Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

Blood sugar diet thread 9

999 replies

thenewaveragebear1983 · 18/01/2018 20:16

Shiny new thread for the blood sugar dieters!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
41
whyistherumgone · 17/03/2018 15:20

by the way, wasn't judging the 30g of carbs - I'm in awe!

veryveryquietly · 17/03/2018 15:32

Truthfully why I almost never make it down to 30, usually more like 40. I think I'm probably silly to be trying carbs this low but am just giving it a go for a few weeks to see if it makes a difference re: speed of weight loss. I've got a lot of losing left to go, alas.

I don't think I could even consider doing keto. Would rather lose more slowly, and be able to have a piece of fruit and a bit of chocolate each day.

Then again, compared to the amount of potatoes, rice, crisps and chips I used to eat, 100 gr carbs per day would count as super low carb!

veryveryquietly · 17/03/2018 15:34

Also why I'm not as active as I should be, though that's improving. I'm sure you'll still see results. 50 should be totally low-carb enough, although I've heard insulin-resistant people can do better on lower. But I haven't researched it nearly enough to know anything!

Oblomov18 · 17/03/2018 19:47

Very I too am loving the sound of courgette enchiladas!

londonista · 17/03/2018 20:22

I've just come back from my MIL ... she made cod in breadcrumbs, home made wedges, apple strudel. I didn't eat as much as usual but I do feel completely stuffed. I didn't really say no to anything although I did choose not to touch the breadbasket.

Baby steps!

I've not been counting carbs - do I need to?!

Oblomov18 · 17/03/2018 20:39

At work, I keep hearing the new radio advert: eat 2000 calories:
400 breakfast
600 lunch
600 dinner

Errrr, you did know that's only 1600? Not 2000? Hmm

But I've never heard such a specific eating plan , detailed calorie suggestions for each meal.

This is a new step the Government has taken, I feel.

Blood sugar diet thread 9
thenewaveragebear1983 · 18/03/2018 07:13

Oblomov is that because they allow 400 calories for snacks. Sounds a lot but it’s only really an Apple, a banana, a biscuit, and a few cups of tea. I would gain a lot if I followed that plan.

London you don’t need to count carbs, the 50g limit comes I think from the collective wisdom of The Internet, and has sort of morphed on to here. It can be helpful to know how many carbs you are having, but you don’t need to count them or stay below a certain level. If you only eat the right foods and stick to 800 calories (or 1000?) your carb count will stay low anyway.

Last night I had g&t and a couple of red wines, lovely buffet with sliced meat and salad (and had none of the beige stuff) and I did have a small piece of cake. Annoyingly when I got home I then raised the cupboards and ate bread, and a Milky Way, which I’m cross with myself about because I didn’t even want them! Headache all night and woke up with the most intense thirst, really horrible.

So today, it’s snowing again, we have a party at MIL’s later, (more beige food!) and I feel like I need to have a good run and blow off the carbs cobwebs a bit ready to start the week fresh!

OP posts:
veryveryquietly · 18/03/2018 09:32

bear is absolutely right when she says:
"you don’t need to count carbs, the 50g limit comes I think from the collective wisdom of The Internet, and has sort of morphed on to here. It can be helpful to know how many carbs you are having, but you don’t need to count them or stay below a certain level. If you only eat the right foods and stick to 800 calories (or 1000?) your carb count will stay low anyway."

For me, just sticking to 850 cals and BSD principles has been enough to keep carbs around avg. 50 gr/day (which is definitely low for normal, non-bodybuilding people) without thinking about it.

I'm just temporarily trying to push them lower to see what happens, and if it helps - we'll see. But so far it's clear that I really like mid-carb range fruit and veg, and specifically plums, carrots, and red peppers, a bit too much to go below 30 gr/day. And in the end I think I'm going to be healthier and happier if I keep those in my diet and don't fuss so much about it - and just follow general BSD/healthy Med principles.

Sorry to blather on! Just sort of thinking out loud, and don't have anyone IRL to chat about this particular issue with.

veryveryquietly · 18/03/2018 09:44

oblovmov why all I did for the enchiladas is get rid of the tortillas, on the principle that chicken, cheese, tomatillo salsa and jalapenos are pretty BSD friendly. (The Gran Luchito brand of tomatillo salsa is not bad, and reasonably low cal.) . Then took 2 courgettes and used a peeler to make them into ribbons and use those for bottom and top layers, with filling inbetween. So really, more like chicken/tomatillo 'lasagna' made with courgette 'noodles' than enchiladas proper. But pretty darn tasty.

