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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 37 - Having our cake (batter off the spoon: 15 calories per lick - thanks MFP!) and eating it too (tomorrow).

999 replies

BetsyBell · 22/01/2014 16:25

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a TDEE calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV/LSV = Non scale victory/Lifestyle (change) victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

Other Threads
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Tips and Links : Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

Inspirational: eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

Recipes: frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Exercise: bigchocfrenzy has an incredibly informative and helpful exercise and fitness thread for discussion and advice on combining 5:2 with an exercise regime.

Maintaining: If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Other links
This is a BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.

This Telegraph article comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting.

This blog post gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this article appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI. (Though anecdotal evidence from these long-running threads may suggest otherwise…)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

OP posts:
Dogmatix34 · 28/01/2014 21:38

Thanks talkinpeace , that's good to know. I've got to stop weighing myself every morning and go to once a week but I've got some shiny new scales and it's so tempting!

CandyKate · 28/01/2014 21:46

Hi there, I am wondering about doing this but as I only have 5-7lbs to lose I find my motivation is really low. Would doing 6:1 help me lose weight, even if obviously slower than 5:2?

I did a FD on Monday for the first time. It was OK. I had Pret tuna salad (no dressing) and miso soup which was 200 cals and scrambled eggs and mushrooms with lots of chilli for dinner - probably 250cals? I did find it really tough and don't think I can face feeling like that 2 days a week. Particularly as I have a non-sleeping toddler!

Is anyone else/had anyone else done 6:1?

BigChocFrenzy · 28/01/2014 21:46

Toffee You didn't black out; you were just on autopilot, which we all do sometimes on familiar journeys. I cycle to and from work and gym every day, 4 journeys and frequently autopilot part of the way. Fortunately very quiet roads and cycle paths.
You are absolutely normal and ok, just human.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/01/2014 21:49

Well done on your FD, CinammonGirl . Excellent progress not to be tempted by the lemon cake. We all love "I can have it tomorrow"

BetsyBell · 28/01/2014 21:50

Oh yikes toffee, see that is exactly why I hate driving :( [hugs]

eatriskier happy birthday to the mini-eat. In absence of a teenage boy or labrador can you freeze the cake? It's probably got to the not-actually-enjoying-eating-this stage now? Oh good grief a wee-and-vomageddon too... possibly time for Wine

Shock Shock at no caffeine felix - Noooooooo, couldn't do it without lovely coffee and tea!

A tip and betsy friendly alternative to diet sodas is drinking fizzy water with lime or lemon juice. Try and give up the sweeteners folks, they really are not a good thing at all.

Welcome Dogmatix - you are right, weight bounces up and down, sometimes it stops for a while then starts again. I always advise getting out the tape measure to help boost confidence with the inevitable stalls on the scales.

I rarely weigh in these days but I think that's because it's no longer exciting when you're maintaining! 5:2 seems to keep it all in check quite nicely.

OP posts:
BetsyBell · 28/01/2014 21:52

Well done cinnamongirl - nice feeling to know you can say no isn't it?!

OP posts:
hopefulgum · 28/01/2014 21:53

Toffee, I think we all have those "blank" moments when driving. Well, I know I certainly do. I hope you are ok.

Well done Cinnamon - sounds like a real NSV to me.

My NFD was a bit of a disaster,yesterday, despite planning! I had two glasses of wine with my lunch (which was lovely) but then I was feeling very relaxed and when everyone else ordered dessert, I did too! I wish I hadn't. It just sort of got my sugar demons raging and when I got home I ate two rows of dark chocolate, which I really didn't need as I was full from lunch Angry

I tallied up all the calories on MFP (almost didn't because I knew it would be bad) and sure enough, I was way over TDEE. Grr! I am a bit cross at myself. So now I have to try and make up for the extra 650 calories somewhere. I know it is do-able, but it is our last day of holidays today - back to work tomorrow - and DH really wants to go out for lunch, has been talking about going to a particular restaurant for the last 6 weeks, so I really must go.

The beauty of this WOE, which is something I have learnt from the great wise posters on this thread, is that I can make up the deficit somewhere else. So today I will 16:8, skip breakfast and try to at least stay within TDEE , have a fast day tomorrow, then perhaps a mini fast on Saturday to sort out the balance. I can make it up as I go along.

And I suppose the worst thing that will happen is that I will maintain, I really shouldn't put any on as I'll still be in deficit over the week.

zed, don't let the size 16 jeans upset you. You have been such a voice of reason and positivity on this thread, don't be down, you know you are doing the right thing and will get there. Don't be in too much of a hurry, slow and steady will win this race.Thanks

graceholl · 28/01/2014 21:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BetsyBell · 28/01/2014 22:01

hopeful Hey, sometimes those way-over days actually help us lose weight! As if it tricks your body into getting complacent about food so it doesn't work too hard to save up more calories for a couple of days Grin It's why it's good to have a nice big contrast between a fast day and non fast day and why we recommend going over tdee one day a week.

You have the tools to deal with it gum so enjoy occasional big meals without guilt or worry.

grace Liquid only fast :)

OP posts:
BigChocFrenzy · 28/01/2014 22:04

Grace LOF is Liquid Only Fast, instead of a normal FD. Most LOFs are near-zero calories in 24 hrs, so just water, tea, coffee, no sugar. They are done either for health benefits or to speed up weight loss.

