When DC just aren't talented at....anything

[Pullinghair]

Hear me out before you all flame me alive. I love my kids and try to instill every good thing in them and give them all the opportunities I never had as a kid but still i sit here regularly wondering where I've gone wrong or not done things right.

1st dd 12. Amazing, kind caring. But always been not confident and had really strong personality friends who have dominated over her until this yr where she now has none at all. I've tried loads. When younger age she did swimming age 3-5 ( stopped when she still couldn't do a basic width or keep afloat after 2 yrs of expensive lessons) Gymnastics ( once a week since aged 4 but never selected for comps or anything extra, seems to go largely unnoticed in classes) , extra language. Violin ( aged 7- 11) stopped at grade 1 last yr because she just wasn't progressing enough after years of playing to get to grade 2 the next year. She does netball now but still just seems to be on the periphery of stuff. All things she likes, I ask her every term if she'd like to change or try something different it's always a no she's happy. But I'm soo sad but try not to show it. Friends/ family kids have got medals, seems to be in competition teams, trophies for all sorts or progressing and enjoying their hobbies in general. Mine literally couldn't give a crap and doesn't want to explore other options to develop an interest in something. What am I doing wrong!? Why after years of paying out for hobbies left right and center has it not made 1 dot of difference to her confidence and if anything made it worse because she never has anything to show for the effort she puts in.

Dd2 loves her hobbies similar to dd1 but she too never has got medals, certificates of progression or anything to recognise they've been doing something for x amount of years and got nothing to show for it. to make it worse is generally forgotten about and recently despite me asking her teacher for something she can take part in was sidelined and not even considered in favour of another friend.

Is this just how it is? What am I doing wrong

These are great suggestions re making friends at group and how to word it so thank you.

Dyspraxia- since she was in nursery for dd1 I have every single year asked her teachers if they feel like she could be dyspraxic or add or something similar, each time every teacher looks at me like I'm mad and points to her academic solid work to tell me I'm wrong. But I don't know how to go about proving otherwise and to who. She has only started struggling abit academically this yr in yr7 but I have been hesitant to label it as anything other than her trying to get to grips with new teaching methods etc.

She can ride a bike and catch a ball. Handwriting is good

How old is dd2? I’d move her to another swimming school if needed!

Did dd1 do much practise with the violin? Lessons aren’t enough to pass the grades.

Maybe she’ll find a sport at secondary school or needs to find more time for whatever it is she chooses. I did piano from age 8-15 and got to grade 5. I didn’t always enjoy it but I was determined to pass the exams. My sister on the other hand would take up an instrument and stop it after a term. I always felt like I couldn’t give stuff up once I’d started. Maybe it’s a personality thing!

Is she pretty good at entertaining herself?

My son is 11. Much the same. He remains in beginners marital arts. I taught him to swim myself. Tried a few lessons to improve his technique as it can be interesting at times. It did not go well!

But he's bloody brilliant at playing. Not necessarily in the way any of it was intended though, he does things his own way. Tonight he wrote a story (minus any punctuation but never mind) on his Chromebook and made pictures to go with it so he could read it to his little sister.

He isn't really bored. And so he'll go along to activities but he's not particularly fussed. He's not a child that needs to do things. In lockdown he didn't miss school in the way other kids did.

I just wondered if being self contained is her skill? And if so, that's maybe more valuable in the long run than getting to grade three violin.

This is what I am trying to persuade myself anyway because my children are very much like yours.

They sound like activities where children have to be quite focused and might not get that much chance to make friends.

But she will have learned focus and persistence. That's great.

Are there any activities she could do that would be more based on teamwork? Volunteering - something where she'll be communicating with a purpose? Possibly a mixed age group thing where you are going along too?

Your post suggests she might make more friends if she was talented, but you don't need talent for all group activities - maybe separate the two issues in your mind?

You could also try her with something you learn more at your own speed be it coding or knitting.

Are there any more low key clubs at school she could try (although if she feels a bit lost and is easily dominated I'd keep her away from all things rainbow until she understands herself a bit better, but I know not everyone will agree).

Most of us aren't amazing at sports or musical instruments. I don't know anyone who is, except my brother, who runs ultra marathons, and he only took up running in his 30s. Hobbies are for fulfillment and exercise, so if she enjoys them that is enough.

What strikes me is that you may have gone in too early with some. If she wasn't ready to swim at 3 you might have been better to wait until she was old enough to see real progress rather than slogging through years of expensive lessons. And likewise with violin, it is hard to progress at first, which is not rewarding for a child who isn't very keen (and no child honestly begs to learn violin - it is very much a parental goal).

Btw I don't think hobbies necessarily lead to friendships, unless they are spending lots of time training etc. School is key to friendships at 12, so I would be looking at ways to foster friendships there.

