Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 41: Springing into March or marching into spring? Either way, more sunshine means easier fast days! Come and join us in getting healthier, the fast way.

999 replies

BetsyBell · 15/03/2014 11:04

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low; around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a TDEE calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day.

NSV/LSV = Non scale victory/Lifestyle (change) victory.

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

Other Threads
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Tips and Links : breadandwine’s resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

Inspirational: eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

Recipes: frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Exercise: bigchocfrenzy has an incredibly informative and helpful exercise and fitness thread for discussion and advice on combining 5:2 with an exercise regime.

Maintaining: If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Other links
This is a BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.

This Telegraph article comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting.

This blog post gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5lbs reduction in body weight and a 4cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant. It also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

If you’ve been researching IF you may have come across this article which is highly negative about women with BMI in the normal range. Here’s our response to that:

  • With a healthy BMI, those who want to be leaner will usually find weight and waist loss to be much slower than for overweight folk, since, less fat and inches are available to lose.
  • The women with healthy BMIs already had healthier blood sugar than the men in the study. Hence nothing really needed improving.
  • Women who have had health problems on IF were NOT doing 5:2, but the
much tougher ADF or 16:8, ^combined with heavy lifting (often multiples of body weight) AND were often starting from already ultra-low BF 12-16% range.^

-Many were already missing periods or had EDs before IF, due to the low BF %, over-training and over-stressing.

5:2 is a gentler form of IF than ADF or Leangains and there’s plenty of anecdotal evidence from longterm 5:2ers, now with healthy BMI, who are continuing to have very positive results and experiences on this WOE.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

And lastly, a few FAQs/Healthy tips :

  • WATER: Start each day with a pint of water; and drink plenty during the day.
  • Hot drinks: no limits on tea or coffee any day, just note any milk / sugar calories on FDs.
  • FDs: concentrate on protein & veg; avoid / reduce starchy carbs & sugar, including juice. Soups & stews are good; ready meals are fine. Old hands skip breakfast & save most cals for supper.
  • NFDs: no rules, but to improve health, try to cut down on added sugar, artificial sweeteners, fizzy drinks, junk food. A few treats per week are good though! Aim to average TDEE over NFDs each week, but you may under-eat by say 20% on 3 NFDs to save calories for weekend.
  • CLENCH for health: men & women should exercise pelvic floor daily.
  • Do NOT fast: if pregnant, under 21, have EDs, any illness, even a bad cold. When ill, your body usually needs more nutrients and less stress. So eat to TDEE & cut out junk, added sugar, fizzy drinks.
  • Check with your Doctor: if you have diabetes, any other endocrine condition, or if taking ANY prescribed medication (fasting may affect absorption rate).
  • BREASTFEEDERS: start with 1000-cal FDs; optionally, reduce to 700 cals gradually. You can return to 1000 if growth spurts or sleep-deprivation require more fuel.
  • SLEEP: everybody needs enough sleep, or weight loss may be slowed.
  • EXERCISE: is healthy & can help weight loss if you you do NOT eat back exercise calories. Fasted training can burn more fat. HIIT works well with 5:2/IF.
OP posts:
Thread gallery
9
Southeastdweller · 25/03/2014 17:21
zedzedzed · 25/03/2014 17:47

Sorry FD-ers, look away. Melaniecheeks
STICKY DUCK for 3 people, 560cals
Get two good quality skin-on duck breasts out of fridge a few hours before you need them.

Dry duck skin with paper towel, slash skin and combine the following in a bowl: star anise, ginger, lemongrass, chilli (or cheat and use Chinese Spice powder) add seasalt, garlic puree, 2tsp runny honey, the rind and juice of a tangerine and a blob of Teriyake sticky marinade (Tesco), keep most of this sauce for later but rub some into the duck breasts now and leave them out of fridge to relax.
Add a tbsp of Hoisin Sauce to the sauce you've put aside for later.

