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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

The 5:2 thread number 30 - Did half term bingeing make you feel dirty? Then hop on board thread number 30!

999 replies

BetsyBell · 07/11/2013 16:09

The continuing thread for those of us following the 5:2 fast or other forms of fasting such as 4:3, ADF, or daily 16:8.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012 and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat normally - or approximately your Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE - see explanation below). 4:3 is the same except you fast on 3 days in the week. Alternate-day fasting (ADF) is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. 16:8 is another form where you stick to only eating in an 8 hour window each day, therefore fasting for 16 hours each day.

By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average for a woman, 600 for a man, on those days.

You'll find on these threads we use a number of acronyms. If you're new to the threads, or Mumsnet in general, they might not make much sense.

WOE/WOL = Way Of Eating/Way Of Life. We use this term instead of "diet" as many of us see this as something to do in the long term.

MFP = My Fitness Pal, a website many use for keeping track of the number of calories they're eating.

TDEE = Total Daily Energy Expenditure, quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

NFD = Non fast day

NSV = Non scale victory

Michael Mosley has a website to accompany his book on the subject. Please go check it out, as he's the whole reason most of us are here!

Lurkers and new starters: please just jump in and post - you'll find a lot of support here and we’re a friendly bunch.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

All our previous threads can be found by browsing through the fasting section of the site.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the tips and links that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

If you've been at this a while and are moving on to maintaining your goal weight, there is a thread here to discuss that.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

There's a link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

This link nicely demonstrates that there are many body ‘right’ body shapes and types, because what we are actually aiming for is low body fat for fitness and health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview by Dr Mosley himself, very informative if you're just starting. (I highly recommend this for an overview)

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Something to consider if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful.

A HUGE THANK YOU to Greeneggsandnicht for putting together all this info and resources into one concise OP text, much appreciated by so many 5:2ers!

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
postmanpatscat · 15/11/2013 12:28

Well done cupid and notastired on your losses!

Glad to hear toffee's DD is on the mend but get well wishes for the Florricks

When I was losing rather than maintaining I weighed every day and recorded it in my diary. When I reached a new low, I recorded it on MFP but of course I didn't put in every gain of a few hundred grams here or there. I now weigh once or twice a week. The scales used to be in the guest bathroom to deter me from weighing myself too often, but that is how I ended up almost 2st heavier than I am now! Knowledge is power!

On my third Brew of the day and so far my FD food intake has consisted of a two finger KitKat Blush. There are always goodies in the staffroom on Fridays! I did avoid the cakes for someone's birthday though. I'll be in the gym later so a definite deficit today.

toffeesponge · 15/11/2013 12:34

Hope you are all better very soon MrsF. Make sure you have a sensible talk with your H about his attitude, after you have had a few hours off and some cake of course.

So, with me being as I am what do you think would be best for me? I have lost 2 stone since July 2012 but need to lose another stone at least.

eatriskier · 15/11/2013 13:01

Oh my, Fridays are hard in the riskier household. Ds is trying to drop to one nap which is fine as long as that's a long one, but he's going for 30m refusing to go back then getting so overtired. Dd has completely regressed Potty training wise. Sat her down and explained she can have one pair of knickers this morning but she ended up weeing without much realisation so I put her in a pull up, she popped to the Potty a few times but mainly used the nappy. Ds went to bed at 11. Dd at 12. Dd woke ds by kicking on his wall. Managed to get him back off and she did it again 15m later. Ds will not go back down so I know I have him being a tired mess again later. Then my instinct to nappy Dd turned out correct. She had a diarrhoea attack. Am exhausted!

toffeesponge · 15/11/2013 13:07

Oh no, eat Sad. Hope things improve very quickly.

Can you move DD's bed away from that wall so she can't kick it? IME children repeat things that get a reaction.

MrsFlorrick · 15/11/2013 13:21

Eatriskier. Argh for you!! It's an utter pain during that stage! They don't want to nap so you're back and forth trying to get the to go down. And they don't so you don't get a break. And they spend the afternoon wailing because They are tried. Ugh. I feel your pain!