My DD is not dissimilar but I really don’t see it as a problem. She enjoys different things, has a go, is stronger at some others but is not too fussed about getting certificates etc. It’s just the joy of doing things, it doesn’t have to be all about achievement. She’s taught herself to crochet and makes stuffed animals at the moment. You need to let your DC them find themselves.

I was a late learner when it came to swimming. 3-5 is IMO too young for that kind of muscle coordination. I learned at around nine or ten.

Restart her with swimming lessons. A good teacher will teach dogpaddle with kicking first to get the child moving confidently through the water, and only then move onto proper strokes. Dogpaddle is the intuitive way that every mammal will try to swim with when thrown into water and it's a vital self-rescue stroke for when your daughter messes up her backstroke in the deep end and panics.

I think I read that she goes to Guides - have you tried supporting her with some interest badges? They're great for creating a sense of achievement, fun activities, she can work towards theme and section awards etc.

DD goes to a Young Wardens group at the local Nature reserve it's for 11-16 and is great for learning new skills.

Friendships still won't necessarily form as it's once a month but the do chat whilst they work and it's not a sport so no skill required.

Violin ( aged 7- 11) stopped at grade 1 last yr because she just wasn't progressing enough after years of playing to get to grade 2 the next year.

Did she choose violin or did you choose that for her? I chose brass for myself and, despite stopping grades at grade four. I'm still playing in my forties.

For the vast majority of people hobbies are for fun and friends, and not for being too of the class.

they sound happy - that is a remarkable achievement in itself.

OP, I don't think anyone would think to throw a flame at you for feeling this way. You sound like an amazing parent who has tried so hard to give them lots of opportunities. It isn't cheap either and please don't be hard on yourself. As parents all we can do is try and open up the world to them and give them these opportunities. Whether they embrace them or not is out of our hands. I agree with a PP who said it's hard to maintain clubs beyond primary age. Both my 2 DS during primary did swimming, Rugby, football, cubs. I remember the days when every evening was taking them to one club or another. They won a few medals for football and at one stage I thought I had a Ronaldo in the making (yes I was one of those mums ) as one won a lot of medals during 2 years. But in the space of a few months both at around the same age wanted to cut all clubs except football and even that now, I see the enthusiasm lessening. Some of the friendships made have gone or disappeared and that stage of them being chosen for lots of things has dwindled down too. The point is it doesn't matter if they excelled at something or not. Whatever they do, it is a part of their learning experience and they don't need certificates or medals to define that. They will have taken things from all those clubs they tried and at least you have taught them that things are accessible to them if they want it.

If she enjoys it then leave her be. Medals and winning aren’t the be all and end all.

She’d be unlikely to swim a length at 5. They’re just not coordinated enough at that age. I used to let my kids do whatever they wanted - karate, ballet, choir, football, gymnastics, brownies, scouts, violin, flute, swimming…you name it, they did it. Most of it drops off but if you’re lucky some of it sticks.

This story from Kurt Vonnegut sums hobbies up beautifully:

https://meetgroove.com/reward-of-learning/

Hobbies are a chance to learn something new, make friends, have experiences outside of school or the home. They give kids confidence and a broader perspective. It doesn’t need to be through winning medals or being competitive - it can come from scouts, a book club, dancing, singing - anything really that they enjoy.

I had absolutely no hobbies and my children had fleeting interests,tennis,she was actually really good but got bored,more interested in socialising ,now in a job that I cannot identify because it’s a sensitive job and I have to be very careful what I say 2nd child went to rugby but hated it but now in a job that is his passion ,3rd son embraced any challenge,played rugby in first team at Uni ,embraced his Uni course,got a first and now in a brilliant job he enjoys and earning silly money .
it does all work out eventually.

Most people have average kids 🤷‍♀️

Please be careful with how your kids learn to value themselves and the importance you put on doing hobbies and being good at them.

I was very good at some things as a kid and very bad at others. I felt a huge amount of pressure from others, both my parents (who didn't go to uni and wanted me to have a better education) and from people who bullied me because I was shit at 'important stuff' like PE (I was very crap at sports as a kid). For the things I was good at it was very much "look at Stripey, she is the one who is good at X!" Or "don't be friends with Stripey, she's the one who's shit at Y!". I therefore learnt that my worth was about what I could or could not do, and not who I was as a person. There was none of this 'you don't have to be good at your hobbies as long as you enjoy them'. I was doing them to please others to to show my worth to them or myself. Also, as my parents were struggling with money but their best for me, I had to be very grateful/openly told how much they had sacrificed for all of these hobbies/things they were doing to make my life better.

This is not said to blow my own trumpet, but I was and still am an excellent artist, can run a 5k faster than most of the country and am quite good at an extreme sport. I've bike-packed in many cool places around the world, went straight out of university to run a dream conservation project in Africa, and now have a successful self-employed business. I'm mostly quite fit and a size 8-10. I will have paid off my mortgage aged 40 by myself. Most people would say I was winning at life.