Peel and slice a big red onion into sort of petals. Slice 3 fat garlic cloves into wafers and cook slowly in a splodge of the sauce and 1tsp olive/sesame oil till soft.
Pour boiling water over a small cereal bowl of frozen peas or green beans, leave to defrost then drain (150g)
De-seed and finely slice half a red pepper.
Finely slice half a box mushrooms (150g).

Add all your vegetables to onions and add the rest of the sauce and the juice of a tangerine, turn heat off.

Add two packets of Tilda coconut, lime and chilli basmati steamed rice, stir to combine and put aside till it's time to eat, then just warm rice through.

Put the duck breasts skin side down in a cold pan with no oil, as it heats up the fat will render/release and turn the skin very crispy/burnt/ yummy, squeeze on some more tangerine to get all the pan juices going and spoon over duck.
Cook till meat is still very pink, remove from heat and rest on a plate for at least 5-10 mins.

Slice duck thinly and serve on top of your fragrant rice with a sprinkle of coriander on top.

Overtiredmum · 25/03/2014 18:00

Counting down to dinner, but been so busy at work I can honestly say I haven't even thought about what to have, let alone the fact that I made it through without even thinking about today being FD.

BetsyBell · 25/03/2014 18:19

Gosh, have been so absolutely exhausted today. I'm guessing none of that amazing number of hours sleep I had last night was very restful! BUT have achieved a decentish fast day considering - approx 150 cals over but all nutritious and I am full. I am off to Taekwondo soon, not sure I'll be able to pull much out of the bag energy-wise but it'll be nice to go. Kicking things is always a good thing (don't tell the kids)! DS still doing amazingly, doesn't appear to be in much pain and DH is indeed a sweetie.

Flowers again for all the well-wishing. It's hugely appreciated :) xxx

OP posts:
LakeFlyPie · 25/03/2014 18:24

zed thanks for sticky duck recipe, sounds delicious.

I don't have dancers calves, more rugby players thighs sadly.

Looking forward to FD tomorrow as have eaten my way through a terribly sugar fuelled, rainy NFD today Blush.
Wednesday is a really busy work day so hopefully won't have time to think about food, just need to remember to keep drinking.

zedzedzed · 25/03/2014 18:30

Oops, thought it was *melaniecheeks who asked for the duck recipe? Silly old brain. Whoever it was, my rice is on now and smells yummy.

betsy so glad all's well in your world, very impressed you attempted a FD after all that stress and no sleep.

Well done all the big-calved-but-now-a-bit-less-chubby people! That was my first NSV on this woe, non-pinchy kneeboots.

Considering a minifast tomorrow, all cals at dinner, just to catch up from carb Gluttony Birthday weekend, will see how I feel and how much trouble Cantankerous Granny is being.

Enjoy your dinners, whatever they may be.

LakeFlyPie · 25/03/2014 18:32

It probably was melaniecheeks, I'm just taking advantage of a delicious sounding posting Grin

Enjoy your dinner!

ErrolTheDragon · 25/03/2014 18:35

Perhaps the next thread title could be something to do with 'Killing the fatted calf'... in the light of the confluence of baggy boots and delicious NFD recipes? Grin

TwittyMcTwitterson · 25/03/2014 18:49

Has anyone got any cellulite busting exercises? I caught sight I my arse today and it basically looks like this...

ts4.mm.bing.net/th?id=HN.608047531019600915&pid=15.1

Not good considering my bmi is 25.7. Less now i suppose. Is cellulite an indication of problems like a fat waist is a sign of diabetes? It can't be healthy surely. Hmm

ErrolTheDragon · 25/03/2014 19:03

Cellulite is a sign of being an adult woman. Given that women tend to live longer than men it surely isn't unhealthy!

wiki has it about right:'...the prevailing medical opinion is that it is merely the "normal condition of many women". One cosmetic company has noted its historical place in industrialised societies as an "inappropriate term used by women to describe curves which they judge to be too plump and not very aesthetic".'