Once I toted up calories for just the filling plus courgettes, I also realised I can still make big trays of chicken enchiladas for everyone else, and simply scoop the insides out of the tortilla for myself, since the tortilla is the only problem for BSDing.

I think the secret to great enchiladas is to either use pre-roasted chicken, OR poach the chicken breast in chicken broth with a bit of onion and pepper and maybe a tiny squeeze of lime juice - much better than poaching chicken breast in plain water (utterly blah).

thenewaveragebear1983 · 18/03/2018 09:52

Very yes, me too. I do also sometimes have a higher carb day such as I’ll eat beans or lentils, or nuts etc, that can push it over 50g. So it is still useful to monitor it, and play around with foods, and not necessarily eat all the higher carb things together on one day. And of course, if you’re like me and exceed 800 cals regularly, then it’s even more important as you don’t have that self-imposed limit of low calories=lower carbs.

Remember fibre too- fibre shows on carbs totals on mfp etc, and in food labels. They divide carbs into ‘sugars’ and ‘fibre’ and some low carbers don’t count fibre as carbs (it’s called net carbs) as it’s indigestible. You should be getting around 14g per 1000 cals. If you have a day where your carb total seems really high, do check how much of it is fibre.

Maybe when trying to achieve that 30g carbs target you could aim for 30g net carbs, not total? I find that encourages me to eat more fibre and choose better veg.

The whole diet can become a bit like a scientific experiment with little molecules of all the different elements, and by the time you have got the carbs right, not too much or too little protein, the right veg, enough fruit to prevent scurvy (!) but not too much, full fat dairy, enough good fats, and all under 800 calories, you can find yourself thinking ‘yeah but what do I actually eat?????!!!!!’

Just ran 7km, my furthest yet. Clearly fuelled by last night’s Milky Way.

OP posts:
Flightywoman · 18/03/2018 11:14

Had a day completely off-piste yesterday and it was FAB!

TBH, I don't know how long I can do this again, I thought I could but I really don't know. The thought of having to heavily restrict carbs forever makes me want to cry. And I'm not seeing anything like the same results this time round.

But that's probably me being defeatist.

So I think I'll take myself off for a bit and have a think about what to do.

thenewaveragebear1983 · 18/03/2018 14:43

Flighty I think that’s quite a common experience of round 2 and subsequent rounds. Partly because the visceral fat round the organs has gone after round 1 so you simply don’t have that instant weightloss that is so motivating. I know my subsequent rounds post initial 8 weeks were very touch and go and I really struggled to get back that lovely clear head BSD mindset, so I really empathise with your post. What I didn’t do, which I now wish I had, was quickly devised a maintenance strategy for the short term. Instead I repeatedly attempted to do a full 8 weeks again, and I repeatedly failed. I think there is some truth in that 8 weeks is enough, and perhaps the body rebels a bit. If you generally like the diet and like the food, but are realistic about ‘real life’ and how it will fit in, it might help to devise a plan now that you can do for a few weeks/Months to maintain, if not lose.

For me, it’s going to have to be a combination of exercise, 5:2, mostly low carb, and very occasional treats. The big change for me this time is the exercise, so I am hoping that once I achieve the loss I want, I will be able to maintain it by a combination of the above. I have though, even now, given up on the idea of another strict 8 weeks. I’m about 10 weeks in now, and it’s working well for me. Every time I try to do a week at 800 calories, it just goes a bit wrong!!

OP posts:
whyistherumgone · 18/03/2018 22:37

Hi all. Quick question - I’ve had a stomach ache/bloating every night since I started cutting carbs down properly - could this be diet related? Not sure I’m going to be able to stick it out if this is going to be a side effect, not only do i feel huge, it’s bloody painful!

yumyumpoppycat · 18/03/2018 22:56

Ooh that sounds horrible whyas - could it be constipation - that is pretty common with low carb, also make sure you are drinking lots of water. I did have bloating etc when I recently tried to make my diet more veg based and ate more beans etc. Could it be something like that?

Flighty - I have def had those feelings! I think this weekend has been extra hard because it's so cold! Maybe you were a bit unlucky with your weighins and didn't get the true picture of how much you lost? No harm in taking a break and you can always came back on another time.

Glad you had a nice time bear!

