to still be angry about Brexit?

[mrsmootoo]

I've mentioned this before and got shot down - 'move on', 'we won, you lost', 'red wall was justified', 'democracy' (although as Brexiter David Davis said, democracies can change their minds) etc etc. Anyway, if anything I am even more angry now than in 2016! Seeing queues at Dover/airports etc (I know not only down to Brexit, but it makes it worse) just reinforced it. I'm not going to rehash all the reasons here, but am just interested in whether other people are still as furious as I am. (And I do know it's not doing my stress levels any good!)

@notimagain that's because the Conservatives have had a long term plan to privatise the NHS since they deposed Labour and doing anything that might genuinely ease the burden on the NHS doesn't work in favour of that.

Yes - I could understand why people in certain industries would vote Leave because wages were undercut.
The EU brought in legislation to stop that happening in recent years. It was a problem, but it was a problem that could be addressed.
I'm glad your Dad has benefitted though.

@Midnightblack

I haven't seen the legislation but it's too little, too late. This has been a problem for more than 25 years.

I don't agree that the EU is some kind of champion for workers rights. You only have to look across the pond at the protests regarding the removal of workers rights in France over recent years - all backed by the EU.

The EU puts capitalism and the interests of big businesses well ahead of workers rights. This is why there was so much uproar about Brexit - because it affects the rich.

The EU isn't interested in the little people, it is a very corporate coup.

Well French workers protest at the drop of the hat. I don’t think protests in France are evidence of poor human rights in the EU. The EU employment laws give far better rights than those which this gvnmt is prepared to countenance for workers here. It’s no accident that they want to take us out of the ECHR and scrap the human rights act. You only have to look at the book penned by Truss and KWARTENG TO KNOW WE’re in trouble now.
but yes, sometimes the EU gets it wrong. I don’t know anyone who doesn’t think so. But it’s a hell of a lot safer than where we are now. And the country as a whole was far better off within it.

@Festoonlights @Mamamia7962 I haven't disappeared. Just reading comments. Interesting that the comments mostly seem to be towards Brexit being a mistake. Can't reply to all points obviously. Wasn't aware of a whole separate Brexit area on Mumsnet, so will check out. Was interested in the AIBU angle and it was 63% YANBU when I last looked, although I now can't see the vote for some reason.

No matter which way you voted this is such a weird take how would you rank a vote on a sliding scale based on age?! What else counts? Can I have a bigger share of the vote now I have kids as Im thinking of the affect on their future too?

Yes Brexit is a shit show but I would be way more horrified about the idea of assigning people a moral value based on certain characteristics and then deciding how much say they get, just think where that ends...

This is my attitude. Things have moved on and we have Covid and the war in Ukraine and the climate to worry about as well. Yes Brexit exacerbates those problems but it's not like without it we'd be sitting pretty. I like to spread my despair over a number of issues

@leisurelystroll Yes.. I knew it would cost me but still!

So I recieved the email today.. €1546 I have to pay! Great 👍

@beguilingeyes I always had to hand over my passport at the ferry terminal pre brexit as well. I don't think it is new - the stamp maybe but not checking the passport. Plus they don't stamp it I don't think anyway. They didn't when we went to the EU recently

They wouldn't understand. I was talking to some commoner about this and he was saying that mass unskilled migration was suppressing wages for the working class and increasing house prices. I told the racist to shut up and get to work cleaning my other shoe.

And then, we could (shocker!!) decide to consider facts.

The UK Government had powers to put controls on EU immigration to the UK all along.

We needed those workers - hence why many industries are now screwed.

House price inflation had nothing to do with EU workers: the main reasons for this were entirely driven by the policies of successive Governments around planning, local Goverment funding, financial regulation, etc.

Glad you told the racist to shut up. They fucking need to.

MN has always been a pro remain site.

The brexiteers gave up years ago trying to reason or debate with people that could even attempt to see the other side. The EU is a cult ands inspires a similar level of brainwashed adulation. At least beexiteers could sse both points of view - even if their ultimate choice was to leave - after all people seem to forget we spent the prior decade trying to reason with the EU to help solve some of the problems we were experiencing. London was being blown up by terrorists and still they couldn’t understand why we might like to know who is actually in our own country! Big mistake as they later concede, but have the EU become wiser? No chance, Macron is using the war in Ukraine to push even harder for an EU army we now see. We are thankfully now no longer part of it and many of us are grateful for that and still adore Europe itself deeply.

MN has always been a pro remain site.

Probably because it is one of the places on the internet where there is mostly intelligent discussion.

