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Fasting / 5:2 diet

The 5:2 thread number 37 - Having our cake (batter off the spoon: 15 calories per lick - thanks MFP!) and eating it too (tomorrow).

999 replies

BetsyBell · 22/01/2014 16:25

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a TDEE calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV/LSV = Non scale victory/Lifestyle (change) victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

Other Threads
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Tips and Links : Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

Inspirational: eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

Recipes: frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Exercise: bigchocfrenzy has an incredibly informative and helpful exercise and fitness thread for discussion and advice on combining 5:2 with an exercise regime.

Maintaining: If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Other links
This is a BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.

This Telegraph article comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting.

This blog post gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this article appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI. (Though anecdotal evidence from these long-running threads may suggest otherwise…)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

OP posts:
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DorisAllTheDay · 31/01/2014 21:37

Congratulations, Dino, and thanks for explaining BFP, Errol! Mazzle, your roast potatoes sound to die for. I made Toffee's savoury rice for tea and it was yummy and very easy to do at the end of a day at work. It's been a hard FD, but bedtime is nearly here and I'm sure I can last out. Whenshewasbad I love that story of your DD in the car.

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zedzedzed · 31/01/2014 21:38

Big choc nooooooo...shame on you! As a cheesecake that sounds truly minging, sorry, as a whippy Angel Delighty thing; yum! Big Choc's Minging Delight.

Interested in the cancer stuff too as my Aunty's diagnosis last week was 2b cervical cancer and she'll be starting chemo 5weeks after the tumor is removed, so Thanks

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BigChocFrenzy · 31/01/2014 21:43

Yes, WhenSheWasBad, I howled with laughter over DD and your toilet seat car Grin
That's one of the stories you can relate when she's all grown up, maybe to her DP and DC !

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BigChocFrenzy · 31/01/2014 21:47

Zed It tastes delic, has miles fewer cals than conventional cheesecake and - most important - is so quick & easy that even I've never ruined it.
I make it while the oven is heating up for my pizza or cheese fondue, then it chills in the fridge while they are baking.

Ooh, you can tell I'm on an FD. Time for another cuppa with Stevia.

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zedzedzed · 31/01/2014 21:58

Have just worked out that one slice of digestive and butter based full-fat mascarpone and half fat Philly vanilla cheesecake, sweetened with icing sugar and drizzled with salted caramel (my new obsession) and toasted pecan pieces, will be under 400 cals...but have yet to see how small this slice will be and don't know whether the other 11 slices will survive freezing. Hmmm. Best not find out this week.

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hopefulgum · 31/01/2014 22:00

Congratulations Dino.Wonderful news. How long had you been ttc?

I am very pleased to hear that the rate of women getting pregnant whilst 5:2- ing is high. I've just given up ttc after 4 years, but I still hope for a little accident (not trying but not avoiding either). Maybe 5:2 makes women more fertile? I have been thinking about a holiday to the Maldives too as that seemed to work for MrsF...I have always wanted to go to the Maldives, looks absolutely gorgeous and I love snorkling...Grin

It is good to hear of so many SV and NSV. I can't remember them all, but I am always so happy to hear them.It really keeps me motivated.

I am sorry to hear that cheesecake is the work of the devil.It is probably my favourite dessert, and I was going to make a baked ricotta cheesecake for the get together of knitters I am hosting tomorrow. Would the ricotta make it lower in fat and therefore better?

I am hoping I will be able to find that Horizon show on the net,as I am in Australia and it probably won't be on my telly for a long time.If anyone has a link, let me know.

I am still quite confused about whether or not to eat up to TDEE on NFD's. I understand that some people eat less so they can splurge on other days, but I don't understand the science of whether staying under TDEE consistently gives you more of a deficit and therefore more weight loss, or whether, on this WOE, eating under TDEE, consistently, causes a slowing of weight loss?

Anyone know???

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zedzedzed · 31/01/2014 22:01

when she was pfffft! That's brilliant about the car seat! Have yet to tackle potties with my 2yr old and found a pool of poo in the feet of my 6month old's babygrow this morning; a genuine mystery.

I may wait till summer to go free range with the nappy-less pooing.

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hopefulgum · 31/01/2014 22:03

OMG zed, my mouth is watering at your cheesecake description. Especially with salted caramel. Doesn't get much better than that!

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Megrim · 31/01/2014 22:42

hopefulgum when you say " I love snorkeling", is that some some sort of code between you and your DH? I'm really hoping that 5:2 is not a massive fertility booster as the youngest is about to turn 9 and I'm feeling like I finally have my life back...

The Horizon Sugar v Fat programme is on BBC iPlayer for the next month (search BBC 2 Wed 29th Jan). It's a bit pop culture but there is some interesting stuff in there.

Mmmmm cheesecake. I feel like Homer Simpson.

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MazzleDazzle · 31/01/2014 23:04

Well if we're going for Minging Delight, swap the Stevia and Phili for a tin of condensed milk! Wink

Bad Mazzle! (slaps wrist)

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Megrim · 31/01/2014 23:14

Condensed milk? Sounds dangerously like tablet.

