to still be angry about Brexit?

[mrsmootoo]

I've mentioned this before and got shot down - 'move on', 'we won, you lost', 'red wall was justified', 'democracy' (although as Brexiter David Davis said, democracies can change their minds) etc etc. Anyway, if anything I am even more angry now than in 2016! Seeing queues at Dover/airports etc (I know not only down to Brexit, but it makes it worse) just reinforced it. I'm not going to rehash all the reasons here, but am just interested in whether other people are still as furious as I am. (And I do know it's not doing my stress levels any good!)

They never had the next generation. Brexit was won by the older voter.

Who will disappear over the event horizon of life sooner rather than later.

Noticing a couple of Brexiteers increasingly bewildered that people haven't "moved on". Suggesting not only that they don't get it, but they never did.

Brexit is really a fantastic exemplar of the power of "all about me".

Labour have moved on and stated they will not pursue a rejoin the EU campaign in the next general election.

Labour are trying to get themselves elected. They don't need to give a right wing Brexiter press any ammunition to stop that. What they would do if elected, is almost anyone's guess.

@Peregrina What they would do if elected, is almost anyone's guess.

Labour back tracked on their 2017 manifesto and look what happened in 2019. Maybe they have already forgotten?

Labour back tracked on their 2017 manifesto and look what happened in 2019. Maybe they have already forgotten?

I don't recall Labour winning in 2017. Only winning parties have the opportunity to implement their manifestos.

Re joining the EU simply isn't an option at the moment.

We wouldn't qualify and even with the polls showing a majority to re join, its not enough, the EU don't want another Brexit in a few years time.

We will only be considered again when all main parties are pro EU.

Thats not to say an EFTA style arrangement isn't possible before hand, people forget the UK was a founding member of EFTA.

Labour are playing the long game, or at least Starmer is. He helped push Corbyn into a nonsensical position in 2019 over more referendums and Labour were stuffed.

He won't do anything over Brexit after he gets elected but if he goes for a second term you can imagine they'll be pushing for things like customs union or single market.

@AndreaC74 and even with the polls showing a majority to re join

Are these the polls that are based on 2,000 people? History has proved that polls are often wrong.

We will only be considered again when all main parties are pro EU.

An application to join the EU has to be approved by all members. If one member says no, UK will not be able to join.

No polls do not show that at all & you have to look at consistency, polling on Brexit regret has been clear across many surveys and different polling methods.

Polls have a 2 to 4% margin of error (dependant on sample size) the Brexit and the Trump votes all within this margin, this is what amazed me with Brexit, how on earth did Cameron expect to win when leave/remain were so close?

The point is, even if all 27 agreed, unless the UK is fully united behind an application, it wont even get to the member states to consider plus our debt to GDP is too high, growth too low atm.

The UK is out of the EU for many years to come, i'm my 50s and i have no expectation we will re-join in my life time.

An application to join the EU has to be approved by all members. If one member says no, UK will not be able to join.

Perfect example of what 'take back control' really looks like.

@AndreaC74 Polls have a 2 to 4% margin of error

Polls conducted from 2013 to 2016 indicated remain would win by a 2:1 ratio when polls that had differences of 4% or less were ignored. This has been explained and proved on another thread.

plus our debt to GDP is too high, growth too low atm.

Scotland has the same issue as detailed on a recent episode of QT. Ireland would have had the same issue if it were not for the amount of foreign owned companies operating in Ireland.

i'm my 50s and i have no expectation we will re-join in my life time.

Me too. Also, the EU is beginning to wobble.

The Netherlands are beginning to wonder if they should leave the EU.

Both France and Spain want the 90/180 Schegen rule to be relaxed for Brits as it is hurting their economies.

Due to security risks, the following members want to tighten border controls:

Austria
Denmark
France
Germany
Italy
Norway
Poland
Slovakia
Slovania
Sweden

Hungary is not in alignment with Brussels over Ukraine funding

So, although I don't think it will happen in my lifetime, I think the EU will disintegrate in the future.

The idea that Netherlands will leave too- where does this come from- the fact that wilders had the biggest vote is due to the fact they gave so many left and centre left and centre parties- Netherlands is very export heavy- it will have all the problems the UK has had and more- as it revolves round market gardening on an industrial scale, meat, dairy, flowers, pharma - more fool them if they went for it.

