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Brexit

Brexit mega thread part 15a - looking forwards

1000 replies

Talkinpeace · 22/02/2025 18:58

Just rebooting the most recent thread

At the moment the UKs issues are rather over shadowed by events elsewhere
but maybe that is a good thing.

The German election on Sunday is worth watching
Right wing European politicians pulling out of CPAC speeches because they realise its not a good look
Farage floundering to stay relevant

and the possibility of the return of free movement for our kids if not us

Relations between mainland Europe and the UK remain a worthy topic for discussion

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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LouiseCollins28 · 03/06/2025 20:24

I didn't say the USA was better than Europe! I don't think it is, by and large.

I don't have any major issue with Europe really, European co-operation between nations is IMO absolutely fine, so long as it is that, co-operation between countries, a community, not a union.

I did not want to be a citizen of a European superstate and I was made one in 1993, without being able to exercise any choice in the matter.

My "main reason" for disliking the EU (hating is a word I'd choose not to use) is that it was set up by the back door and the UK people who were subject to its rules from 1993-2020 were never given a direct say about whether they wished participate.

MaybeNotBob · 04/06/2025 07:56

Letter in the Times of all places...

Brexit mega thread part 15a - looking forwards
MaybeNotBob · 04/06/2025 18:54

Global will be happy!

LouiseCollins28 · 04/06/2025 19:08

Notable from the EU Commission statement is any reference to the Bulgarian people wanting this change. From the little I've read on the matter this afternoon it looks like they probably do, but it's interesting that this is presented purely as Bulgarian compliance with EU "convergence" rules with no reference to popular sentiment.

DuncinToffee · 04/06/2025 19:51

The have had 6 elections since the start of 2021. Adopting the Euro probably wasn't an issue

21st country to join the Eurozone

DuncinToffee · 05/06/2025 16:52

https://bsky.app/profile/mikegalsworthy.bsky.social/post/3lqum2lkdik26
⭐️ 50 YEARS AGO TODAY ⭐️

17.4 million people voted “Yes” to Europe…

…the single largest vote for any single proposition in the UK’s history.

This 17.4M was from a pop at the time of just 56M - and represented a massive 67% of all votes cast.

Let’s do it again. #RejoinEU

Mike Galsworthy (@mikegalsworthy.bsky.social)

⭐️ 50 YEARS AGO TODAY ⭐️ 17.4 million people voted “Yes” to Europe… …the single largest vote for any single proposition in the UK’s history. This 17.4M was from a pop at the time of just 56M - and represented a massive 67% of all votes cast. Let’...

https://bsky.app/profile/mikegalsworthy.bsky.social/post/3lqum2lkdik26

GlobeTrotter2000 · 06/06/2025 09:47

@MaybeNotBob

The Bulgarian Lev was pegged to the Euro at a rate of €1 = 1.96 Lev. So, locals will not be any better off.

Poverty in Bulgaria is approximately 32% and increasing even though tax was reduced from 30% to 10%. So, being in the EU has not helped locals, but those in government have become well off

However, I will save on exchange rate costs as I am paid in Euro.

Starmer’s U turn on WFA tells me he’s afraid of Reform. The pensioners I know have stated they will be voting for Reform at the next general election regardless of Starmer’s attempt to win them back. Pensioners represent about 25% of registered voters.

@DuncinToffee

You seem to forget that the vote cast in 1975 to remain in the EU was after the UK had already joined in 1973. My parents voted to remain on the basis of:

“If we are already in the EU, why go through the trouble and cost of leaving so soon after joining”

Also remember that in 1975, the EU had not accepted any Eastern European countries.

Forty one years later in 2016 the European Union was very different to that in 1975. In 2006/2007 thirteen Eastern European countries were allowed to join the Union. Not because they had skills Western European countries lacked, but because were cheaper labour.

There may have been a short term gain, but in the long term the once well off Western European countries have become poorer overall. However, the elites who profited from the cheap labour are not affected and don’t care about the average person in the street.

GlobeTrotter2000 · 08/06/2025 10:04

At BobbyNoMate

I don’t remember either of the following:

Russia invading the UK.
Russia firing missiles into the UK.

Russia likes the UK as they buy Russian gas even though the UK has their own gas.

DuncinToffee · 08/06/2025 10:14

You don't remember Salisbury?

DuncinToffee · 08/06/2025 10:43

Oh and the UK does not buy Russian gas anymore, do keep up

Talkinpeace · 08/06/2025 19:03

DuncinToffee · 08/06/2025 10:14

You don't remember Salisbury?

