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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 35 - A new year’s resolution you’ll want to keep? Try 5:2 - it's not a diet, it's a lifestyle. Whether you want to shift fat, get healthy or discover some missing self control -

999 replies

BetsyBell · 08/01/2014 17:11

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website or app many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a TDEE calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV/LSV = Non scale victory/Lifestyle (change) victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

Other Threads
All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Tips and Links : Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

Inspirational: eatriskier’s thread has some lovely inspiring stories which are worth checking out if you want some motivation to get started or keep going through a plateau. Please add your own too.

Recipes: frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Exercise: bigchocfrenzy has an incredibly informative and helpful exercise and fitness thread for discussion and advice on combining 5:2 with an exercise regime.

Maintaining: If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Other links
This is a BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon - link to that programme here.

This Telegraph article comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting.

This blog post gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this article appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI. (Though anecdotal evidence from these long-running threads may suggest otherwise…)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this way of life!

OP posts:
Not2bObvious · 12/01/2014 17:07

Sometimes Toffee there isn't a thing wrong with eating just coz, just cause you're tired, just cause you're cold, just for a little comfort. The fact that you fast 2 days a week and are mindful a lot of the time balances it all out. Very few people only ever eat when hungry, certainly in our world!
Take some credit for yourself, if I cooked like you I could never ever lose weight - my mouth would be full all the time. You've lost a stone, you're just on a bit of a plateau, it'll pass. Be kinder to yourself

mscnile · 12/01/2014 17:13

Feeling woozily full here, made boeuf bourgignonne and tarte tatin for lunch, had friends over, lovely time had by all. I will fast tomorrow and be back on track. I'm not losing at the moment, but I'm not gaining either and am enjoying eating, that makes it worth it!

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 12/01/2014 18:11

Not2bObvious - I feel I haven't fasted properly this past week at all. Just had bacon and toast. Already thinking of the crap crisps and chocolate DH and I will eat later while watching 24. Feel argh at the thought of not having them. Feel back to square one and I know it is because I haven't lost anything since January 6th and I have been eating in a you don't rule me food kind of way and I know that only hurts me.

I think I need to take a break for a bit. I am sick of my moaning so can't blame anyone else for Hmm at me.

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs · 12/01/2014 18:14

Um, I have read Michael Moseley book and he says adf and even fasting for longer ie. 4 days consecutive is fine, just as far as he was concerned 2 days non consecutive was what worked best for him and his preferences/lifestyle.

I don't pig out on nfds, just three meals a day, of whatever I feel like and the odd treat. I have been on and off 5:2 for about a year, and I find if I do 5:2 only I don't lose, I could calorie count or skip meals on my nfds, but personally I find it quite tedious and like I am still constantly on a diet.

I have lost 3lb this week because it is my first week back on it after Xmas, and this figure is slightly skewed as my start weight was obviously after a nfd and my 2nd weigh-in was after a fd.

I don't think I am anywhere near bulimic. I personally think having extended fasts even on "nfds" is no better/different than having an extra fd, as technically you are not giving your body any rest from fasting.

We all do this the way that works for us.

TalkinPeace · 12/01/2014 18:19

Tossedsalads
MM was never overweight
he never had issues with portion control
AND that book has been very heavily edited in light of what he and his researchers (quite openly) read on the first 6 MN threads.

Unless your BMI is already under 23, you need to take the book with a pinch of salt

If you really want to change your life for the good, forever, please listen to the people on this thread who have succeeded in significant weight loss

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs · 12/01/2014 18:19

And doesn't the op say this thread is also for those doing 4:3 and adf?

I'm doing adf. I don't always, so some weeks I do do 5:2 or 4:3 if I have social events etc.

Geckos48 · 12/01/2014 18:23

I do 4:3 or 5:2 if I am busy :)

I would like to feel welcome here even though I am not doing things exactly the way some might feel I should.

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 12/01/2014 18:23

I need to get back to looking at fixing my food issues again and making sure I eat sensibly and not worry about the weight.

I come from a family of fat women. So fat I am the slimmest.
I saw myself in the window yesterday and thought I looked slim. NSV.
I can get over being scared of food again as I have done it before.
I am not ruled by food. Grow up you muppet.

Tomorrow I will fast. I also need to sort out what exercise I am going to do as walking up a steep ill today I was worrying about having an asthma attack.

zedzedzed · 12/01/2014 18:23

What are the major ways it's been edited please TIP?