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zedzedzed · 31/01/2014 23:16

Two tins...one goes in with the philly/mascarpone, the other gets boiled to make caramel for between the two layers. Just saying!

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zedzedzed · 31/01/2014 23:18

Mmmmm...tablet cheesecake...right.

Night.

This is like pudding porn.

Go to bed Zed.

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MazzleDazzle · 31/01/2014 23:23

Spooning caramel straight from the boiled tin!

Tablet!

This is hitting my sugar addiction where it hurts. We're better than that though. We've moved on. We don't need sugar.

But should you ever have a relapse: one tin of condensed milk and 12 teaspoons of bottled lemon juice...Grin

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WhenSheWasBadSheWasExhausted · 31/01/2014 23:27

zed mystery poo? It's got to be the 2 year old, maybe he was trying to get the baby into trouble?

megrim what's tablet? I'm sure it's a Scottish thing but I really haven't a clue.

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Megrim · 31/01/2014 23:39

Tablet - it's a sort of fudge made from sugar, butter and condensed milk. It's so baaaaaad. But it's good.

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BigChocFrenzy · 31/01/2014 23:51

Taking my empty FD tum off to bed now, so ......

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

REMINDER

Please use up this old thread first - max 1000 posts

Then NEW THREAD is Here

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Not2bObvious · 01/02/2014 07:57

Just checking in to help fill up the thread.
Been off the chart the last 2 days following a vvv tough week at work that had me reaching for the chocolate by the bucket. And of course I know that's not the way to cope with emotions but habits are too long ingrained and for me, sometimes it's the only way to feel a bit better.
So anyway it's all done now til the next time I didn't bother with the scales this week as between the overrating and sluggish bowel(sorry tmi) I can't imagine it would be kind to me. I'll just go by my clothes for this month I think. Doing a 16:8 as I have a party this afternoon but I'll eat something before it so I don't gorge too much. Also have an appointment with hitler, I mean JillianGrin
Then tomorrow I'll cook food for the week and make a plan I can stick with. Wondering if I should change my fd's to Monday & Wednesday with a mini fast somewhere else, maybe Saturday as I can do 16:8 on the weekend standing on my head! Sorry for the blah blah blah, me me me. Felt like I needed to confess my sins

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DinoSnores · 01/02/2014 08:01

Thanks for all the congratulations! It is early days so anything could happen but at the moment, I am pregnant, so we'll see what happens.

talkinpeace, thanks for the link. I don't want to fast given the evidence isn't there - and partly because in the first trimester, I normally lose a stone with the nausea and vomiting.

I completely agree about staying fit during pregnancy. My BMI is 22.9 so my weight is fine, and I'll be carrying on with exercise as I would normally. Really the advice is that it is fine to continue whatever you were doing before right the way throughout.

I LOVE Pilates and am sure that helped a lot with my recovery after DD1. If you watch people doing Pilates, it doesn't look like they are doing anything, does it? But it definitely feels like you are doing something!

hopefulgum, we've only been properly TTC for one month, but we've not used any contraception, other than BFing, since DD1 was born a year ago. I hope you have your happy accident soon. As for TDEE, I think varying your calorie intake is important, so fasting, then eating up to your TDEE, eating a bit more, eating a bit less, so your body doesn't entirely know what is happening!

megrim, I've not had tablet for ages! I'm wondering if I can get my family to send some south of the border for me now...

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postmanpatscat · 01/02/2014 08:17

dino you can buy home made tablet on eBay - I do! I'm not a Scot but tablet is the closest thing to the fudge recipe my mum used.

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MelanieCheeks · 01/02/2014 08:27

I'll pass on the tablet thanks - far too sweet for me. DH loves it, though.

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Eatriskier · 01/02/2014 08:44

Congrats dino

Good news here for now at least. Dehumidifier did its work and I'm posting this on my mac book. Fingers crossed it will stay alive. Because I've looked into new laptops (can't afford another mac) and they all have awful reviews, mainly due to windows 8 being a complete ball ache apparently.

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BigChocFrenzy · 01/02/2014 09:47

Dino Fasting has many exciting potential benefits but at least for now, is against recommendations during pregnancy. See the scienece articles I posted earlier: calorie or carb restriction during is a bad idea for the baby, unless medically advised.

The scientific consensus seems to be to just eat to TDEE (which may be far less than normal eating) and cut out junk and alcohol. So, basically healthy maintenance.

Exercise is highly recommended for most women, although maybe not running.

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BigChocFrenzy · 01/02/2014 09:49

Not2b I normally do 16:8 at the weekend and I usually make one of them an FD or mini-FD. My way of controlling weekend Frenzies !

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Not2bObvious · 01/02/2014 10:20

Thanks bcf, yeah I think that's the way to go, 16:8 on the weekend would allow under 1000 and if I do it right, there's no great pain. Couple it with a good JM session or run and I'm sure it'll help over time. Speaking of JM, found a new workout which is with weights, I'll be doing that in an hour...after I have a little read of my kindleWink Only about 2 more hours and my 8 hour window opens. Gotta love this WOL

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