I voted Remain, I campaigned for a second referendum and I voted for parties committed to stopping Brexit. But there comes a time when we all have to realise that it’s time to move on. It’s called ‘losers’ consent’ and it’s how democracy works.

However painful it is to accept reality, we on the losing side now have to acknowledge that the public rejected uncontrolled mass immigration in 2016 and ratified that rejection in 2019. The reality is that there is no path back into the EU because there is no way the electorate of England outside the M25 will accept the return of free movement.

Indeed. Very few graduates voted to commit economic and political suicide.

I still cringe at the term 'brexiteer' as though they're swashbuckling adventurers rather than fearful little Englanders.

I do hope @Festoonlights won't be leaving until she's provided a link to the "tens of thousands of laws and diktats" Brexit has removed.

London was being blown up by terrorists

And so were Madrid, Paris, and Brussels. Islamic terrorists affected all of Europe and actually damaging intelligence sharing and joint policing by brexit puts us at more risk,not less.

You can know who is in your country without leaving the EU. UK Government policy not to check passports or record them.

Not aware of any EU national blowing up London.

Why does the EU need to be wiser when the UK has fucked over all of its citizens?

I think the reason people struggle to discuss things with Brexiteers is because nothing they say actually stands up to any scrutiny. Facts and facts. Despite what you were told, nobody should be expected to respect your opinion if the facts prove it to be wrong.

An adult, when given information that shows a previous opinion was wrong, changes their opinion. Or theory. This is how science works.

The die hards still pretending to themselves that Brexit was a good idea seem to fall into three categories: 1) racists (but the joke is on them because with less EU immigrants we've had to let in far more "brown" immigrants, the horror!); 2) economically completely illiterate so somehow STILL do not grasp what damage they have done to themselves as well as everyone else; or 3) people who are so stubborn, they would rather die than admit they made a mistake. These are usually the types who end up unvisited in care homes, eventually, when everyone gives up because it's just too exhausting if by 80 you still haven't learned what most 3 year olds know: how to admit when you are wrong and apologise. And try to make right the wrongs you did.

We could always have known who was coming into the country. In other EU countries you have to register your arrival even as an EU citizen, usually within 10 days. Absolute unadulterated bollocks that being in the EU stopped us. Successive UK governments weren’t bothered about setting up the infrastructure to do this, knowing that EU immigration was a net benefit to the country.

Can't see the option to vote. YANBU.
I'm still furious and devastated and always will be.

Indeed. Very few graduates voted to commit economic and political suicide.

I know that view is peddled a lot. But all of my Leave voting friends are graduates from some of the top universities, many with post graduate professional qualifications. I'm in this category too. Shock, horror, some are even Oxbridge graduates.

Just because we voted differently to Remain supporters doesn't make us stupid. Frankly, It's a very inappropriate, bordering on offensive, generalisation. I respect your right to have your reasons for voting Remain, perhaps we could be extended the same courtesy.

Facts are facts

Uuugh, too tired.

How many years will it take for these people to realise or admit their mistake? Or will they die still convincing themselves it was fiiiiiiiiinnnne?

London was being blown up by terrorists and still they couldn’t understand why we might like to know who is actually in our own country!

In terms of numbers/identities and given the UK were outside the Schengen zone that's down to the UK's Home Office.

I know that view is peddled a lot. But all of my Leave voting friends are graduates from some of the top universities, many with post graduate professional qualifications. I'm in this category too. Shock, horror, some are even Oxbridge graduates.

Yawn.

Yes some rich people voted for it because it would benefit them and their families personally. Like Reese-Mogg.

Your straw poll doesn't change the stats on the profile across the country. The more intelligent and educated and young you are, the less likely you are to support Brexit.

Hardly a shock given it is the most stupid act of pointless self- harm that a western democracy has ever inflicted on itself.

What happened to all of the claims that if we left France and Italy and Greece would follow and do the same? Nobody wants to. Support for the EU has massively increased. People everywhere see how absurd this decision was and the damage it has done and it's sad that people like you are incapable of the rational analysis of the data to reach the same conclusion.

I am tired of the insults, esp the race related ones. Absolutely despicable and untrue. I would welcome any number of professionals from any country if Its controlled properly.
I am out of this thread.

Get over it folks or organise professional help - failing that retrain and move there permanently if your skills aren’t portable.

This is OUR country now - we have our autonomy back whether you like it or not. I am sick to the back teeth of the whole subject like everyone else.
Last brexiteer checking out of dull rehash. Now you can whinge to yourselves unabated.