AromaticSpices · 19/03/2018 09:21

I have had a bad week. I have been quite off piste... I am still doing without breakfast but a few carbs have sneaked in and have had a few glasses of wine this weekend. Am trying to see it as a blip and carry on today. I always do this. Lose a stone and then freak out that this is a forever change and then start craving all sorts and cannot resist. I need to get a grip. I did start to drink less water so probably ignored the 'thirst-hunger' and instead just ate. Will rectify that today.

Anyone tried any good easy recipes? I think I am in a rut with food which is making me crave off-plan stuff :(

londonista · 19/03/2018 10:40

Aromatic yes me too. My husband said to me yesterday (after watching me eat a bacon sandwich) so are you back on bread now, have you finished?
He wasn't being nasty, he just noticed that I wasn't just having a little taste of the bread - I was having a full bread meal!

I didn't have a terrible weekend, but i wasn't BSDing, definitely!

I'm back on it today, another week and a bit to go.

londonista · 19/03/2018 10:42

There is probably lots written about the psychology of sticking to new diet plans. It is notoriously difficult, particularly second time around.
I've already decided I'm going to attempt another 6 week stint when we get back from France on 13 April, because I'm expecting to gain over the holiday, but it will probably be hard to stick to!

Oblomov18 · 19/03/2018 13:24

I totally get what Flighty, bear, yumyum say because I am the same. Sometimes I'm eating low carb: peppers with goats cheese and salad, chilli with cauliflower rice etc, then I go and blow it by eating all the things I crave: wine, crisps, chocolate, mashed potato.

I certainly haven't found maintenance. I think as this thread shows, its harder than MM thinks.

thenewaveragebear1983 · 19/03/2018 13:40

Yep, maintenance. It’s an ongoing issue on this plan! But it’s the same with any diet I think; perhaps it’s because this way is so far removed from our ‘normal’ diet that the thought of doing it forever is overwhelming. I’ll be honest and say I’ve had some treats this time ( maybe chocolate 3 times since jan) and I do have wine 2 nights a week and have done all the way through. It’s not those things that do the damage for me, it’s the nibbles of things that find their way in!

Maybe the key to maintenance is to do a big review of the whole plan and your individual experience of it? Some need more calories; some can lose provided carbs are low enough; it might be that exercise is essential to maintenance? The one size fits all of 800 cals isn’t enough for a long term plan, it’s too general and too restrictive.

I feel I’ve found my groove a bit better this time. I stood at my MIL’s party yesterday evening and as there was nothing BSD friendly, I ate nothing, where previously I’d have had a small roll, or a few crisps. But maybe it’s because previously I’ve been unaware how precarious it can be, and I know how quickly it can all go back on. For me it really is as simple as ‘eat carbs= gain weight’ and right now that’s enough to spur me on to keep away from it.

I don’t know about anyone else, but I can definitely separate my cravings from actual carb cravings (which are now pretty few and far between) and these weird fantasies about stuffing my face with junk food which I have about three times every day. For a few minutes, I indulge the idea that I could just buy a massive Easter egg and eat the whole thing, or have slice after slice of toast. It’s like they are ‘binge fantasies’- I don’t just want a taste! I don’t do it though, but they are weird feelings and I’d imagine, quite deeply rooted in my psyche and caused by a lifetime of emotional eating and secret eating (which obviously this plan has no space for!). It’s as if my body is craving the binge and the endorphins/dopamine of bingeing, not the actual food.

OP posts:
londonista · 19/03/2018 13:54

I don't have the book with me but what does he say in there about maintenance? My plan was always just to include one carb meal and try to keep the others BSD friendly, to a total of about 1200. I think I'll gain if I have more than that.

Bear I definitely am getting specific cravings these days. I tried and failed to suppress a chocolate craving yesterday, but on the plus side it was only the 2nd time in 7 weeks I'd had choc cravings and I used to eat it every day!

thenewaveragebear1983 · 19/03/2018 14:25

London if I can recall, he doesn’t really mention maintenance, other that doing a med style 5:2. So counting 2 days at 800 calories and the rest of the time still sticking to those principles. But that does mean, it’s a low carb life if you were to follow it exactly.

There are solutions out there though: cheat meal?
Once a month have a total day off?
Calorie count and carb count (eg 1200, 50g carbs) but any food is allowed?

