will need you to spell out exactly what it is that you want/need.

[potto]

I usually just lurk on mumsnet but I've been reading all your threads and felt I had to try and say something as I can relate to quite a bit of what you say. It sounds as if you've had some really traumatic experiences with the mental health system in the past and your current therapist sounds out of her depth. I think a lot of us can empathise with your frustration- I don't really know what to say but I just wanted to try and offer a bit of support really.

[MaidOfStars]

Checking in for a 'hello'. You're green fingered - what can you grow? I shall require onions and peppers. And courgettes. And mushrooms.

[ilovesooty]

You missed your appointment with your therapist and telephoned with ten minutes of the session remaining. Did she then contact you in order to tell you she could no longer work with you as the therapeutic relationship had broken down?

Have you ever contracted with her, revisited that contract or been offered reviews of your progress?
Is she trained in and experienced in telephone counselling?

[MaidOfStars]

As an extension of ^, where did you find her? Who is she? What is her specialty? Training?

[ilovesooty]

Yes MaidOfStars I agree.

I find it disturbing that the OP can be involved in a telephone counselling interaction for so long with little clear direction or progress. I'd be very interested in the qualifications and expertise of this counsellor and wonder what kind of supervision she was having.

[MagpieCursedTea]

If the counsellor was communicating with element's GP there would've been a confidentiality and communication agreement in place. It also sounds like the counsellor was part of an organisation?

[elementofsurprise]

At the start there was progress. As mentioned the progress has lessened as outside support has disappered and situations changed (namely friends moving away, etc as mentioned). So the outside support of chatting about dy-to-day stuff or philosophising on life and experiences dried up (in particualr i had a friend who was very interested in philosophy and politics and we'd have some great chats that I found helpful...). So I gradully felt I was carrying a bigger and bigger burden and having to smile and 'fake it' more and more and crying more behind closed doors.

I kept telling myself it would get better and take it one day at a time, but without some kind of reassurance and almost entirely relationships where I have to watch the boundaries and not be a doormat or let people hurt me, it is very hard. I think i do need some kind of support/positive feedback from the world. Which I shoudn't need. Just a bit so i've got something to draw on when the memories tell me im worthless and trapped.

So because of that it was harder to get to the 'deep' stuff and work on the memories in therapy cos the present was getting so hard. Whereas when I started I was able to recall clear memories, focus on that stuff, had the spare... erm - mental energy? to unpick it. And I was relying on therapist as only person I could really trust, which makes me feel sick now. I found it weird how much stuff she didnt seem to understand, that I had to explain bit-by-bit using analogies all the time. It sounds harsh but sometimes I thought she was a bit thick, but I think it might actually be aspergers/traits in me so I see the world differently. Or just that I see the world differently for another reason. But it was very frustrating feeling like I had to keep explaining the same stuff like she'd forgotton everything we'd talked about.

She also told me something personal about her past which I didnt know how to respond to and that doesn't sit right with me that she did that. I know therapists might do this as part of the bonding thing (not right word...er...) but it just seemed an odd time to do it, it didn't really seem to relate and confused me, I didnt know what to say. Because normally if someone did that I'd immediately put my issues aside and talk about them, see if they need to talk etc.
There were some other things she said along the line that seemed odd too.

I trusted her because she works as part of a group of therapists. I think you're right she may have been out of her depth, I dont think she's qualified that long (I looked her up on LinkedIn a while ago when I started to have doubts). Phone therapy wasnt the initial way, that happened because I was finding it harder and harder to get to sessions. She has kept reminding me I dont have to see her, but... I wrote on another thread "i'm basically paying just to have someone to speak to who won't hurt or belittle me, it's not getting anywhere anymore. I have started to dread it cos it reminds me how lonely and hopeless everything is, I wondered about stopping it but then I'd have nothing."

Also the only thing with the GP was if she felt I was in danger, he was the person she'd contact. Recently I did ask her if she could contact him because I felt I needed more support and I thought her word might have some clout, because I wasn't getting anywhere asking myself.

She did talk about transference and things, her official title is "pychotherapeutic counsellor". I was pissed off at her once before and thought she might stop seeing me and thats when she said it was ok to be angry with her etc so I thought it was all part of the process. Mind you at other times I'm constantly apologising and she's saying "you don't need to keep apologising, its ok to be angry".

If she'd not done this now, I'd have apologised for snapping but explained how very, very hurt I was by her words. Mind you I am gobsmacked that she said what she did, again I get the feeling like has she listened to a word I've said? I'd have thought she would know exactly why what she said created that reaction. In fact I don't get why she said it at all - unless she had just spoken to GP and he'd claimed I'd refused treatment offered in the week since we last spoke *. But even then, I'd have thought she'd ask me first not make blanket statements, and understand given my history why suggesting I'd rejected offered help was about the most invalidating and painful thing anyone could say.

Think that covers everything. Thank you potto and shakey
emma Maybe no-one can help at all, I do seem to be in a hopeless situation. People often say to others "it's the illness speaking" but sadly I think combined with my illness is a rather hopeless reality of a decimated MH service and bad luck over the years that have led to a very sad situation.