DD stopped napping 3 weeks before DS was born and DS stopped napping at 20 months. I spent weeks trying to force him to nap without joy.

Toffee. When you say what is best for you? Do you mean daily, weekly or monthly weighing?? Given you're half way to goal, I would weigh frequently. To help avoid gains iyswim. But that's just me.

Last summer I got within circa a stone of my goal weight and stopped weighing. Ate biscuits and by Xmas I had gained 2 stone back BlushSad I also stopped Dukan and frenzied on biscuits because I was having other problems and trying to drown them in biscuits. Sad

Not making that mistake this time!!
At least 5:2 is sustainable and flexible to see me through weeks like this when H is away and the DC are sick. No issues about meat only days, coming out if ketosis etc etc etc.

Eatriskier. I am a bit like you with SI issues. It's no fun. It's so painful and debilitating.

I'm glad I have managed to get mine to the point where the pain is minimal/infrequent and I can work out. That said I am feeling it today but I'm not well, short of sleep and its been a few days without a workout.

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 15/11/2013 13:26

continuing soundtrack to our lives theme......

(...puts on Another Level - I'm gonna get freaky with you.)

Sits down with bowl of Deviant Porridge.

Afternoon Gang!!

Thank you so much for all of your lovely words and advice. It nearly made me cry. Still a bit numb about whole thing, though I have periods of heartbreak and periods of sheer anger when I feel that he has wasted my time! I made excuses for him for so long. Just turns out he isn't the person I thought he was.

Anyway! I will leave it there for now, for fear of clogging up thread with my woes. I'm sure it won't be last you hear Grin

Back to sources of pleasure... OH . MY . GAAAAAAAAAD!!!
I feel like I have been hugged from the inside out. P.butter and nutella yum yum!

Was supposed to be a fd as my 3rd of 4:3 this week. But on 4 hrs sleep and stomach playing up, I needed something. Off to docs on tues about whole ulcer/hives/menopause/hormone thing! Am compiling list so I don't forget anything! But will try to keep it sensible today. My first mini fast.
Scales this morning show am maintaining this week. But at least it is confirming last weeks drop as real, so I'll take it!

Betsy Thanks Sorry about the whole roast dinner list Grin Did giggle at chomp the screen comment. Can't stop thinking about a massive roast now. Am actually salivating and I have just eaten Deviant Porridge too! I will join you in Mon-Thurs no junk from here until Xmas. Will try to come up with suitable motivational Hmm name!

Talkinpeace · 15/11/2013 13:36

annielewis
I'll tell you how the Californian girls stay slim : the meals you see them eating out are the only ones they have : their fridges will be empty. At home they live on coffee - ie an almost permanent 16:8 and its common for them to have carb free lunches

all I can suggest from my NCC blast is to leave the carbs bit of a meal (pasta, potatoes, bread) and enjoy the veg and the protein
BUT
a couple of weeks of really strict 5:2 when you get home (or after Christmas) and you'll be tickety boo

bigchoc
I saw your post about the science side .... best resource is the Science forum on the fastdiet site ... lots and lots there
but basically nutters like B&W and Boshh myself do 24 hours with as few calories as possible, and then no carb, protein type stuff then another 12 hours with nowt

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 15/11/2013 13:45

Toffee, Mrs F, EatRisky - Thanks Thanks Thanks You all sound run ragged! Ref naps - would lying down with them make any difference, so you can get benefit of a rest too?? My dd was never a napper (cue violin again). Would fall asleep on boob but would wake the second tried to lay her down. Found the only way I could ever get her to nap was if we snuggled on sofa together under a blanket, usually after watching Curious George! Grin (awww! miss curious George!). It meant I wasn't hands free, but got a much needed rest out of it. On plus side she slept through fairly early on and was never usually awake before 9!!! Have to crowbar her out of bed on school days now, yet she has amazing ability to wake up crack of dawn on weekends!! Sympathy with you all - it sounds grotty with all the toilet issues too! Permission to binge has been granted!

Congrats to all on losses! Some very positive and inspired sounding fasters out there.