The bench they sat on has never been replaced.
I've fed the swans from where they did.

Never climbed the Cathedral spire though !

OP posts:
GlobeTrotter2000 · 09/06/2025 17:20

@DuncinToffee

Oh and the UK does not buy Russian gas anymore, do keep up.

Actually they did, indirectly. UK has bought refined oil from; China, India and Turkey from crude they bought from Russia.

Source: Guardian April 2024

MaybeNotBob · 09/06/2025 19:46

Ah, someone needs to explain to the Global Bot that Oil and Gas are not the same things...

GlobeTrotter2000 · 10/06/2025 09:06

They are both fossil fuels. If the UK buys oil or gas, directly or indirectly, from Russia it still represents support for Russia.

The same applies to the EU. The value of imported fossil fuels from Russia exceeds the amount the EU has given in aid to the Ukraine.

So, the war will last forever as both sides are being funded at the same time by both the EU and the UK.

pointythings · 10/06/2025 12:27

GlobeTrotter2000 · 10/06/2025 09:06

They are both fossil fuels. If the UK buys oil or gas, directly or indirectly, from Russia it still represents support for Russia.

The same applies to the EU. The value of imported fossil fuels from Russia exceeds the amount the EU has given in aid to the Ukraine.

So, the war will last forever as both sides are being funded at the same time by both the EU and the UK.

You move those goal posts so fast, they're a blur.

pointythings · 11/06/2025 19:49

Excellent news. Step by tiny step Brexit will be unravelled.

MaybeNotBob · 11/06/2025 22:23

Excellent! Where Gibraltar leads, the rest of the UK will eventually follow...

Talkinpeace · 12/06/2025 20:51

Very tired place mark.

Sad that GlobeAI is still powered up.

I'd like more discussion about how we get from where we are now
to somewhere better

OP posts:
LouiseCollins28 · 13/06/2025 12:03

Talkinpeace · 12/06/2025 20:51

Very tired place mark.

Sad that GlobeAI is still powered up.

I'd like more discussion about how we get from where we are now
to somewhere better

Assuming that "better" in your mind is the U.K. having a closer, more integrated relationship with the E.U. then first, vote for/keep voting for parties who pledge to deliver that.

In 2029, or whenever the next GE is, you're likely to have 3 to choose from, the Liberal Democrats, the Green Party and (probably) Labour. I'm assuming you can vote in the U.K., sorry if I'm wrong about that. You may have other pro-EU parties to chose from too, if you live in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland.

From there you can either trust that those parties (if they succeed electorally) will seek closer ties or indeed a return to U.K. membership of EU structures and/or insititutions or you can advocate that they do, in addition to voting for them.

Honestly I think closer "relational" ties will be easier and quicker than "instutional" ties to forge, that's what Labour currently seem to be doing in govt. . The flip side of "easier", is that if the U.K. elects a goverment with a more negative attitude to the EU; or the EU elects people less well disposed to the U.K. those closer ties are easier to loosen again.

If what you want is to overturn Brexit and secure a full return to E.U. membership you'd need to:

a) convince a large number of people, who aren't in favour of this, why they should be. That doesn't mean making the same arguments as in 2016. It means showing people how E.U. membership will deliver things that they want, not things that you want. You'd need to know what they want first, and you haven't yet asked them yet.

b) explain why the new conditions and trade-offs we'd have to make as a new E.U. member state, like adopting the Euro as our currency, are positive for the U.K. and her people.

GlobeTrotter2000 · 13/06/2025 17:12

@LouiseCollins28

I would have added to your post as follows:

c) convince all existing EU member countries that UK joining the EU will be a benefit to all members. Remember it has to be a unanimous vote. It only takes one member to say no.

I would say that the following members will vote against UK joining the EU, or add conditions, for the following reasons:

Germany

They will be afraid that allowing UK to join is an admission that the EU was better off when the UK was a member.

France

Same as for Germany. Plus they have hated England for centuries. Remember it was France that rejected UK in 1963 and 1967.

Spain

They will make it a condition that Gibraltar is relinquished by the UK and unpaid rent is back dated.

Ireland

They will make it a condition that UK must first serve an 800 year probation period.

The service industry has boomed since Brexit. Approximately 80% of UK economy and 83% of employment is services. Hence, it will be difficult to satisfy points a) and b) listed In Louise's post.

@DuncinToffee
@Talkinpeace
@MaybeNotBob
@pointythings

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