TalkinPeace · 12/01/2014 18:24

fine, but if you are doing ADF, that is three fasts one week and four the next, not four each week
please
listen
folks here want to help you be in a good place in five years time
IF has nothing to do with rapid weight loss

zedzedzed · 12/01/2014 18:24

Just so I don't start out on the wrong fatfoot!

frumpet · 12/01/2014 18:28

can i ask a quick question ? I am thinking of starting 4.3 but will do it on set days , so tuesday , thursday and saturday every week , is this ok ?

zedzedzed · 12/01/2014 18:28

It's all quite tricky eh? As many people, here and all over the western World, have various food issues and can feel quite vulnerable when trying to get control of them. It's easy to be misunderstood or 'speak' too bluntly when you have no tone of voice and are only typing.

XXX

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 12/01/2014 18:29

Everyone is welcome Geckos.

I am certainly not doing it right atm and so far I haven't been kicked off!

zedzedzed · 12/01/2014 18:30

Toffee aka Ms Muppet. You are a marvel. Stop beating yourself up if you can. Eat as healthily as you can manage, stay active and re-evaluate in a few days when your brain feels better. Glad you got your cat back. XXX

ErrolTheDragon · 12/01/2014 18:32

Toffee - well done! - going from being sick of yourself moaning to deciding what you are going to do about it is excellent! My epiphany exercise-wise was being sick hearing myself whine about lack of upper-body strength.

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs · 12/01/2014 18:34

Um, I did 3 fasts last week, I'll be doing four next week. Well that's the plan anyway. If something comes up I'll do less.

I am also getting back into exercise after long illness and trying out some new low gl recipes next week. If weight loss turns out to be steady with these changes I'll reduce fast days.

I am doing this for weight loss mainly, i will not lie or apologise about that. This is because I am overweight and need to lose weight. Some people diet to lose weight.

ErrolTheDragon · 12/01/2014 18:36

can i ask a quick question ? I am thinking of starting 4.3 but will do it on set days , so tuesday , thursday and saturday every week , is this ok ?

Yes. I think most people tend to do set days - from what I've read, one of the downsides of ADF versus 4:3 is that it isn't set days so its harder to plan. But the beauty of IF of whatever type is that if for some reason you need to change - eg best friend's birthday bash - then you can swap days around. Smile

BsshBossh · 12/01/2014 18:36

5:2, 4:3, ADF all fine but not 4 FDs a week every week.

Eatriskier · 12/01/2014 18:36

frumpet no problems with that at all! though as a lot of people here suggest why not start 5:2 and ease into fasting first?

TalkinPeace · 12/01/2014 18:37

ZedZed
If you watch the original MM prgramme in the context of the others he was making over the two years running up to it,
he has no idea at all that 5:2 would become the mega craze weight loss system it has become.
He happened to lose wight - but his reasons for investigating fasting were the same as those for investigating HIIT
MM has a horrific family history of early death due to CV disease

When the book was being planned there were various posters who were researchers for both the MM book and website who were picking our brains

  • because the weight loss industry had reared its very lucrative head.

BUT
as with all books, they are locked at a point in time about six months before the publication date
so the book is 18 months behind the curve in terms of the humungous data set that is accumulating

ADF / 4:3 etc are great - but they are not weight loss techniques.
They are health management techniques

The fact that 5:2 has been appropriated as a mass weight loss technique was never envisaged in August 2012

BsshBossh · 12/01/2014 18:38

But I don't think TossedSalad meant she was doing 4 FDs every week...

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs · 12/01/2014 18:40

Mm lost 20lb, was very proud of the fact and talks about it frequently.

frumpet · 12/01/2014 18:43

Tuesday and thursdays are when i work , i leave home at 6.30 and dont get back till about 1630 , i might have two coffees at work , but never eat so these are by far the easiest days to do it , as i wouldnt normally eat then until about 2100 . Saturday , because i rarely go out and if i do its normally a friday .
What i would love to know is , how many calories are there in a pint of skimmed milk ?

TossedSaladsAndScrambledEggs · 12/01/2014 18:45

Exactly. I never said I was doing four FDs every week. I aim to fast every other day, but often this changes due to social things. In fact I can't remember doing 4 FDs in a week before.

This week that is the plan as I have fd tomorrow so that means I should do 4 this week. I may stick to it as I am on dry jan so won't be having wine at the weekend. Often if I do have a drink at the weekend adf doesn't really happen as I don't fast the day after I've had a drink and I don't drink on fast days.