However, a few folk, e.g. me, do 500 cal FDs as LOFs with low-carb protein shakes, simply for convenience.

graceholl · 28/01/2014 22:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

CinammonGirl · 28/01/2014 22:15

Thank you bigchoc, betsy , hopeful I was very pleased with myself :)

Slugsonmypeasgrr · 28/01/2014 22:24

Hi all, am new to this malarkey and to the diet threads on mm but thought I 'do just plunge in if you don't mind? I find calorie counting horribly boring hence why never dieted before. I am wondering if I are too much on my FD today? Am bfing a 7 month old so allowing a bit more than 500 I guess. I had:
1 coffee with semi skimmed milk, I small bowl of yoghurt, strawberries and peaches (I did weigh the yoghurt so it was about 50 cal worth), 1 small bowl home made chicken noodle soup for lunch and a large one for dinner but it was the end of the batch so no noodles left, just chicken and veg, an apple and two rice cakes with a smear of wholenut peanut butter (no added sugar). Does this sound about right? I couldn't figure out the chicken noodle soup at all calories wise!

Slugsonmypeasgrr · 28/01/2014 22:25

Ate not are...

Slugsonmypeasgrr · 28/01/2014 22:29

I'm worried because I don't feel hungry but I did on my first FD

BigChocFrenzy · 28/01/2014 22:43

Slugs If you are BFing, you can have 1000 cals and reduce to 700 gradually when you feel able. You can check in MFP what your exact count was, but it sounds fine for a BF FD.

MazzleDazzle · 28/01/2014 22:44

Haven't had a chance to catch up on thread, so just a quick check-in.

Today was a NFD coming in at 15% below my TDEE.

Went to Costa today and chose the lowest cal options. How handy that they openly display the calorie content of everything!

Fighting fit, so back to exercise class tomorrow morning. Feel so lazy having not worked out for 4 days. Hard to believe that only a month ago I hadn't worked out in three years!

ErrolTheDragon · 28/01/2014 23:00

Glad you're back in action, Mazzle!

Yes, it does help that more places are displaying calorie counts now - though some are rather gobsmacking.

BigChocFrenzy · 28/01/2014 23:42

Tip, Betsy : You are 100% correct that artificial sweeteners are not good. There are suggestions that they may be neurotoxins.

It's just that most folk - like me !! - can't deal with too many life changes at once.

That applies also to cutting out sugary junk crap like muffins, cheesecake, ice cream.... which I have massively reduced, but will never eliminate.

Fix what you can, when you can, as far as you can.

DorisAllTheDay · 28/01/2014 23:49

Aaaargh. I have eaten so much in the last three days I feel ill. I'm all gassy and bloated. Still, a very minor victory on the train on the way home. Despite having eaten all sorts of rubbish since Sunday (at a residential work event) I bought a pack of 4 hot cross buns to eat on the train on the way home this evening. I was already full to the point of feeling sick but I bought them anyway. I ate two of them and couldn't physically manage to get the other two down. I would normally have brought them home with me in an 'I've paid for them so I'll eat them' mindset. However, I'm determined that they won't derail my FD tomorrow, so I left them on the train.

I think I'm actually looking forward to FDs tomorrow and Friday, to give my digestion a rest. In fact, maybe an LOF would be a good idea tomorrow? Can someone explain to me how it works? Would I have liquid only right up until bedtime, or should I break fast after 24 hours (which would be about 8pm)? I know that 50 calories or less counts as LOF, it's just the timing I'm not sure of.

Breadandwine · 29/01/2014 02:03

Doris I laughed out loud at leaving the surplus buns on the train! That's got to be a great NSV!

A complete LOF is to have no solid food for 36 hours between dinner and breakfast on the third day. So, finish dinner at 8pm, have only liquids (up to your 50cal limit) the next day, then have breakfast the following morning.

A 24-hr LOF would mean that you would eat your 500 cals all in one meal - at 8pm the next day.

HTH! And good luck!

frenchfancy · 29/01/2014 07:25

Doris Leaving the buns is a great NSV. But as you were full when you bought them next time remember that and don't buy them at all.

Heads up to everyone - Horizon is on tonight sugar vs fat apparently the results are shocking and surprising.

zedzedzed · 29/01/2014 07:29

Poor doris you sound like a bun junkie! Well done for the baked goods abandonment.

hopeful thanks for that comment, what a lovely sweet thing to say! Thanks Smile

NFD here but as it's Cake Wednesday at playgroup and I'm meeting a friend in a café afterwards (where there're scones galore) I will skip breakfast and plan just a spicy beef salad for dinner so I can have a scone (I know I have enough in my TDEE to eat ALL the scones, but The Jeans are still haunting me a bit...although I have fought off the urge to eat bugger all every single day in order to hurry this along, but knowing that I will set off a starve/binge pattern and knowing I AM losing, steadily, is helping me to be sensible...

I will simply eat within 20% beneath my TDEE and I will fast on FDs. Repeat all day and avoid looking directly at The Jeans

IPokedABadgerWithASpoon · 29/01/2014 07:38

Im so tired today, just want to eat a pack of biscuits lying on the sofa on my own! Instead I'll go make some porridge and interact with the children....

positively9something · 29/01/2014 08:07

Morning all I had a terrible earring day yesterday I had around 2700 cals ConfusedConfusedConfused including wine and homemade flapjacks HmmHmm

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