Brexit mega thread part 15a - looking forwards

[Talkinpeace]

Just rebooting the most recent thread

At the moment the UKs issues are rather over shadowed by events elsewhere
but maybe that is a good thing.

The German election on Sunday is worth watching
Right wing European politicians pulling out of CPAC speeches because they realise its not a good look
Farage floundering to stay relevant

and the possibility of the return of free movement for our kids if not us

Relations between mainland Europe and the UK remain a worthy topic for discussion

I think by self sufficient in food I was thinking more of the general population because I don't think the average person would have had much wine - and would have a diet much like the example of the person in the Hebrides with her Cabbage, potatoes, kale, carrots, lamb, turnips. And of course, until the voyages of discovery, there were no potatoes.

Just think, no potatoes, no tomatoes, no tea, no coffee, no oranges, no bananas, no rice. The quality of bread would have differed. I forget when Canadian wheat started to be imported which I think did revolutionise people's diets but I don't think that was until the end of the 19th Century.

@Peregrina
Food history is a wonderful topic.
I'm off to Chalke Valley later this week and they have a team who serve up normal suppers from different centuries.

Spices were in normal cooking by the 13th Century - because many people visited monasteries and religious events where such things were used
and realised that a bit of pepper makes a dull soup taste a LOT nicer.

Tea came the overland route from China before the Crusades.
Crusader servants came home with ingredient ideas.

My Hebridean friend IS unusual. Her Glasgow friends at High School teased her about it.

Communion Wine was all imported and tasted by many on a Sunday ....

That's very interesting Talkinpeace.
For the Europhobes on this thread we only need to go back to the last War, when the Atlantic convoys were vital for keeping us all fed. (But that would have been OK, because it wasn't coming from Europe.)

Also pertinent to the last War, rations were very carefully worked out - by someone called Widdowson and another person. So although food was dull by today's standards it was enough to keep people healthy.

Aren't we just something like 3 days away from not having enough food to feed the population?

The rationings last longer in the UK than the rest of Europe iirc

I think it lasted until 1954. Hence both my DH and I had 'wartime' ID cards even though we were both born post war. Mine has got lost over the years. DH kept his. Rationing was worse after the War - bread hadn't been rationed during the War but was afterwards.

Billionaire Michael Bloomberg has told an audience in Dublin that Brexit was the single stupidest thing any country has ever done, adding that "it's hard to believe how they did it."

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2025/0623/1519905-brexit-the-stupidest-thing-any-country-has-ever-done/

Yay! A Brexit benefit! We can charge passengers more for hand luggage. Go us!

https://www.euronews.com/travel/2025/06/25/eu-to-ban-airlines-from-charging-extra-for-hand-luggage-what-does-this-mean-for-passengers

All that will mean is that, as the article says, airfares will increase. Now, on the face of it, I'm in favour of that, flying being hideously environmentally damaging. However, this will advantage those flying regularly, for work say (so rich people) and disadvantage those flying on holiday as you can bet that the "hold luggage" charges will go up to compensate for the 'no charge carry-on'.

What airlines should do, of course, is calculate the allowances and the air fares based on the combined weight of a) the passenger + b) anything they wish to take on the plane, be it carry-on or in the hold. Weight is weight and if you and your luggage weigh more you should pay more (a lot more!)

Sorry, didn't see that in Farage's manifesto...

https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-brexit-european-union-joining-customs-pact/

The U.K. government will consult businesses on whether Britain should join a European customs agreement to simplify rules around international supply chains.

The Pan-Euro-Mediterranean customs convention (PEM) relaxes rules of origin — useful for firms with international production chains that cross borders.

The government's Trade Strategy published on Thursday morning says that joining PEM would “increase flexibility for UK exporters where they source their inputs.”

...

If you believe polls, Labour has dropped to third place. Reform are first and conservatives second.

@LouiseCollins28

You are dealing with the:

“we know better” nucleus of posters who have attempted to police MN since 23 June 2016. They rely on quotes from celebrities and high profile figures to “prove” that the entire country has changed their minds regards Brexit.

The opportunity to revoke Article 50 was presented before the 2019 general election. Had the same number of people who voted remain in 2016 voted for the Liberal Democrats in 2019, this thread would not exist.

So, rather than blame those who voted leave on 23 June 2016, they should be asking the 16.1 million who voted remain why they didn’t take the chance to revoke in 2019.

The Talkin Police Man remarked that the population has changed by 9 million since the referendum held on June 2016, but did not explain the significance?

Since the referendum, there have been three general elections. Both Conservatives and Labour received fewer votes in 2024 compared to 2017. The Liberal Democrat’s fared better and increased their votes from 2.3 million to 3.5 million. However, Reform (previously UKIP and Brexit party) increased their votes from 600K in 2017 to 4 million in 2024, an increase of 3.4 million.

So, of the 9 million change in population, more have moved to Reform compared to the other parties.

"If you believe polls"

The only poll I believe is the one that involves a ballot box.
All others are sampling noise.
HTH

The only poll I believe is the one that involves a ballot box.

Me too. However, many posters on this thread and other threads think that quotes from a handful of celebrities and high profile politicians take priority over ballot box results.

Since 498 MPs voted to leave the EU on 29 March 2017 there have been three general elections. All three have been won by parties who support Brexit. Rejoin parties came nowhere near in all three ballot boxes.

Not topic related, but three cheers for Rachel Reeves. Her performance in the HoC made the Euro stronger against the Pound at the right moment for me as I am paid in Euro.

😂

Oh dear. Complete lack of self awareness from our friends at Deform Ltd...

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/reform-uk-leader-moans-eurostar-35545913

And it seems like Fartage wants to increase migration into the UK. And he wants us to pay for it...

https://eastangliabylines.co.uk/politics/farages-dodgy-plan-to-boost-migration-into-the-uk/

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/jul/13/most-people-in-france-germany-italy-and-spain-would-support-uk-rejoining-eu-poll-finds

@DuncinToffee

You forgot to mention that the EU only wants UK to rejoin on less favourable terms.

And whose fault is that...

Well, duh. The UK threw away its favourable terms. Why shouldn't it be treated like any other accession country?

Ashford International Station is indeed rather pathetic without being able to get on the train to France.
And it is mad that people to the South and East of London have to go
past Ashford,
past Ebbsfleet,
past the Waterloo platforms
up to North London
to go south east

I posted the link, it's up to people to read the full article

I know brexiteers promised the UK could have it's cake and eat it. They lied.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-rejoin-eu-brexit-poll-b2788570.html

@DuncinToffee

You also forget that the EU members listed in the article, Germany, France, Spain and Italy who want UK to rejoin each have more immigrants than the UK.

So, why do they want the UK to rejoin? What’s the benefit to those members? Could it be they want to unload more immigrants into the UK?

I remember that both France and Spain attempted to scrap the 90/180 Schengen guideline for UK persons as their tourist industry had taken a hit.

But what’s the benefit for Germany and Italy?

That's a plausible argument - if you're so paranoid that you believe everything through EU does is intended to harm the UK.

In real life, we don't matter to them except as something to mock.