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Original poster

Westminstenders: Off he pops to Brussels

942 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/12/2020 07:55

Alex Andreou @sturdyalex
There's no way Johnson has not already decided whether or not to concede on Level Playing Field. Which makes the trip to Brussels dressing. Whether it will dress a concession as "I have saved us" or No Deal as "I tried my best" remains to be seen. But the choice is already made.

Amanda Cole @amandajanecole
What's your gut feeling, will he put his job ahead of the country? Given his past self serving form?

Alex Andreou @sturdyalex
I think he is so cornered - and has done so badly on Covid19 - his instinct will be one last, double-or-nothing throw of the dice. Only no deal does that.

The issue is that coming back with a deal will earn him much heckling and zero back-slapping from his peers. But no deal will earn him just as much heckling, but also plenty of back-slapping. What I don't know is just how ominous the departmental briefings he's getting are.

Its also worth noting the following:

Mujtaba Rahman @mij_europe
I understand @BorisJohnson wanted @EmmanuelMacron & Merkel to join his phone call with @vonderleyen last night, but she rejected the idea

So even yesterday he was STILL looking to undermine the EU and split its leaders. After all this time and the number of times he's tried this on.

Have no doubt that a) everything will be blamed on Macron (probably personally, with Conservative hardliners coming out calling for the public to boycott French cheese and wine - I'm serious btw) and covid b) covid provides a handy distraction at least for the moment. It will be used accordingly - that means its possibly now not in Johnson's interest to stop a spike in January. All efforts will be put into the vaccine rollout for PR but thats going to hit the breaks fairly soon. No doubt the EU will be blamed for that too.

What I'm not anticipating is another full lockdown. I think at least parts of Greater Manchester will now get out of T3 on 16th December. Traffords numbers look exceptional and I think it politically impossible for Johnson to keep it in T3. Its Graham Brady's patch and Manchester as a whole looks far far better than T2 London.

Anyone who gets out of T3 before Christmas won't go back into it. I'm not anticipating London to go T3 unless No Deal turns really ugly and its useful to quell civil unrest.

I think if we head into no deal then tight restrictions won't be used for covid reasons no matter how bad the hospitals get - it will only be about civil unrest, it will all be about keeping the economy going - backbench revolts are what scare Johnson most, and he's already said no more Tiers after the start of Feb.

We shall see what the day brings...

OP posts:
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tobee · 09/12/2020 18:07

He's such a gigantic turd.

Lonelycrab · 09/12/2020 18:08

tobee sadly that was my thought too. Prosper my arse. Despairing pmkSad

ListeningQuietly · 09/12/2020 18:17

@LouiseCollins28

Interesting article I thought. Weird how the author pulled his punches when talking about David Cameron and his "negotiation".
Probably because Cameron is now just a footnote. He ran scared of Farage rather than facing him down. If DC had come back and said this is what I have - you specify exactly what you want if you do not accept it we would not be in this mess
TokyoSushi · 09/12/2020 18:18

I feel like he's going to 'Australia style deal' No particular reason why, just a feeling that would be the cherry on the cake of 2020.

dontcallmelen · 09/12/2020 18:20

LQ hope the hedgehog responds to treatment🤞🏻 & the Cat is just lean n trim rather than unwell.
My local Sainsbury’s also using the closed cafe as storage.

GirlsBlouse17 · 09/12/2020 18:27

Am I right in saying that with the EU-USA trade agreement, that the USA has to follow EU rules to access EU markets? What arbitrary system is there between the two to enforce the agreement?

TatianaBis · 09/12/2020 18:28

@TokyoSushi

I feel like he's going to 'Australia style deal' No particular reason why, just a feeling that would be the cherry on the cake of 2020.
That’s No deal with a spin on it.
GirlsBlouse17 · 09/12/2020 18:30
  • arbitration
Original poster
RedToothBrush · 09/12/2020 18:32

@TokyoSushi

I feel like he's going to 'Australia style deal' No particular reason why, just a feeling that would be the cherry on the cake of 2020.
Theres no such thing.

The EU has multiple deals with the EU.

The EU has said this isnt an option for the Uk to pick and chose sectorial deals as it just likes because of the level playing field and our close proximity.

OP posts:
tobee · 09/12/2020 18:38

We know there's no such thing. But why would the government care?

