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Brexit

Westministenders: Biden Time Til The Penny Drops

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 16/01/2021 16:03

Next week sees a changing in the international guard with implications for the UK in a post Brexit world where we are starting to realise we are very much on our own and frozen out.

The government were able to cosy up with Trump much to the EU's distaste, but Biden is a whole different kettle of fish. Assuming of course that things go to plan next week and the USA don't end up with an almighty bloody mess on their hands.

The political landscape change means the US will become much more inward looking to try and sort its own shit out (amongst domestic terrorism and having run out of vaccine supplies with no stock available from Pfizer until June top of the agenda) and what little international diplomacy there is, is highly unlikely to be centred around the desparate needs of the UK.

The EU meanwhile are largely happy with their lot over the Brexit deal and to leave the UK to their fish stew. With the sole exception of Ireland, who strangely enough the EU and US will probably be very willing to help - putting the Irish into a unique bridging position between the two which they can use to capitalise on.

We will be schooled on the benefits of being in the EU the hard way it seems. The Thatcherite dream of frictionless trade has been well and truly krilled off. The future beckons with the beaucratic mess and spiralling cost of haulage to Europe making it financially not worthwhile even for big firms but especially for small businesses. A quick look at the cost of smart phones is revealling, and tells a story. Prior to the 1st you could buy from the EU. Now the only place shipping to the UK is through Hong Kong, with all the extra associated charges and customs. The price has gone up considerably. Already.

The fact that the government are only just starting to stay they are herring about problems and will endevour to resolve them just doesn't cut it. They were told of the issues years ago. They chose to ignore them. They had better things to do. Like go for a nice holiday at their second home in Europe or fancy dinner at an authetic French restuarant. Strangely enough for various reasons these pastimes are currently off the menu its starting to dawn just how we are stuck between a rock and a hard plaice as a consequence.

You didn't need to be a brain sturgeon to see this coming. It is exactly what was predicted. Queues of lorries as post Christmas trade picks up and stock piles run out, but also empty shelves where things like jigsaws, fresh vegetable, cheese, electricals and paper used to be. The sunlight uplands and promise of brexit opportunities are turning out to be a load of old pollocks. It will take years for some sectors to rebalance and adjust. If they make it through and don't end up on the rocks.

It is a turtle disaster for the economy. On top of the covid.

Even the pro-leave fishermen are starting to realise that the deal was a load of carp. And want to dump their rotten langoustines outside Downing Street. Their fish are far from happy and they have finally haddock with the government. It doesn't help that the fisheries minister has openly said she didn't read the deal because she was too busy organising a nativity. Which sums up the whole situation in a perfect way. Its not even incompetence, its total indifference and apathy.

The Penny will drop as the Pound does. We will learn that its better to be a big fish in a medium pond than a medium fish in a huge pond simply because of how the food chain works.

The sharks are slowly circling for Johnson and once the heat is off, and we get to the stage were the messaging doesn't read like 'We want covid to kill you whilst we have a Tory Bunfight' as it doesn't sit terribly well with the public.

The dust is settling and who does Johnson play pin the blame on now? This deal isn't the result of sabotage by remainers. This deal is his and his alone to own. Isolated at No10 Johnson is likely to start to feel increasingly like he has no friends. He has a whalely big job ahead of him to turn things around a plot a new course ahead to the future for HMS Britannia.

OP posts:
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TonMoulin · 21/01/2021 17:48

I think it makes sense for any decision re restriction in travel third countries to be at eu level
Simply because once someone has arrived in the Schengen area, they can then move to another country wo any check.

For countries out of the Schengen area, they always had checks at the border so could do whatever they wanted really. (That would have applied to the U.K. then)

With the awful infection rates we have, I suspect they are quite happy they can. Restrict the movement of people coming from the country with one of/the highest death rate in the world tbh....
I mean that’s exactly what the U.K. with SA because of their new variant afterall...

SabrinaThwaite · 21/01/2021 17:58

@DGRossetti

Not quite sure what this is ?
Competency of Scottish Parliament to hold Indyref2 without Westminster consent.
DGRossetti · 21/01/2021 18:03

Competency of Scottish Parliament to hold Indyref2 without Westminster consent

I kinda sensed that. Wasn't aware it was happening until a Scottish friend popped it onto a forum ... no reason I should, on the one hand. But considering the ramifications, maybe the English media already know the outcome. After all, not all cases are decided in court ...

