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Brexit

The EU has no negotiating strategy - according to the Telegraph

442 replies

BeaStoic · 09/02/2020 09:00

The EU is scoffing with panic. This week, its leaders neurotically laughed off the threat of a Parliament shutdown, as bureaucrats slammed their fists over post-Brexit budget cuts. Press officers tuttingly buried an economic report warning that Brexit will rock bloc economies.But they struggled to firefight raging speculation as to who might follow Britain out the door. As rumours rumbled of anItalexitdebt crisis, Marine Le Pen thundered that a global Eurosceptic movement has infiltrated Brussels.

Perhaps the most intriguing development this week, however, isMichel Barnier’s shift in persona. Mere months ago, Mr Barnier was gloomily instructing Britain to sign up to vassalage. Lecture highlights included “why Britain must take responsibility” (by becoming an EU satellite state) and why “choices” (for example liberty) must have “consequences”. But suddenly, the school master has a snake oil salesman. His arid presentations on Britain’s self-inflicted fate have morphed into butterypitches for “a best in class free trade agreement”.

Such a “best in class” deal could be otherwise described as Theresa Mayite vassalage. It entails sucking Britain into megalomaniac defence projects, allowing Brussels toplunder Britain’s fishing waters, and blessing Britain with freedom for the small price of sacrificing its competitiveness. This “exceptional offer” is beinggift-wrappedfree of charge in the tangled red ribbons of state aid paperwork and taxation regulations. Available fora limited time only (expires Dec 2020).

In reality, though Brussels knows that its chance to flog Britain the worst trade deal in history is slipping away. It can no longer fall back on the backstop to keep us locked in Hotel California. Boris Johnson’s thumping majority also means Britain’s "no deal" bargaining chip is back in play:aWTO Brexitwould pass through Parliament reasonably comfortably. Revelations this week that, in the event of no deal,Japanese car giant Nissan would considerdoublingdown on the UK to boost its domestic market share, and protect its Sunderland plant,underline the inconvenient truth:Project Fear premonitions are overblown, andBritain could cope perfectly well without a trade deal.

It is also becoming embarrassingly clear that the EU has no actual strategy. Only the clapped out choreography of a collapsing robo-bureaucracy. The most tedious of its “secret moves” is sequencing. Granted, this was how Brussels tripped up that lurching political equivalent to two left feet, Theresa May. She sealed her fate when she foolishly agreed to settle Northern Ireland before penning a divorce settlement.

But the idea that Boris Johnson’s government would fall for this again is laughable. Still the EU tries its luck: this week Mr Barnier said that before signing up to a trade deal, Britain would have to agree to the EU’s conditions - effectively trying to turn fishing and Gibraltar into the new Irish Border.

Another of the EU’s recycled moves is heel dragging. It intends to bog Britain down with absurd and nonsensically disparate demands until the deadline is near. The idea being that Boris Johnson will feel political pressure to avoid breaking his promise to settle Brexit by the end of the year - and thus sign up to a dud deal.

Britain’s counter-move is already evident - to negotiate trade deals with the United States and other countries, as talks with Brussels flounder; Cummings and co are determined to send out the message that if the EU does not want to engage in talks then that it can go jogging.

Indeed, Trade Secretary Liz Truss announced on Thursday that Britain is seeking huge reductions in tariffs from a trade deal with the United States. The Government also intends to begin negotiations with Japan, Australia and New Zealand in the coming months.

And so the EU gets more and more desperate. In a stumbling tribute to Orwellian doublespeak, its most ridiculous new wheeze is semantic. It is genuinely trying to get Britain to accidentally enslave itself by changing the meaning of basic words.

This includes the preposition “In”. Britain has rejected staying “in” the single market, with all the accompanying constrictions and conditions. Brussels’ solution? Offer “access” to the single market, with all the accompanying constrictions and conditions.

Then there is the oldest trick of the bureaucratic sociopath: the unflinching lie. My favourite peddled by the EU this week is that free movement must continue as the condition for any trade deal. Even though the EU has, in the Political Declaration, conceded the precise contrary.

It is increasingly clear that Brussels is the new Theresa May of these negotiations. And it is finally heading for a rude awakening.

OP posts:
Peregrina · 11/02/2020 10:32

Nor is there any mention of someone saying "I think we will rejoin in two years" on that other thread.

Try again Mystery.

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 11:36

Paranoid or what?

Peregrina · 11/02/2020 11:41

You want us to agree you are paranoid?

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 11:52

There are several paranoid remain supporters. They seem to suggest the same thing over and over.

If a leave supporter makes a typo they seem to think that Brexit (now passed in both EU and UK law) should be cancelled. Laws can be repealed and there should be another referendum wthin 2 year of Jan 2020 just as there was in 1975.

All clutching at straws in my view.

malylis · 11/02/2020 11:58

Oh dear mystery, I said we have previously had a referendum within two years of joining, why couldn't we have one within two years of leaving, when you cited the precedent of the gap between referendums.

No one said we could rejoin in two years, as usual you have misunderstood

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 12:07

why couldn't we have one within two years of leaving

That's clutching at straws. Difference between 1975 was that UK was already in the EU and past the hurdles of other members acceptánce.

No referendum to join in 1973. That Heath had in his manifesto to take UK into the EU does not prove that was the only reason people voted him in.

Leave does not require permission from the other EU members. Hence it will be a shorter process than join, but look how long it has taken to get this far. Trade negotations to be completed by end of 2020 which is four and half years since the vote to leave in 2016.

indistinct · 11/02/2020 13:54

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

keyboardwarrior1 · 11/02/2020 14:02

trade negotiations to be completed by end of 2020

They will need to be completed much earlier if any decisions are be to ratified by EU MS parliaments - around July or August. This is not a political point. The process is what it is.