TurquoiseBaubles · 09/12/2020 18:41

I just watched the Irish news and heard a German MEP say (I paraphrase) "this is the first time the EU as an economic group has offered free trade to a country outside the group. If any other country in the world applied to have tariff free trade with the EU it wouldn't happen".

I never thought of it like that, but he's right. No other country could rock up to trade talks with the EU and demand free access to their markets without expecting to have to give on on things like labour laws, health and safety rules, etc etc.

It puts it in perspective really.

tobee · 09/12/2020 18:42

People, like my husband, think there's no way they'd go for no deal because of the shit that would fall on them and the rest of us.

But that's people making the fundamental of thinking of what they themselves would do. Fatally not taking into account what a narcissistic wanker would do with the help of arse lickers and swivel eyed loony ideologues.

SwedishEdith · 09/12/2020 18:43

Johnson and VDL went to same school and both have 7 children. They can talk about that, I suppose.

TurquoiseBaubles · 09/12/2020 18:46

Same news bulletin basically warned everyone in Ireland not to buy anything worth more than €22 from the UK as VAT would have to be paid on receipt.

DGRossetti · 09/12/2020 19:00

@GirlsBlouse17

Am I right in saying that with the EU-USA trade agreement, that the USA has to follow EU rules to access EU markets? What arbitrary system is there between the two to enforce the agreement?
There is no overall US-EU trade deal. Only a few selected highlights. And yes - the needs to meet EU standards (as indeed the EU would need to meet US standards). The US has agreed to abide by ECJ rulings and the EU by US federal court rulings.
dontcallmelen · 09/12/2020 19:03

@tobee

People, like my husband, think there's no way they'd go for no deal because of the shit that would fall on them and the rest of us.

But that's people making the fundamental of thinking of what they themselves would do. Fatally not taking into account what a narcissistic wanker would do with the help of arse lickers and swivel eyed loony ideologues.

Exactly & this is what it all boils down to, a few nutters holding us hostage combined with the narcissistic arse wipe Boris, Cummings et el the stars have been aligned for destroying this country for the last four & half years.
DGRossetti · 09/12/2020 19:07

@SwedishEdith

Johnson and VDL went to same school and both have 7 children. They can talk about that, I suppose.
The number of children Boris Johnson has is unknown. Even by him.
Words · 09/12/2020 19:14

It's unbelievable that we are where we are, after all this time. Facing what so many predicted.
Faithful thread follower here, almost from the start.
Brexit stash rebuilt after first lockdown ( thanks to Bellini and others I had one in the first place.)
Has anyone heard from BCF? I do hope she's ok. I miss her.
Thank you to all the regulars, most of all RTB for these threads chronically this utterly ignominious period in our history :(

Peregrina · 09/12/2020 19:18

If it was clear to Johnson that he didn't want a deal, why didn't he walk out last year as soon as he won the election?

I would have said why bother to negotiate for four years, but I think that May genuinely did want a deal and she would not have put a border in the Irish Sea.

tobee · 09/12/2020 19:21

Yes but May's red lines!!

ListeningQuietly · 09/12/2020 19:23

words
Has anyone heard from BCF? I do hope she's ok. I miss her.
I'll ping her a message tomorrow Smile

Peregrina · 09/12/2020 19:24

Yes, May's red lines were pretty stupid, but the backstop would have kept us in the Customs Union, until the technology was invented which would have been...... well much much later if ever.

Lonelycrab · 09/12/2020 19:33

If it was clear to Johnson that he didn't want a deal, why didn't he walk out last year as soon as he won the election

Because he wants to give the impression he did everything he could, but the unreasonable enemy wants to punish us, so blame them not me for the chaos you are about to experience 😑

Peregrina · 09/12/2020 19:33

I do wonder if this will end up being a Cameron moment for Johnson. By this I mean, Cameron thought he had Remain in the bag, hadn't and within 12 hours of the results being declared had destroyed his Premiership.

Johnson will go for No Deal, but how will the country react? This is what he can't fully control despite the best efforts of the Mail, Express and Telegraph. I hope that all those who chose to return a Tory MP last year enjoy what they get.

Peregrina · 09/12/2020 19:34

BTW if Johnson comes back with No Deal, there is nothing to vote on, I take it? So that kicks the ERG can down the road again.