Clavinova · 21/01/2021 18:24

mathanxiety
@ Clavinova, did the wine merchant say he had already decided that Brexit was bad and that he wanted to leave the country because of it?Or did he say he had sensibly anticipated a shaky start to the new customs regime and associated logistical problems...

He is featured in the Guardian - they quote him; "we knew Brexit would be a car crash..." although your previous quote about him leaving the country is watered down in the article;

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/18/a-multiple-pile-up-in-the-fog-wine-agents-fury-at-brexit-red-tape

Also, I would also like to know what your definition of a minor irritation is.

A minor irritation for me would be something mentioned on this board a number of times, that is; applying for an international driving permit if I didn't already have a photocard driving licence - apparently drivers using a paper licence might need to apply at the Post Office counter/online with a passport photo and £5.50 if they want to drive in the EU.

I'm not qualified to say which of the new import/export requirements are minor or major irritations, although applying for an EORI number seems very straightforward here; Use this service to apply for an EORI number that starts with GB. It takes 5 to 10 minutes to apply.
www.gov.uk/eori

Clavinova · 21/01/2021 18:28

What’s so special about Lurpak, much prefer President.

Yes - I actually bought President Spreadable today, not Lurpak.

Clavinova · 21/01/2021 18:31

mathanxiety

You said; the EU probably couldn't have done any more than it has done - they were too slow with their advice for a start.

mrslaughan · 21/01/2021 18:34

@Clavinova

*mrslaughan Going as well as we expected....*

Although your link does say;

However, export orders bucked the broader trend, with this balance rising to its least negative since March, though it was still below its long-run average.

“(This) suggests that EU firms are not hesitating to source goods from the UK, despite the extra red tape and rise in haulage costs,” Samuel Tombs of Pantheon Macroeconomics said.

Great - it's like a doctor saying -we've amputated your legs, but don't worry we tied off the arteries....
jasjas1973 · 21/01/2021 18:46

Switzerland has borders with five EU countries, and trade is electronically frictionless. Why not us?"

No fucking words.....

There is a core of exceptionalism in that which can only be cured by the grim reaper

You know, i'm not the cleverest person in the UK by a very long way but 5 mins on Google tells you exactly why this is for Switzerland, yet Daltry cannot be bothered to do basic research, just ignorance/stupidity and why even moderately complex decisions are beyond most people in the UK.

Words · 21/01/2021 18:49

Well aware that Lurpak has horrid ( shudder) veg oil in it, SabrinaHmm

For high days and holidays we use some fantastic farmhouse butter from the local co operative. But even I cannot justify it for everyday and I spend a lot on food.

Vera, yes re the waste of civil service time, which would have been much better spent on pandemic handling. Especially since the cuts and politicisation attempts have denuded the service of some of its outstanding talent, as well as valuable corporate memory.

DGRossetti · 21/01/2021 18:50

The famous French sense of humour, eh ?

The UK. Stitched up. Like a kipper Grin

DGRossetti · 21/01/2021 18:55

You know, i'm not the cleverest person in the UK by a very long way but 5 mins on Google tells you exactly why this is for Switzerland, yet Daltry cannot be bothered to do basic research, just ignorance/stupidity and why even moderately complex decisions are beyond most people in the UK.

I think he genuinely doesn't understand why France, Germany etc remaining in the EU should have any effect on Britain. Have re read what he said (with the caveat that it's reported) I am more convinced than ever that this is the case. If I'm right, it explains a bit.

Clavinova · 21/01/2021 19:06

Music tours;
Taking a different view The Telegraph's Neil McCormick described the debate as "a storm in a backstage teacup".

Music agent Paul Fenn, whose company Asgard Promotions boasts acts such as The Waterboys, Ray Davies, Emmylou Harris, Tom Waits and Alison Krauss, told the journalist that very little had changed.

Under the new post-Brexit agreement, he pointed out, EU countries will treat British people as third country nationals - just like Americans, Canadians and Australians. "Now, I make a living sending American artists around Europe and, with one or two exceptions, it's easy, we have no problems," said Fenn.

"On the surface there doesn't appear to be any changes for British acts going into Europe in 2021."