TalkinPeace · 25/03/2014 19:09

cellulite is genetic
I have never had it, nor do any of the women in my family
Princess Di had it and she was lean and toned

Not2bObvious · 25/03/2014 19:10

Stop me now!!! FD gone crazy, just about hitting 800 cals - I have to stop now. I never use my exercise cals (don't even register them in mfp as fitbit is linked in) but in my defence I did a 'ripped in 30' JM workout and a 20 min run this morning. I fasted til 5, but I think it's a bit too early to break my fast, need to hold out til 6/6.30. Ah well you live & learn. So like you Cider it may have been a high'ish FD but I'm still calling it an FD.
Evees, only cure for cellulite is don't look backGrin I'm sure I read somewhere there's flip all you can do for them, not linked necessarily to being overweight, can be genetic? If I'm wrong I'll take a correction but for me, I just take the glasses off when in the nip, what I can't see can't hurt me Wink

TwittyMcTwitterson · 25/03/2014 19:27

Urgh but it's so disgusting. Surely I can lessen it tho? I can't accept that my legs look like that and that's it! All my fat goes to my legs. They're very chunky and wobbly. If I lessen the fat surely it'll get less? HmmHmmHmm

Not2bObvious · 25/03/2014 19:35

BigChoc just remembering you talking about venison steak - I've never had it, had a bit if an unsure shuddery feeling about it. Wondering am I missing out? Who elso mentioned it, was it Betsy?
Evees since you working on reducing your weight, I guess you'll see as you go on. You'll get skinny trying if nowt elseGrin And you'll be too busy enjoying it to notice celluliteWink

Not2bObvious · 25/03/2014 19:41

Doris meant to give you a thumbs up on your tshirt nsv. Something I noticed today that was really encouraging was, it's 3 weeks since I started with my lent sacrifices and today I could see a real difference on my clothes, just had a great light bulb moment about bingey times, that once you take control and hold on, it's not long before you see the results. And seeing the results give you a lift to keep going!

BigChocFrenzy · 25/03/2014 19:42

Cellulite is just fat pushing against the connective tissue under the skin.
Even lean women can have it - genetics - but it is worsened by poor diet and lack of exercise.

Creams, spa treatments etc are a waste of money.

What can reduce (but probably not eliminate it) is to reduce body fat and increase % muscle. WebMd recommends:

  • aerobic exercise and strength training plus
  • healthy eating with lots of veg, fruit and fibre.
  • Drink water too
BigChocFrenzy · 25/03/2014 19:48

Not2b I find venison steak rather dry and not very tasty - too little fat in the meat.
It is delicious as a stew where the low fat means it is not greasy and it is greatly enhanced by the good thick sauce.
It needs a sweetish veg, which is why I have it with red cabbage, cranberry

TwittyMcTwitterson · 25/03/2014 19:54

Not2b, if I'm not skinny enough to wear shorts I'll be devastated. It's my ultimate dream. I first noticed it in school at about 14/15 Hmm

I will let you all know then! I want to take before and after pics but I don't want that sort of evidence lying around on my phone accessible to everyone who looks at my phone Hmm

DDs DF says take them, email and delete from phone. Think rafts what I'll do!

My gym induction went reasonably well and I have my first weights session tomorrow Grin

Megrim · 25/03/2014 20:05

I have a tendency to develop fatty lumps under the skin (pea sized but can be a bit bigger) and I have noticed that these have got smaller / less noticeable as my fat percentage has decreased (according to my scales, which I know will only be approximate, this has gone from 36% to 29%).

DorisAllTheDay · 25/03/2014 20:48

Not2Be well done on seeing the results of your Lenten fasting. You're right, it's great to see results. Unfortunately I don't 'see' them because I still look in the mirror and see a fat lady, so I have to go by what clothes I can wear!! (Interestingly if I catch a reflection of myself in a shop window as I go past I'm agreeably surprised by how slim I look - what's that all about?) So what did you decide to do about your FD in the end? Declare a mini-fast and stop eating, or decide to count it as an NFD and try again another day this week?

