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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 30 - Did half term bingeing make you feel dirty? Then hop on board thread number 30!

999 replies

BetsyBell · 07/11/2013 16:09

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 16/11/2013 19:56

Thanks Cuckoo that was just what I needed. Ive been seeing the signs but ignoring them. I need to stop that. Last year when I was just trying to eat less I often asked myself if that was the last time I was ever going to eat that lovely meal I was stuffing my face with. The answer was always no and Id get another chance to eat it again. That soon stopped me finishing that meal. Now I just need to put it all into practice again.

sweetiepie1979 · 16/11/2013 20:14

Ach I'm feeling swamped by the rules of this diet and don't know if it's just hormones,had baby 3 weeks ago, started this week and scales are jumping between 4 pounds. Feel sad and unmotivated now. I've 2 stone to lose I'm only 5 foot 2 so should I be eating less than 500 on FD day?I want to cry!

Talkinpeace · 16/11/2013 20:16

chocolatepudding
Sugar is lethal stuff for keeping healthy.
THe more you eat, the more you need, when you go cold turkey from sugar you get serious crashes
I'm lucky - I'm allergic to chocolate and have never had a sweet tooth
BUT
if I could do one thing for ALL overweight people, I'd put a 900% VAT rate onto all products with added sugar
it knackers your hunger reflex
it buggers up your blood chemistry
its the one food "group" that we just do not need, ever, ever

then again, honey sandwiches and maple syrup and jam donuts ....

sadly, part of being a healthy size involves a mahoosive reduction in sugar intake compared with the BMI > 24 person ....

BsshBossh · 16/11/2013 20:22

sweetiepie the only rules of 5:2 are: twice a week eat no more than 500 cals (females) or 600 cals (males); five days a week eat normally.

The complications arise with the "eat normally" bit as most overweight people don't know how to do this - hence we add on a few extra rules that suit the individual.

But the basic rule of 5:2 is very simple.

BiscuitsAreMyDownfall · 16/11/2013 20:56

sweetie look at the TDEE link at the top and work out your TDEE. Stick to that 5 days a week, the other 2 days stick to 500.

I'm going cold turkey in regards to biscuits and any food after half 8 (my binge eating time - I'm never hungry, but I've got used to eating crap while watching TV at night) ever. By December I won't even want anything any more.

BetsyBell · 16/11/2013 20:57
Confused

I wasn't SWATH - that was something to do with staying same weight something something…

HIFUC - sounds a bit brutal Shock - Healthy IF Until Christmas (thank you bigchoc)

I'll probably just stick with calling it NNN Grin

Sweetiepie the calorie counting is just for a bit, to learn what your 'normal' eating should look like. Most of us are here because we've got that bit wrong in the past.

OP posts:
BetsyBell · 16/11/2013 20:59

sweetie You've just had a baby (congratulations!), you don't need to be thinking about losing weight right now Flowers [hugs]

OP posts:
toffeesponge · 16/11/2013 21:22

Damn, had on piece of chocolate too much. Why doesn't it tell you to stop one before you do. I feel trapped today. I am physically and emotionally tired and now I am not comfy in my clothes. I like being in my dressing gown.

DS1 hurt DS2 to the point that he cried a lot, twice, and we had to give him pain relief. Very cross with DS1.

I am tired.

Well done to everyone. Sorry for being so rubbish at keeping up with you all.

Talkinpeace · 16/11/2013 21:27

toffesponge
you have a large garden : my best idea for your boys www.snowpawstore.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Stake-out-Dogs.jpg Xx Tip

PS have just booked a theatre for DH in the new year - might massively out myself and get you all to come to a "meet up" Grin

toffeesponge · 16/11/2013 21:33

Oh God. If only!!!

DS1 had the cat on his bed. DS2 wanted to say goodnight. DS1 did not want him too and pushed the door on him, trapping his thumb in it Angry.

