How will we measure Brexit’s success or failure?

[Bearbehind]

I’ve been pondering this for ages now

In any ‘normal’ project you’d have targets, objectives, deadlines, reviews etc but for Brexit beyond 2 deadlines of 31/1/20 and 31/12/20 there’s nothing

People talk about politicians being accountable now but what do we expect them to deliver and by when

People know they wont change brexit but it will help the individuals who have the gumption to see the storm coming to take action.

You are right not everyone can take action but I guess those people will be collateral damage to aid brexit in the same way the poor were sacrificed for austerity.

Bear, can you please stop calling me Arkansas?
If your objection is that I haven't answered this:
But what alternative do you think there is? What else can any of us do?
I honestly thought that was a rhetorical question. As you meant it literally, my answer is: we can hold the government and specifically the Leave campaigners (and the PM was one of these) to account. We can call them out on their lies and falsehoods. When they argue - as they will - that business failures and job losses are nothing to do with Brexit, we can remind them that they said there would be no short-term economic disruption, that they said there would be more for the NHS, for universities etc.

Also, when an MEP complains about having no representation in the European parliament, we can point and laugh at their stupidity.

It's not much, but it's something. I've never really been one for passive acceptance, so I doubt I will change now.

ghost I totally understand people taking whatever action they can to protect themselves

What I will never understand is the whinging about the fact it’s necessary, long after the other options have been exhausted

As you meant it literally, my answer is: we can hold the government and specifically the Leave campaigners (and the PM was one of these) to account. We can call them out on their lies and falsehoods

Apologies about the name mis-spelling

You’ve tried all of the above and it achieved precisely nothing

How exactly do you think you can make it work now?

Brexit was never necessary. I don't know why you are so keen for people to stop talking about a massive political issue that will effect peoples day to day lives. As brexit unfolds people will have to talk about in their lives, jobs etc. They might grumble about it, its human nature.

Bear, you have obviously decided to lie down and accept everything. I haven't. I will continue to hold these people to account however I can. I don't necessarily think it will achieve anything, particularly in the short term. It's about having your voice heard. It's about pointing out the lies instead of accepting everything with an apathetic shrug.

Crack on arkadas, it’s your energy you’re wasting, not mine

Brexit was never necessary. I don't know why you are so keen for people to stop talking about a massive political issue that will effect peoples day to day lives.

I’m not asking you to stop talking about it - completely the opposite, hence this thread

I asking you to talk about how we can measure it’’s success or otherwise, and not to continually bleat about the fact it’s happening

But Bear people have given you some suggestions as to what they think will be a sign of success. I don't think anyone much is bleating about it happening - that's now a given. It doesn't mean that we don't think it was a stupid course of action, and I don't see why we should change our opinion on that.

Personally, I won't have much sympathy when Leavers start whining - as the Brexit Party MEP did. It's what they voted for.

Personally, I won't have much sympathy when Leavers start whining

TBH, if it does come to that, neither will I

Crack on arkadas, it’s your energy you’re wasting, not mine
There's no need to be rude, is there?
You obviously have a lot of energy to waste posting on MN. I 'waste' some of my energy on political activities and will write to my MP if I feel strongly enough about something. Each to their own.

I’m not wasting energy posting on MN, I do it when it suits me

You said your MP is Tory - they’ve all agreed to Brexit so what you think they’ll do is beyond me

It will be interesting to see what happens to some of these Red Wall Tory MPs when Johnson's promised largesse does not materialise, even though they have 'got Brexit done.' Whether a loss of jobs would concentrate minds, is doubtful, since there is a flight of young people from those areas to those which have work.

I’m not wasting energy posting on MN
Well, some would argue that you are.
I do it when it suits me
And I write to my MP when it suits me. I don't expect him to 'do' anything - this is the point you seem to be struggling with. I am writing to let him know that I haven't fallen for his party's bullshit and lies and to remind him that his party made various commitments - many of which I've already mentioned above.

I think you're right there, Peregrina. The changing demographics in those areas mean that the aging population probably doesn't care a good deal about job losses etc. They may care about the NHS though. Still, another week or so and the government will be able to get on with funding the NHS properly, as promised.

I 'waste' some of my energy on political activities and will write to my MP if I feel strongly enough about something

Absolutely! MPs need to be re-elected, its a long way from their minds atm but in 2 or 3 years it won't be......., My MP - Scott Mann has promised better housing, a bigger more prosperous fishing industry, same with farming, food production and far better environmental protection post brexit.
He also promised a Cornish university, so cornwalls youth didn't have to cross the Tamar to get a degree.... shame he didn't realise there is a university campus, offering a wide range of degree courses, in Falmouth....... Intelligence! never a brexitiers strong point lol!

Still, another week or so and the government will be able to get on with funding the NHS properly, as promised

UK will continue to pay the EU during the transition period. So the Brexit dividend as it is called won’t be available until payment to the EU stop. What the government actually does with the money remains to be seen.

Boris pledged another 40 new hospitals..........

For every example of stoopid Brexit promise, I'm afraid you have to address equally stoopid ideas like free broadband for all. Or a policy/non-policy so fiendishly complicated even nerds like me struggled to understand it.
Many foolish things said in the last few years.

Whataboutery bellin the tories are in power and should be held accountable. A broadband policy is mere chicken feed compared to all the post brexit promises.

For every example of stoopid Brexit promise, I'm afraid you have to address equally stoopid ideas like free broadband for all.
Why do we have to address free broadband? Brexit is happening. A Labour government isn't.
Many foolish things have been said, but we are leaving a massive trading block, and losing our citizenship of the EU because promises (stupid or otherwise) were made and people voted in good faith on the strength of them. Impact assessments suggest this is going to bad for Britain, so we need to hold those promise-makers to account, rather than give them a free pass.

Did Johnson say during the election that more money for the NHS would only come after payments to the EU stop? I must have missed that.

I didn't miss the bit where he continued to lie about hospital building and new nurses. No reason why he won't just carry on lying about it after Brexit payments stop as well

"Why do we have to address free broadband? Brexit is happening. A Labour government isn't.""
These are the best we could manage to alter/pause Brexit. And they were shit.

Why do we have to address free broadband? Brexit is happening. A Labour government isn't.

We have to address it because at some point you will wake up to the fact that the only chance you had of stopping Brexit was scuppered by the fuckwit who thought people would fall for his ridiculous fantasy promises, including free broadband

In your opinion bellin. You wanted remainers to move on but don't seem to be able to move on from Labour and the GE yourself.