Since it is impossible to cover all areas within this timescale the very best anyone can hope for is a bare bones trade agreement. It will not cover services (80% of UK exports).

The UK will be in crisis by the end of 2020 as the implications sink in.

ListeningQuietly · 11/02/2020 14:24

keyboard
The UK will be in crisis by the end of 2020 as the implications sink in.
I think it will be rather sooner than that.

Companies that want to relocate manufacturing into the EU will need to move all of their equipment as well to avoid import VAT
so the factory closures will start by the middle of the year

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 15:17

Companies that want to relocate manufacturing into the EU will need to move all of their equipment as well to avoid import VAT so the factory closures will start by the middle of the year

Bit premature to relocate before the outcome of the trade negotiations are known. May end up moving back to the UK in 2021?

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 15:26

@indistinct

No I am not. Just laughing at all the straw clutching. So far there has been:

2016 referendum was only advisory. Therefore the result of the 1975 referendum still prevails.

BJ has a majority of seats, but not of the vote. Therefore Brexit should have been cancelled since more wanted to remain than leave in the 2019 election.

Laws can be repealed. True that UK can change their own laws, but they can't change the EU laws.

As of 11pm 31 Jan 2020 the UK left the EU and, although paying the contributions to the EU till end of December 2020, have no say in EU policy or law.

Precedent has been set that there should be another referendum on EU membership within two years of UK leaving the EU.

Etc...

Peregrina · 11/02/2020 15:31

None of this matters, Mystery. You have got your Brexit now own it.

We should adopt the slogan 'The Brexit Buck stops with Boris'.

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 15:35

You have got your Brexit now own it

Implementation of Brexit is the task of government, not the voters.

If voters think government is doing a bad job then vote them out at the next election. Easy peasy.

The outcome will effect everyone in the Uk regardless of how they voted. So I can't work out why remain supporters wnat Bexit to fail. Surely it is to their loss too?

indistinct · 11/02/2020 16:45

MysteryTripAgain
Genuinely hope Brexit not only isn't a failure but a roaring success for the sake of all of us and our children. Can't see how it will be but hope it will be nonetheless. Am mystified why you're spending so much time/effort trying to convince MN contributors and readers that it will be when the decision to leave is no longer in play.

Mistigri · 11/02/2020 16:55

Whether or not Brexit is a success or not is completely independent of the personal wishes of mumsnet remainers (or leavers), unless there are any cabinet ministers or captains of industry lurking here Wink

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 17:11

@Indistinct

Since the 2016 vote there have been a number of threads initiated by remain supporters requesting leavers to explain how Brexit will benefit. Leave supporters who were prepared to answer how they thought the UK would be better off were subject to a barrage of comments such as ;

Stupid
Thick
Racist

In general the remain supporters were advocating that as they know better the fact that leave was the majority vote was irrelevant and Brexit is guaranteed to be a failure it must be cancelled because they say so. The ultimate in arrogance in my view.

I have challenged such posters to produce their crystal ball that enables them to forecast the future with certainty, but so far nothing has appeared. Even asked why they don’t clean up on the stock market as that revolves around knowing when share prices will rise and fall (clairvoyance). That too has never been answered.

Brexit soon shifted from leaving the EU to a battle to preserve democracy. When democracy disappears the law of the fun takes over.

Have as many elections and referendums as you wish, but all outcomes must be implemented in the order they appear. Remain supporters have advocated that referendums that produce results they don’t like most be skipped or rerun over and over until the result is what those who know better hear what they want to hear.

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 17:16

@Mistigri

So why are there regular comments like:

It’s up to the leave voters to own Brexit

If Brexit is a success do remainers not want a share too? Seems to be some double standards being applied.

Peregrina · 11/02/2020 17:18

Since the Leave voters wanted Brexit so much, surely they want to own the results?

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 17:26

surely they want to own the results

The results, good or bad, will effect everyone.

Remain supporters seem to be advocating that if Brexit is unsuccessful then only those that voted to leave should bear the consequences. However, I have not seen the reverse being applied in which only those who voted leave shall benefit if Brexit is a success. So sounds like double standards.

Both scenarios are impossible to implement as the vote was anonymous.

Danetobe · 11/02/2020 17:36

How will we know if Brexit is successful?

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 17:48

How will we know if Brexit is successful?

There isn’t a single answer to that question as Brexit means different things to to different people.

For some Brexit is already a success as UK has given two fingers to the EU and what happens next is of little interest. In two words

National Pride

For me Brexit is a success if UK can increase its trade surplus with non EU countries to balance the huge trade deficit that it has with the EU.

ContinuityError · 11/02/2020 18:06

a fictional character like Jack Reacher

I think Frumpety has found a good metaphor - the Reacher books promised a 6’4” blond haired blue eyed hunk and we ended up on screen with a 5’6” brown haired brown eyed Scientologist?

ContinuityError · 11/02/2020 18:18

@MysteryTriprAgain

You keep forgetting why leave voted [leave].

National pride (2 fingers to the EU)

Immigration (its our country go away)

That sure sounds “stupid, thick and racist” to me.

Please do remind me who posted that?

I can give you a hint if you’re still struggling with the MN search facility.

MysteryTripAgain · 11/02/2020 18:39

That sure sounds “stupid, thick and racist” to me

To you maybe, but not to those who voted on that basis. Remember;

Freedom of choice when voting is part of the democratic process. There will never be pre-screening of people before they vote as advocated by some.

Voting has two requirements

  • be over voting age
  • turning up at the polling station
ContinuityError · 11/02/2020 18:42

It’s our country, go away

In your own words. Nationalism and racism in a single sentence. How sweet.