Im going to get something to eat now and try to do some coursework. Haven't managed for days but am very numb right now and I've a feeling it will be followed by a horrible crash so better take advantage of it. The numb is weird like when something really dreadful has happened to me in the past. Detached with every now and then a sort of double take and wave of nausea as I remember the nightmare of reality.

*I havent refused any offered help in the last week, or ever. My GP has seemed under the impression that I'd refused help because of the vague things the CMHT say - eg. "not engaging" seems to actually mean I disagree with their interpretation of things (so try to be helpful and clear up misunderstanding which pisses them off further), whereas he read it to mean I wouldnt talk to them or something. Btw when we went over it he also thinks they're bonkers and unhelpful, and disagrees with their view of me.

[elementofsurprise]

longest post ever!

[lougle]

If you can't agree on what the issues to be tackled are after 18 months then I think it's unlikely to improve.

[ilovesooty]

There's still no real indication of contracting or reviews or specific training in telephone counselling.

[potto]

Glad you're feeling a bit less awful at the moment- hope you can get some coursework or reading done. What subject are you studying by the way?

I think your therapist sounds pretty inexperienced and I think she's handled the situation badly. I've encountered quite a few therapists in my time and they vary so much in how much empathy, common sense, insight, intelligence they have. She may not be a bad therapist in all situations but it sounds as if she can't grasp the complexity of your problems and she's just going for a bog-standard CBT type approach.

[NameChange30]

Well the problem is that you need a psychiatrist, not a random counsellor. Failing that, at the very least you need an experienced counsellor who is registered with a professional body and has expertise in PTSD and personality disorders.

OP, as I said before, it sounds like this counsellor wasn't the right one for you, and that's no-one's fault. I hope you can find someone more suitable. Do you think Mind might be able to advise?

[MoriartyIsMyAngel]

I really do empathize OP. A close relative of mine is trying to seek help from mental health services, and it's easy for people to say 'ask for help' - but there's so little help out there, and the left hand doesn't seem to know what the right hand is doing. I get frustrated being passed from person to person on the phone, it must be so hard having to do it all yourself.

I'd say, reach out for help wherever you can - church, even if you're not religious? You could may find compassionate people there. If there's a charity close to your heart perhaps try volunteering? Fostering cats in my home gave me distraction and purpose when I needed it, and the other volunteers are lovely.

And practical care for yourself - drink a lot of water, get plenty of sleep, get fresh air every day, nourishing food, plenty of veg. Do things to take care of yourself. It can give you a psychological boost. It may feel like a drop in the ocean but it counts.

[elementofsurprise]

emma Unfortunately this is what Mind advised. They said they had no idea and I had to stres the point I could pay (a limited amount, from benefits) and then they suggested this place. I also ha a personal recommendation for it. Thought it was good cos they assess you then match you to a counsellor/therapist.

Because I've had all these experiences I haven't dealt with and jut sort of had to carry on living, I get horrible memories and nightmares that floor me so it seems like therapy is the answer, the NHS assesed me as needing it several times, but as mentioned the services kept gettig rearranged and cut so I'd fall of the waiting list or whatever and eventually they simply dont offer longterm, in-depth therapy. Even when they did they criteria was weird and contradictory - when I'd just had a breakup i was declared "too upset" for therapy, at other times I was deemed not ill enough to be under the care of the CMHT and thus access the therapy! (Primary care IAPT have said I need seondary services, I'm seen as too complex and risky).

HArdly anyone has access to a psychiatrist on the NHS, due to the shortage and them being the most expensive staff. I'm not considered eligible for one - even if services agreed to see me, I don't have a load of meds or a psychosis diagnosis.

I just wonder where the others in my position are - I know there's others like me out there from blogs and and forums and comments on articles and so on... and if services are particularly dire round here there must be a load of us here. And this place would be the obvious place for someone to seek privte therapy, for the reasons I did. Yet therapsist seemed to think I was the only one, no others unwell/not working/v fucked up, cos they were (she assumed) under NHS care... very odd. Feel like total freak.

lougle I wanted to deal with my past, deal with the distressing memories. it worked at first. But now more depressed day to day and struggling to concentrate etc, she'd ask how I was doing and we'd get lost in that, I tried to say I wanted to talk about the past but found it hard cos she'd ask questions and I'd have to keep explaining the same old stuff to her, so we'd not get anywhere. Like as if each time I saw her we'd never met before, or she was confusing me with someone else and would start the session with completely the wrong end of the stick (eg. "So last session you saying about blah blah and how it made you feel blah blah". Me: Incredulous, wondering how she got that from what I'd said "er, no... " etc.)

potto I'm studying social sciences. General intro course now.

moriaty Thanks.

Still sick and numb today. Its sort of an improvement on when I started the thread though. Everything very surreal.