I honestly don’t believe that I will never eat a piece of cake again, or bread, or ice cream. But I need to not feel that it’s in control of me, and at the moment it isn’t. I can say no and not feel deprived and that’s so liberating. There’s been many times where food has made me so unhappy. I think maintenance for me has to be a combination of not having it, but also not wanting it- because if you don’t want it, it’s no hardship to not have it. And eating sweet food makes me want it more, so I suppose it’s a delicate balancing act, and only having the things I really, really want because of the Knock on effect of what it will do to my relationship with food. Not so much calories in/out per se, but the loss of control over food.

Food for thought (no pun intended!)

OP posts:
Oblomov18 · 19/03/2018 14:35

Re maintenance, I don't even recall him suggesting 5:2.
I only remember him saying: to relax a bit, go for a bit more of a Mediterranean style diet. But not total pasta galore. But just re-introducing a few bits, a few treats.
But that it would always to be 'monitored' ie aware of your weight. And if his trousers hit to tight, he reigned it in.

But realistically. Is that REALLY what you would call a proper maintenance regime? For him it might work. But for most women I don't think it does. Because it so easily runs away with you.
That if you take your eye off the ball for only say 3 weeks you can easily find you've put on 1/2 a stone, or nearer a stone.

So I'm not sure MM has really thought this bit through, or hit it right, or appreciated how complex it actually is.

Not that I've ever had to contemplate 'maintenance'! Because I've never reached my ideal weight!!!

But my first round was good. But as Bear has said, my attempts to continue/ to do a second round, to reach the weight I wanted, hadn't ever happened.

And is proving to be a lot more difficult than I think he gives credit to that aspect.

thenewaveragebear1983 · 19/03/2018 15:16

We must also bear in mind the real reason for this diet. It’s to reverse T2, quickly. If you have T2 and ‘reverse’ it doing this plan, if you regain the weight, you will get T2 back. What you’re basically doing is controlling your T2 with diet. So the diet is medicinal- eat very low carbs but that’s instead of having insulin injections, metformin, not to mention the associated health risks. Maybe that’s an ‘easier’ compromise than just eat low carbs and you’ll be slimmer?

I’m not T2, so can’t fully appreciate it, but I chose this plan because I liked the vibe of the book, and I loved this thread/community. I don’t need the T2 fighting aspect. Same for you oblomov- (I think you’re T1 right?) - maybe it’s not meant to work for you? It’s not technically a weight loss plan first and foremost, and if you don’t get the boost of reversing your health condition (either because it’s unreversable, or doesn’t exist in the first place)

There must be a maintenance strategy for keto diets, paleo diets, low carb boot camp, HFLC- it must be documented what people do once they reach targets and what works/doesn’t work. I know from my brief conversation over on boot camp last week that they don’t restrict calories, but they do restrict carbs. Would that work in maintenance I wonder? Would it be possible to just eat enough but not too much?

Aside from 10 weeks of boot camp (which is their equivalent of our 8 weeks 1st round), which has lots of allowed and banned foods, and different allowances each week, there is also a ‘Post boot camp diet’ for once that’s over, with people returning to the boot camp to do another strict few weeks periodically. Might be worth checking out in more detail?

OP posts:
APlaceAtTheBSDTable · 19/03/2018 15:31

I think the other thing MM misses (in all his weight loss plans whether BSD or 5:2) is that women need different advice from men. I definitely found BSD affected my cycle as did 5:2 when I failed miserably tried it. It's a bit like general medicine. He assumes being male is the default and doesn't really consider how the diet will perform differently for women who have different hormones, fertility issues, etc. Maintenance needs to be more than a few throwaway lines too.

I'm living in a sick house atm. DH and DS are both running fevers and I'm headachey and grumpy. DS made dinner on Sat which usually means teeny cordon bleu sized portions. However, he opted for an ice cream sundae dessert with fresh cream and fresh fruit. It was fabulous and despite being lots of calories, I enjoyed every single bite. Assuming I catch whatever bugs they have, I figure I'll have lost my appetite by mid-week so my aberration will be wiped out.

londonista · 19/03/2018 15:54

I think the reality is that 8 weeks is enough time to break you of some destructive habits -such as sitting on the sofa destroying a whole packet of HobNobs- but not really long enough to teach you a new way of living. As someone earlier said, you need to get to grips with Mediterranean Diet long term.

I have found the diet great for kick starting my journey with quite a big loss in a small amount of time, showing me what's possible if I can reduce my meal reliance on carbs. But I don't feel like I've developed a new habit of eating most of my meals carb free, I generally still miss the carbs when I'm eating. I think this would be less of a problem if I could cook, though! Grin

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.

Swipe left for the next trending thread