Avoiding suspicious wee fingers cake/biscuits at work.....could you have to dash off to do something, or head to loo when they arrive? Failing that develop an 'allergy' to some mythical preservative in particular items.

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 15/11/2013 14:41

Big Choc Thanks Cake [nut butter] [rice pud] [BJ] [a Lindt factory]

I know I will be fine. Because you told me I will!!! (pictures Big Choc at gym, surrounded by crying, 6'5", bottom stretching men begging for mercy)

I need your help BC.... (presses repeat on eye of tiger )

I have decided to devise an exercise plan based on current lifestyle. If I can find a few different things that I may be able to spontaneously incorporate into day, I have much more chance of getting any done!

Am going to do....

Running - as and when can be arsed
Squat Challenge - for saggy bum
Hula Hooping - improve core and tone waist/hips

....and what I need from you is some help with what to do for toning/lifting chest area. Arms can be involved if need be, but it's chest/boobs I want to concentrate on because with losing weight I don't want to leave them behind! On my knees Wink

Am CRAP at push ups. Had thought about that one where arms are behind at right angles on chair and lower self to ground??... The main thing is that they are easy to do in various locations, with minimum equipment.

I leave the future of my sagging in your capable hands Oh Big Chocolat One!

As reward I will help by kicking your ass through this SWATH swath the feck! thing and send you on an all inclusive break to the real Hotel Chocolat in Jan!! (not really to that bit) X

toffeesponge · 15/11/2013 14:46

Yes, MrsF I did mean in relation to weighing myself. I just get fed up when the scales are going the wrong way but huge progress I don't then eat everything in sight to cheer myself up! I am so pleased and amazed how I no longer feel scared of food or expect it to make everything alright, that a low weight loss doesn't worry me too much as I remind myself what I have lost already do I know I can do it. I just have to stop feeling a failure if I put a couple of pounds on in a week.

Off to get DS2 from school now and will see DD in about 2-3 hours!!

Cuckoo - you are doing great. I have been through some crap too and it is amazing when a friend tells you she doesn't know who you've done it when you just did.

eatriskier · 15/11/2013 14:51

toffee that's one of the weekend plans. She seems beyond the stage of needing the bed bumper so if we can arrange the furniture we may put her bed in the middle of the room. Odd set up though, there's extra furniture in her room as ds's room is a box so some of his stuff has to be stored in hers.

mrsf si joint pain totally sucks Thanks for you today. I'm pretty relaxed on napping which may have rubbed off on them. If they weren't such messes I would let them not bother!

cuckoo I've tried that one. Mummy is a trampoline. Which was fair enough at 15stone but really sore now I'm nearer 9.5!

Talkinpeace · 15/11/2013 15:07

www.tescodiets.com/px/NewsAndTools/fitness/get-sexy-arms-without-going-to-the-gym
bean tin fitness ....

CuckooAtchooUhOh · 15/11/2013 15:32

EatRisky - I do hope that has been noted as a NSV Grin

Toffee - I remember when you first joined thread as a more fruity individual (I was lurking then). You have come on amazing amounts, and now when I hear your 5:2 related grumbles, I smile at just how positively different they are compared to how they used to be. You know this works now, and you know you can do it. Things will fluctuate sometimes, but that is just life. Don't let it get to you. As long as you stick to mantra 'I AM NOT A BIN', all is good Thanks

(p.s thanks and what?? think your excitement at dd coming home affected sentence Grin )

MrsFlorrick · 15/11/2013 15:34

Toffee. I find stepping on the scales now prevents over indulgence and weight gain.

Part of that is reminding myself what happened last year and that I am close to goal even if I have stalled a bit.

You could try on lots of old clothes regularly and suddenly more and more will find. I did that and I have found it so motivating.

Eatriskier. I've had a good stretching session and did some Pilates so pain has gone again. It wasn't relaxing as the DC were whining and fighting around me. Hmm But you've got plenty of that going on too.

Cuckoo. Thanks Grin. H is on his way home. He is boarding his flight in a couple of hours. (Notice how he is "H" rather than "DH"! Angry).