ChocolatePudding · 16/11/2013 21:34

I know you are all right. Sugar is lethal, both to our physical and mental health. I'm making my pledge that I will refrain from any sugary snacks (choc, biscuits, ice cream, sweets) Mon - Fri until Christmas. Have to include Friday so that I can start weekend on a positive note.

However I'm starting on Tuesday. Sister is visiting on Monday and its been so long since we met up without kids and we can finally sit down to a chocolate eclair at our favourite patisserie and not have to share Grin.

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 21:41

Back again after 1¾hr fasted training: spin, plus lifting for upper body main muscle groups. FD today ending at 80 cals.

Tomorrow a.m. is fasted spin plus weights for leg/bum plus small muscle groups. After I end the fast, my aim is to be within TDEE for Sunday (after 4600 cals Friday i to elastic tum)
^^

Betsy well done for remembering HIFUC = Healthy IF Until Christmas

SWATH = Same Weight After The Hols
So, I weigh myself on 12th Dec, just before the first Xmas parts and then on 2 Jan. Aim is No gain

Anyone is very welcome to join HIFUC or SWATH. ChocPud, Ducky
^^
Smile

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 21:42

Type: Xmas parties

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 21:46

ChocPud Well done, You've joined HIFUC ! ( i.e. no sweet junk m-f until Xmas)
We allow treats at weekends, because deprivation is not in this WOE.

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 16/11/2013 22:03

(((( Sweetie )))) I remember you. But I'm sure you said you weren't going to start until 6 weeks! (wags finger)

Listen....... It is hormones!

You can do this. It is not complicated. Compared to raising babies, this is simple! What you have going on right now is hormone haywire!

If you really really want to start now, then deep breaths, read the thread on tips and hints and then just start gradually.

........ But I highly recommend you wait a few weeks (at least). Not going to lecture you on anything, other than ..... don't make life harder for yourself than it needs to be right now! You've just had a baby, woman! You will be suffering a severe case of baby brain and your emotions will be up and down like goodness knows what! You have a toddler to boot! Are you a glutton for punishment?????

Whatever your motives for wanting to start this now, ask yourself, for your own sanity.... can it not wait a while longer??

If you insist on getting started then why not just give yourself a few weeks, during which you make sensible food choices ie avoid crap, drink lots of water, try to get out for lots of walks - fresh air and exercise will sort body and mind.
Maybe try to fit in bits of exercise here and there - loads of ideas on here, just ask.

During which, you can try to familiarise yourself with the whole 5:2 thing. Stay in touch with us on here. Ask questions, tell us about yourself and your goals, get comfy with it all.

Then when your body, by which I mean mind, has recovered more from the MONUMENTAL effort of bringing forth life, then you will be in a much better position to get stuck in.

Give yourself a break! It's been 3 weeks! 2 stone is nothing compared to what some have achieved on this thread, so don't worry, you will get there. A few more weeks won't make much of a difference to your figure, but if you try to overdo things too much, your mind could really suffer, and that is a lot harder to repair!

Congrats on your baby, and big hugs and well wishes from me. I think success will come faster if you approach this when you've had a bit more time.

I hope I haven't offended or patronised you in any way. I'm only typing from love and if I'm honest - a little bit of illegal NNN wine! Shock But all with good intentions Thanks

somewherebecomingrain · 16/11/2013 22:04

Hiya.

Think my stomach is shrinking. Ok I ate my dp's birthday present (a two-layer box of Milk Tray). Ok I ate 1000 cals for breakfast in the form of cake. Ok I ate rich chocolate cake and ice cream for tea.

I was going to say that I couldn't eat much bread at lunch but that looks pathetic!

Ok maybe my stomach isn't shrinking. Maybe I have a sugar problem or my extreme sweet tooth from breast feeding is just too strong.

My 4inch loss round my waist is hanging in there at least.

Think I need a 3:2:2 plan. Two fasts and two sugar free days on top.