But none of this is or was EVER good enough to me. I feel like a failure most of the time. I have cripplingly bad self esteem. No project I finish is worth celebrating, I just see the mistakes. If it's not perfect, I'm shit. I hate myself. I am depressed. I feel out of control. I can never be genuinely happy for me, my achievements. People tell me I should be happy but I just cannot feel it.

I genuinely believe through counselling that this is because I grew up valuing myself by my achievements, measured through people's outward opinions (good and bad). I wish I had just done stuff I enjoyed and not known if I was good or bad at it.

I think people mean well when they push their children or get them to do things that they're good at, or don't allow them to do things they're bad at. But for some some kids (like me) it can be extremely damaging and have a significant effect on how they value themselves, and can rob them of happiness in ways they should be feeling positive. Obviously this is only my experience and your children may be completely different (and you clearly care about them a great deal) but perhaps just be mindful that you aren't unintentionally teaching them that they have to be good at stuff to be liked.

Have you asked them what they’d like to try? It’s ok to try different things and then not like them. It’s also ok to know how to do many things ok instead of be Olympic material in one thing.

To improve confidence, your DD needs to feel she is ok the way she is. She doesn’t need to have a talent. She doesn’t need to be competition level swimmer or gymnast. Hobbies are for enjoyment, not status. Have you perhaps given her the impression you are disappointed and on a quest to find her talent? Have you ever said everyone has a talent?

I was also really shy at 12, hopeless at sports (still am), not remotely musical and rubbish at swimming. My interests/abilities were in art, writing and the outdoors. Maybe your daughters simply aren't sporty or well suited to a competitive environment. Performance based activities (like drama, sports, dance/gym) tend to favour more extroverted/dominant personalities anyway, so your eldest might be struggling socially because she's not among likeminded people.

It's fine to not have found their 'thing' yet - they are both so young - and as others have mentioned they might not be ready yet for some of the hobbies.

What about something less intense, that focuses on building friendships rather than individual performance?

If they're having fun then that is more than enough. If they're not having fun, save yourself some time and money and call it a day! I don't really think kids need extracurriculars just for the sake of it. Attending school all day everyday and going on the odd day out with family and spending time in nature and with friends is plenty to give children a happy and well-rounded childhood. Think of all the most successful (in terms of career, lifestyle etc) adults you know. Did it make a difference what hobby they did as a child? Do you even know what hobby they did as a child?

Confidence is about feeling comfortable in your own skin not winning. It’s something I’m mindful of as one of my children is very successful at their hobby and excelling at school so I have to balance out the championing them while still letting my other completely average at this stuff children that hobbies are for fun and I love them the way they are.

Do one on one with the swimming. None of my children could swim a length at 5 and they are all decent swimmers now.

It’s a worry that she can’t make friends. Could she join a non competitive environment? Gymnastics and the like isn’t great for friends. How about scouts or a club type thing where they are not competing and just socialising. I’d try and drill down about why she can’t make friends. What is causing her this issue? If you could help her here it would definitely be a win.

It is tricky but I wonder if you're under-estimating the amount of effort that comes with 'talent' - one of my children is excellent on the violin but its taken us 4 teachers to find a great teacher and a heck of a lot of support from me when she was younger but now she's motivated to practice without my involvement, my other daughter does well at team sports and has competed nationally but... she was motivated enough to practice 3 times a day, I've never pushed her, in fact its me that's reluctant to take her and watch her play a match / train in the dark freezing weather, she assures me its never too cold to play sport 😂

Encouraging kids to have a good work ethic is important.

Re swimming - how often did you take your daughter to practice or just have fun in the pool between lessons? you can't leave it all up to the teachers.

The ones with medals are probably the ones with tiger parents making their children practice endlessly to the detriment of the child's mental health, physical health duento injuries and normal childhood.
The kind of thing where they make young children swim in chlorine, or 4 year olds practice gymnastics at home, or 4 or 5 year olds do football lessons with footballs thrown into their heads doing nothing for these (typically) boys' already likely impaired intelligence (judging by the genetics of the parents especially).
The kids will grow hating sport and probably hating the parents, with no independent or critical thinking and few problem solving skills.
Rereading your post - you may have pushed them into it too young, they are burnt out.
Don't put them into anything any more unless they actually ask.
And of course it will take years to learn to swim if you start at 3. It's sad to see 7 and 8 year olds hating swimming because they'd been forced to do since age 3 . And that's pretty much all of those.

Jeez how awful these ''clubs'' sound.

Just let the children be.. DS had no clubs, but had hobbies {definitely not clubs} he was {IS} passionate about, stick to those.
I don't get the clubs obsession.