Evees, you sound a bit guarded about your gym induction. I hope it works out, and good luck with the weights.

Errol, great suggestion for the next thread title. Though I'm not sure I want the fatted calf killed so much as cut down to size. Smile

Well done on your FD, Betsy, and that's great news about your DS. Kids are amazing the way they can bounce back. I'm so glad he's on the mend. Is that him out of the woods now?

Did you see that thread on what we wore in 1994? Its a great diversion if you need one(from that head hunger thing).

No, I didn't see it, must have been when I was hiding! Can you remember whenabouts it was, and I'll have a look.

I think I've had a decent-ish NFD but I can't be sure because I was at a work meeting all afternoon in another part of my organisation, and it ended with dinner at a posh restaurant, all paid for by the company. When I say posh, that means I didn't understand the menu so I only have the vaguest idea what I was eating and I've no idea at all how to MFP any of it. It didn't feel particularly carby, and being a posh restaurant the portions were small Confused, but other than that it's guesswork. I did, however, notice that the puddings being consumed on other tables were rather creamy and frothy in appearance, so after the main course I said I was very tired because I'd had an early start (which was true) and left. I thought it was the only sure fire way to avoid disaster. Tomorrow's an FD, so if I was over TDEE I get a chance to make up for it.

Not2bObvious · 25/03/2014 21:01

Doris stopped eating @799 cals, so FD in the bag, but bigger than it should be but still good. What I noticed today was my spare tyre had a tad less pinch to itGrin Very small difference but in what had been v tight trousers, it meant I could pick up a pen without fear of the button popping! Little by little, getting there. Well done on good nfd, and good luck for tomorrow's FD

BigChocFrenzy · 25/03/2014 21:02

Errol Nearly 600 posts, just realised I must think up a thread title again, (!) so thanks I'll try to incorporate your suggestion, with a couple of other body part mods.

MazzleDazzle · 25/03/2014 21:08

It's so pleasing to read about how you're all cracking on with this WOL. Chunky calves: no more! Thunderous thighs: banished! Too tight tees: now sloppy! Love it, love it, love it...

I am on board the train! Whether a FD or NFD I am ON IT! Under TDEE, cruising through, pounds are falling off and the measurements are drop drop dropping! Have reached the conclusion that half of my cycle I am fighting ravenous hunger/being miserable/angry and struggling to maintain then the other half I'm full of energy/not in the mood for food/SVs galore! Happy to say that it's the latter at the mo. Loving it - while it lasts!

Speaking of monthly cycles, I am becoming a slave to mine [hmmm]. It's getting to the point that my damned hormones are capable of ruining a holiday/relationship/my sanity! I'm sure this never used to be the case.

These last few days I have been absolutely shattered! Off to bed for an early night. DH not due home until 11.30pm, so will probably be woken up by his (noisy!) arrival.

Hope that everyone who is poorly is on the mend and able to get some rest.

Glad to hear Betsy that all is well with your wonderfully brave DS!

ErrolTheDragon · 25/03/2014 21:34

Doris - well done avoiding posh puds!

T-shirts - my staples are Lands End - good quality cotton, lots of colours and petite fit perfect length for me.

BetsyBell · 25/03/2014 22:11

Not2Be I've been buying venison meatballs and sausages recently - they're a mix of venison and pork I think and I tend to cook them in a tomato sauce. As Bigchoc says, it's such a lean meat that it needs to be cooked with something liquidy. Tasty but not gamey. The animal is more likely to have led a happy life compared to farmed meat too.

Confession time: homemade chocolate and PB cookies were brought into class today, I ate 2. However, it has not made me want to eat anything else and actually I feel a bit sick from them. I should have just had one.

Baked-goods lightweight I am!

OP posts:
Swipe left for the next trending thread