Betsy. I know what you're saying about a certain place in the corporate structure and you have to take ownership. I do appreciate all that. He gets plenty of leeway from me to do whatever he wants. I just want something back from him during his free time from work. Problem is he sees that as his free time which means my time never comes Angry

Grin At the thought of bigchocfrenzy and all those men begging for mercy Grin. I am in awe of you and your monster work outs.

somewherebecomingrain · 15/11/2013 15:57

Lost my bloody post earlier.

Fasting today and finding it tough but nearly at food time which is gonna be salmon and veg.

Nearly through it and oooof just so excited about tomorrow. Think I'm not in tune with it totally tbh.

I seem to be up and down with it tbh some great FDs and others such a struggle.

cuckoo meant to say you are v funny and I love your posts.

bigchoc you are also a big character!

I will try to take tips advice / pint if water before bed. Otherwise I fear FRENZY tomorrow.

somewherebecomingrain · 15/11/2013 15:58

mrsF sounds like you are an amazing woman - you need more challenges. It will come.

BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:04

Not me I'm afraid MrsF - I've got no clue about corporate structure! I was the one suggesting running away Wink How are old are your DCs? It seems to me that the menfolk become more helpful as they kids get easier older. I think physically abandoning him with the DCs is the only way you can do it (just for a couple of hours here and there) - he clearly has no respect for your free time, of which I suspect you've had none in the last x months/years.

OP posts:
BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:07

cuckoo a pithy name for no naughties on 4 weekdays till xmas - it's not easy is it? Confused I'm quite into it now though, especially as I just gave myself permission to eat a Tunnocks wafer bar. I should join you in squats and attempts at press ups too. I did the 30 day squat challenge for a while in the summer - I used to do while getting dry after my morning shower - sure it would have been ridiculously amusing for anyone watching! (I hope there wasn't).

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MrsFlorrick · 15/11/2013 16:11

Betsy Grin sorry I'm so fecking sleep deprived I am clearly delirious.

Running away sounds good. Am trying to entertain DC with painting. Oh lord the mess!! The love painting and crafty stuff Mr Maker style. Right now sparkly paint and glitters are involved. Wish me luck Grin

I have finally managed to have a shower. And I am currently wearing skirt which hasn't fitted in 5 years. And a new cashmere jumper I bought in uniqlo. It's a size Small Grin. And it's not completely tight and slightly loose on the arms. Perked up my day somewhat.

Sometimes the NSV mean so much more dont they.

BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:12

Working my way up the thread Grin

Notas for naan bread I did a basic dough (let breadmaker do that bit but simple by hand too) then kneaded in some oil, nigella seeds, garlic, salt and fresh coriander, shaped the breads and allowed to prove again on the trays I was going to bake them in for about 20 mins in a warm place (top oven while main oven on), then baked at high heat for 15 mins I think. They were lovely. Not strictly authentic but tasted fab!

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BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:15

Hurrah for fabulous NSV MrsF - they are definitely more important than abstract numbers on a scale reading! I love the combo of new cashmere and Mr Maker craft activities Shock Grin

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BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:16

Brilliant news Toffee What a relief for you, hope you get a restful weekend.

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MrsFlorrick · 15/11/2013 16:42

Yes Betsy. I like to live on the edge!!
Tbh in didn't think this one through.

The naan sounds lovely. Next curry will be making some.

Betsy. The DC are 4 and 2. So v small.

Back to the unholy glittery sticky goo on my table.

BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:55

I know this is no help to you at all right now, but it does get easier, mostly because they go to school Grin I found it virtually impossible to step back and think about what I wanted until they'd both gone to school (I have same age gap). When they were tiny tots I was freelancing from home, trying to get detailed work done in my 'free' time (ie when they were napping, down for night (ha ha). I don't know how I did it really, but muddled through somehow in a exhausted zombified state.

I changed my career completely once I regained some time to myself, and that's when I started paying attention to the weight damage I'd done to myself and took control. I became a new woman! Hooray for school!

OP posts:
BetsyBell · 15/11/2013 16:56

(That was aimed at MrsF)

OP posts:
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