Promoter and music business consultant Chris Pleydell added: "For large promoters, it won't change anything. I know of not one band to ever spend 90 days touring Europe, it's absurd. Fourteen days in Europe is about the average."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-55616860

The visa kerfuffle is a ‘solution without a problem’ – though that doesn’t mean there won’t be bumps in the road for future music tours.

www.telegraph.co.uk/music/artists/musicians-complaining-brexit-creating-storm-teacup/

SabrinaThwaite · 21/01/2021 19:07

@words

Just buy ordinary salted butter and don’t keep it in the fridge - that’s kind of what the salt is for Hmm Grin

Peregrina · 21/01/2021 19:17

Commenting on Clavinova's silly post about driving licences, as it happens I have just swapped my old paper one for one of the photo card licences, but why should I have to paid £5.50 for something which was once free?

Ditto musicians - they were free to tour once to neighbouring countries, they are not now. Those with a Raabsian sense of Geography do not seem to realise that the USA, Canada and Australia are literally thousands of miles away not 20 at the nearest point. It was possible to nip over to continental Europe in an hour and half. Please show me a flight from Australia which takes an hour and a half max.

jasjas1973 · 21/01/2021 19:19

Clav Maybe you should read your own link first?

Craig Stanley suspects there may be more devastating issues around cabotage rules, restricting how many stops a truck can make before it has to return to Britain. This is currently limited to three, which would make for a very short tour. “So what happens if a UK registered rock ’n’ roll truck loads up in England with gear for a tour, and then has to go back to Britain after the third concert?” Stanley asks. “If the trailer stays, you then have to have a European tractor cab to pull the trailer around Europe

“But there aren’t enough trucks and specialist drivers in Europe to satisfy demand, because the UK haulage industry accounts for 80 per cent of the European market. Plus, you’ve got orchestras with their own vans, and specialist drivers who know how to look after their instruments. It’s a truly existential risk to international touring, but nobody’s talking about it, because they are all focusing on the passport issue, which isn’t a big problem at all.”

Brexit, once again, present problems where previously there were none, for no gain.

SabrinaThwaite · 21/01/2021 19:21

It’s not just visas for touring musicians though - it’s carnets as well now, for absolutely every bit of kit.

Peregrina · 21/01/2021 19:27

Even if it's absolutely wonderful that musicians in the USA, Canada and Australia have the same constraints to operate under, does anyone think that they wouldn't jump at the chance to eliminate the bureaucracy and costs involved?

mathanxiety · 21/01/2021 19:28

LOL at the Irish response to the outreach on thorny post-Brexit fishing problems reported Victoria Prentis... a long list of niggly issues such as what colour ink to use on forms, where on a form to put a customs stamp Smile. And the agreement with the French to talk more...

And all apparently entertained and responded to completely in earnest by Prentis, et al.

pointythings · 21/01/2021 19:29

I am a heathen who only eats unsalted butter.

jasjas1973 · 21/01/2021 19:32

@pointythings

I am a heathen who only eats unsalted butter.
Unsalted butter is margarine.
SabrinaThwaite · 21/01/2021 19:49

You can use unsalted butter on toast, as long as you sprinkle salt on top.

See Nigella’s twice buttered toast “recipe”

Might as well give your heart a proper work out.

borntobequiet · 21/01/2021 19:51

I rather like the waitrose French butter with rock salt but its very £££

Aldi do a West Country one like this and it’s only a few pence more than the standard version.

mathanxiety · 21/01/2021 19:57

Andrew Adonis
@Andrew_Adonis
‘Johnson is refusing to allow the EU’s ambassador to Britain to have full diplomatic status’ (BBC)

How silly, stupid, shortsighted, foolish, petty, self-defeating, insulting and impolite can you get?
11:27 PM · Jan 20, 2021

mathanxiety · 21/01/2021 19:59

Darren Marshall @darrenmarshall
The Telegraph: Biden "really cares about" the UK

Is Darren Marshall your DS' teacher, RTB?
Because methinks he believes Ireland is part of GB still.

ListeningQuietly · 21/01/2021 20:03

And under the category of
No shit Sherlock / I told you so
news.sky.com/story/freight-traffic-slumps-and-costs-soar-as-brexit-friction-bites-12194430