[MagpieCursedTea]

I live fairly close to you element, I do have a psychiatrist but only see him if I become ill. I've been given the details for the crisis team but luckily haven't needed them. I used to live in another part of the country and saw my psychiatrist and a psychologist fairly regularly but was probably going to be discharged just before I moved, the only reason they kept me on was because I'd just had DS and was ill for a while, I'd been under that team for years and they were brilliant for the most part and I give them a lot of the credit for stabilising me (along with my family and my own hard work). I've also lived in another area which was even worse than the north east for MH services, I really lost my faith in the services until I moved, they were truly awful, I'm genuinely not sure I would've survived it if I'd stayed there. The postcode lottery for MH services is alive and well. I've been on the waiting list for some specialised therapy (in secondary services) for 6 months. I'm assuming it's because I'm not in crisis and it's a specialised area that it's taking so long, but I know if I was still in the area with the excellent service I'd have seen someone by now.
My area has been doing a consultation on services recently so hopefully they're looking at ways they can improve.
I hope that one day all services can be equal and that they're brought up to the standard of the better services rather than lowered to the standards of the failing ones.
I'll try not to get too much into a political rant on your support thread but it's a frustrating subject!

[elementofsurprise]

the only reason they kept me on was because I'd just had DS and was ill for a while

Apart from being devastated at the thoght I may never get to have children, the even worse scenario is the fear they'd insist on them going into care. Services wouldn't support me.

I was thinking about something I read in a Terry Pratchett book, about prisoners about to be hanged being put in a cell with a loose brick. They can gradually loosen and then remove the brick... only to find there is another brick behind it. But apparently it's so that every death row prisoner has the hope of freedom. No chance of actual freedom, but they get to experience the hope...!

Mental health services seem like that. So much of it is assessments, people referring you to other people, making appointments to make appointments, someone telling you to look forward to the next time someone tells you to look forward to... etc, etc. It all seems to be people looking busy and a flurry of activity with very little actual substance! The hope of treatment.
!!

[lougle]

What do you think would help you, element?

It sounds like what you really need is a better self-image and to be able to move on from the past and leave it behind. If 18 months of talking about it hasn't helped perhaps you'd be better to work towards accepting that it happened and can't be changed but finding a way to stop it defining you?

[elementofsurprise]

Well as mentioned, at the beginning it did help. It's just as daily life has got harder its been much harder to delve into the past, because I'm focussed on surviving the present. Also the way the therapist seemed to forget everything and constantly misunderstand and so on meant it was hard to get anywhere with it after a while. As mentioned I've had conversations with friends that have been more helpful - it's something about acceptance and validation that helped.

Actually, it seems like for tha past six months or something she's had a sort of agenda. I just get that impression, I have no idea what it is though . But whetever it was it meant she seemed to stop listening, stop taking anything in, stopped connecting with me and... I dunno.

I had disturbing and wrenching nightmares about my past last night, and today have felt a huge burden of shame that I know logically in my head is wrong but feel totally condemned by what services did to me when I was younger and how I was labelled and judged. I literally dont know how to make that stuff go away. When I had friends around who knew, believed me, and were vaguely supportive it helped more than anything. I just felt/feel like I need to make it better to some degree though, I can't just rely on support and not working and so on forever. I'd liken it to a broken leg, you may need people to help you in the short term but ultimately you need the bones set and it to heal so you can get up on your feet again.

As far as I see it, I broke down 5 yrs ago when life seemed to be good. The memories and nightmares started bigtime then. This sort of thing and the general depression and anxiety obviously affects my life a lot, and thus causes more problems/repurcussions. So if I can deal with the past I'd have thought the present would naturally become easier.

In that time I've also finally started living alone which has been great (houseshares with idiot males, arghhh). I've also unpicked a load of stuff and pieced togther loads of things, and learnt loads about how humans work (and my god its depressing! But better the devil you know...). But I still struggle and have no idea how to come to terms with my past, and the longer it goes on the more 'past' there is that haunts me. I seem to have found life inherently traumatic. I dont hang around dwelling on it though, in fact it annoys me that I cant just 'be fine' and when the memories hit its wrenching, like "ooh I was trying to forget about that". Sometimes when that happens the room spins and I cant believe thats been my life.

I just do not know anymore. Just existing is taking all my energy. I dont know the answers, I dont know wher to look for them or how to find someone who does know. I'm exhausted with trying to figure it out.

[elementofsurprise]

Plus I dont let it 'define me' .
But when one is getting so low and suicidal, struggling, living on benefits, etc - it crops up all the time.

In fact it pisses me off the way others label me, view me, because of it. I've noticed there are those who sideline me as a 'mental person'. Or talk to me like a child! When they find out the capable stuff I've done you can see the surprise in their faces . But loads of people over the years have also expressed incredulity that I can be both capable at points and clearly ill at others... and I've had comments from people who've seen me in a bad episode, or I've spelt it out to them, who have admitted they'd not have known/believed me otherwise.

So yeh, it doesn't define me, but I feel a weight on my shoulders and a past haunting me and it drains me to deal with that so everyday life is much, much harder due to this unseen thing.