I visit business for work. I know loads that have moved the the Netherlands post Brexit so I'm guessing they don't think they want to leave the EU.

Reminds me of this from 2016

https://images.app.goo.gl/4g5Z77uALSJ6fyZP9

One thing missing from the image I linked to - Putin's hand.

@Kendodd Reminds me of this from 2016

UK left the EU 31 January 2020 with a transition period to 31 December 2020. After that date, the Schengen 90/180 rule was applied to Brits. This has had a negative impact on the tourist economies of both France and Spain. Hence they want the 90/180 rule to be relaxed for Brits.

So, maybe the domino cartoon could be changed to show both France and Spain backing the UK?

So, maybe the domino cartoon could be changed to show both France and Spain backing the UK?

No, more like France and Spain being more concerned about their own economies. Nothing to do with the UK being speshul.

@Crikeyalmighty more fool them if they went for it.

It is not necessary to be an EU member to trade with the EU. Approx. 70 Countries outside of the EU have trade deals with the EU.

Also, the Rotterdam-Antwerp Effect as it known can distort trade figures in favour of the EU. A link is

The 'Rotterdam-Antwerp Effect' in the Context of UK Trade Statistics - ESCoE : ESCoE

@Peregrina No, more like France and Spain being more concerned about their own economies. Nothing to do with the UK being speshuler

Look at the link

Brits in France win right to stay longer than 90 days « Euro Weekly News

@GlobeTrotter2000 the UK in theory have a trade deal with the EU and it is neither use nor ornament for most businesses due to the VAT implications , costs involved in setting up for individual businesses due to VAT again and is useless if dealing with food and FMCG - Netherlands also relies on a lot of non Dutch labour (but other EU) - so unless it relaxed the rules considerably with regards to FOM it would have issues.

Britons, who already own properties in France, have potentially won the right to stay for 180 days, instead of indefinitely as previously allowed. Is that really a Brexit benefit? It's a bit like someone stealing £1000 from you and saying "here You can have a tenner, no, I have changed my mind, I'll be generous, you can have £100." You are still £900 down!

Typical Brexiteer bullshit.

It is not yet clear how the new rules will work nor when they will come into force. It is also possible that the Constitutional Council, France’s equivalent of the Supreme Court, could reverse the decision.

@Crikeyalmighty Netherlands also relies on a lot of non Dutch labour (but other EU) - so unless it relaxed the rules considerably with regards to FOM it would have issues.

Many of the Trades people on the project I worked on were from Russia and the Ukraine. Also, my cousin nad his wife will be made redundance soon from a large US sportswear manufacturer that operates in The Netherlands as tier jobs are being outsourced to India.

Really?
Online surveys, on average, predicted a "leave" win with a 1.2% margin, whereas those with a phone methodology had "remain" win with a 2.6% margin. All in all, 63% of online polls predicted a Leave victory, while 78% of phone polls predicted that Remain would win

...look at the polls in 2015 and beyond?

what IF about ROI? they are in the EU and have lots of foreign companies, you might as well say "Germany wouldn't have much of a manufacturing economy if VAG and Siemens didn't exist...." i thought i was arguing with an adult?

90/180 relaxed to 180/360... why not? its what the UK gives almost all other countries and it still limits British visitors to 180 days in any 360 day period, they aren't giving us any extra days over the course of the year, so your 300k house in France is still not available to you for 6months of the year.

Plus it hasn't actually happened, if you bothered to read the link.

As for border control? of course, thanks the British bombing the fuck out of Libya, the place has become a holding area for 100s of 000s of migrants, a base for ISIS and numerous criminal outfits.... well done UK!

The EU can exist without completely free borders and once the migrant crisis is over (nothing lasts forever) it will return, the EU has always evolved.

Hungary will be by-passed, it has far to close a relationship with Russia, perhaps even kicked out, though perhaps its better in the EU than outside, we don't want another Putin satellite country in Europe.

Europe was such a peaceful place before the EEC/EU, so only a complete idiot would want it gone, regardless of their views on the UK membership, the UK cannot stay outside of European conflict, it never has been able too.