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 16/11/2013 22:05

MEET UP MEET UP MEET UP MEET UP

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 22:19

Congratulations on the new baby Sweetie !
Flowers
I read for new Mums:
-Wait at least 12 weeks after birth before starting 5:2

  • FDs are 750 cals for BFing, not 500.

Do give yourself time to recover and for you and BabySweetie to become used to each others foibles.

duckyfuzz · 16/11/2013 22:22

Bigchocfrenzy I think I am up for hifuc having been out for a meal tonight and order fish, which I never do - sadly when it came it was cold so they offered me a free dessert to make up for it HmmGrin will also aim for swath

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 22:24

Somewhere Why not join Betsy, Cuckoo, ChocPud and me on HIFUC (Healthy IF Until Christmas). We just allow sweet junk at weekends.

BigChocFrenzy · 16/11/2013 22:25

Welcome to the pros Ducky!
Hmm

sweetiepie1979 · 16/11/2013 22:45

Cuckoo your so llovely thank you I needed that I wish you were my friend rl xxx

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 16/11/2013 23:23

Glad to help Thanks X

You will have to join the queue for friendship though, soz!

I am in demand since my big coming out as Billy no mates the other day! Wink

I jest of course!

I am your friend. And just as I have had pointed out to me recently, there are lots of them on here just waiting to get to know you!

You will be fine Sweetie, and this lot will help get your head in the right place for dealing with all sorts. Just keep posting or lurking and as Tip would say - ride the wave of support on here. X

Coveredinweetabix · 17/11/2013 08:53

Hello all
So many posts to catch up on...
Regarding Christmas - I'm quite lucky as I do 4:3 with my FDs being Mon, Weds & Fri. Christmas Day falls on a Weds this year so I'll miss that FD but think I should be able to do the rest as none of our visitors arrive before the Tues morning & they leave on the Fri morning so I can fast as usual on those days. The week before may be a bit more challenging as I've got a couple of nights out but, once the dates are all finalised, I'll take a look at the calendar and see what I can do. I should be able to fit in at least two FDs. I'm also going to make sure I don't buy stuff "just in case". Just in case of what? In these days of mobiles etc, it's very unlikely someone would just turn up on the doorstep and, if they did, then they would see it as a bonus to be offered a biscuit. If I did want to offer them more, we have three supermarkets within 10mins off us.
MrsF - I hope you have had and have enjoyed some child free time. I find I don't need spa days or shopping trips or treats, just some peace & quiet. We're relatively lucky as, whilst the closest family member is 4hrs away, both sets of grandparents are fit & able and are very hands on with the DC when they are around meaning we can go out and even away for a night. But it is not the same as having GPs down the road which most of my local friends seem to have. Luckily, my pre-DC friends all have DH/DPs with "big" jobs so we can whinge to each other and support each other. DP's job isn't too bad at the moment but he'll have to go for a promotion in the next 18mths and that will involve longer hours, more travelling etc which neither of us want but he can't just stagnate at this level for the rest of his career. He's not 40 yet.

Sweetie - give yourself time. You have a three week old. You'll be all over the place and your body doesn't have a clue what's going on. If you're bf'ing then it's really early days and I think you should still be establishing supply especially as there'll be a growth spurt coming up. If you're ff'ing then you'll still be hideously sleep deprived. Having two is so different to just having a newborn as you can't nap during the day or chill on the sofa but have to do things with your older DC too.

Betsey - amazing lifestyle change mark. Well done.

... I need to go & skim back through the thread as I have other people to respond to but have forgotten who & what.

Coveredinweetabix · 17/11/2013 08:56

Cuckoo - how could I forget you & your news. That must have been such a tough decision to make as it's not the dream you had when you met your DH but it sounds as though you (and therefore your DD) will be happier. No doubt the next few months are going to take a lot of juggling and some very stressful times as you work out the day to day details. Hopefully, we will be able to support you through this.