Westminstenders: The Non-Pact Pact

[RedToothBrush]

The Brexit Party and the Conservatives have agreed a trumpian pact to no deal. Led by the ERG.

They don't want you to know its a pact because the Conservatives still want One Nation Conservatives types to believe they are still One Nation Conservatives, simply because they say they are. They are not.

The Brexit Party won't stand any candidates in a Conservative held seat. But don't be surprised if there isn't more Non-Pact tactical stepping aside. This of course won't be a Pact. Cos the Brexit Party say its not. And the Conservative Party say its not.

The Liberal Democrats, Plaid and the Greens are in an electoral pact. They say they are in an electoral pact and have published a list.

Meanwhile the Labour Party isn't in a Pact. But there is still talk that in key seats that someone (either the LDs or Labour) should stand aside to try and deseat key Conservatives. This won't happen because the Lib Dems and Labour are not in a pact. And when they say they are not in a pact they aren't.

If after an election we have a hung parliament then either the Conservatives or Labour who are not in a pact and say they will never be in a pact, will try and woo someone to a kingmaker and be in government with them, probably on a supply and demand basis rather than coalition. They'll deny this but we kind of know how this goes...

When you find Tories who keep propogandising for the Tories on all threads they go on, then cheering for a politican of another party, THINK WHY

Fortunately you don’t need to do much thinking, because I can tell you openly and it’s pretty damn obvious in any case: Jo Swinson is anti-Tory, so I’m not going to vote for her, but she’s also anti-socialist and refuses to put Comrade Corbyn in power. She is thus a political opponent, but one worthy of respect.

Whereas most of you on here seem to think she should just shut up, put on the red rosette, and do whatever the fuck Corbyn tells her. Well, so far she’s bravely resisting your ire - I presume if she wanted to campaign for the SWP, she’d have joined it years ago!

Those clips of Johnson in Yorkshire are something else.

Why did he leave it so long? Really poor of his campaign team.

Jo Swinson is anti-Tory

So anti Tory that she voted more for their policies than Gove or Hunt

Cendrillon You are cheering on Swinson for the same reason some Remainers are cheering on BXP:
to split the vote of the other side

Only a hung Parliament or Labour govt can stop a hard Brexit

I condemn Swinson because the LDems can't stop Brexit

• she is an arrogant conceited blowhard who puts getting 22 LDem seats instead of 20, above stopping a hard Brexit

I condemn Swinson because the LDems keep claiming to be the party of Remain, so they shouldn't be enabling a Tory Brexit

I campaigned fiercely for anyone but Labour back in 1983, because Foot wanted to Brexit then - ^Fortress Britain Labour style.

I'd have campaigned for anyone but Labour this GE, if they'd been the fuckups who were pushing Brexshit^

This time, Brexit is a Tory project from start to finish, so it's mostly anyone but Tory for me.
but again, I'd support a Tory Remainer over a Labour Leaver in the very few seats where this happens

Poster you know perfectly well that members of government vote with the government.

Honestly I genuinely think that some people on here would prefer a Tory government to a single person voting LD.

Thanks lonely - I should say it's a combination of advice from the tactical voting website (clearly shows Lab far ahead of LD last election, I hadn't really realised the discrepancy - my LD vote would be wasted), the gender thing and the standing down thing.
I'm pretty certain that I'd agree/disagree with what will be in the two manifestos in equal proportion, so it's really a pragmatic decision. In my previous constituency the LDs generally did well, but in this corner of the rural West Midlands it seems to be Lab the second party. Lots of Brexiters, some of whom I had a row with in the street a few weeks ago (it was fun).

Agree with BCF (except on the personal insults which are gratuitous. I'd trust Ken Clarke on Swinson ahead of someone who doesn't know her. She has a fine line to tread and missteps are pretty much inevitable.)

I'm curious about how David Gauke will do in South Herts. I disagree with his politics, like the way he does politics, he's sensible and has a sense of humour too. Will he split the Tory vote more than the remain vote? There have to be a lot of Tory remainers there.

Arron Banks tells Nigel Farage he has just 48 hours to save Brexit

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/11/12/general-election-2019-brexit-boris-johnson-corbyn-farage-latest/

"Nigel has remade the Conservative party in his own image - the Conservative party is the Brexit party,"
Mr Banks said

"The only way Brexit is going to get delivered is by a Boris majority."

He has asked Mr Johnson to stand down in Labour Leave seats that have not elected a Tory MP in a hundred years,
to give the Brexit Party a better chance of winning.

Mr Banks, who still runs Leave.EU with fellow "bad boy of Brexit" Andy Wigmore, said the group had become the "good boys of Brexit" and now hoped for a Tory majority

He said the leadership of the Brexit Party is divided between the "pragmatic" Mr Farage and "hardline" Richard Tice, the party's chairman.
< interesting insight, if Tice is the hardman >

"Nigel reminds me of a gambler at a casino that’s been winning all night and it’s time to take the chips off the table and step away,"

Voters and party hacks alike mostly want it to be politics as usual,
BUT in practical terms this is the GE that decides Brexit - and hence the UK's future for the next several decades

Any govt you don't like can be voted out and their policies reversed

imo, Brexit means Brexit for at least the next 30 years

The 27 remaining members of the EU will not vote unanimously to invite in such disaster again, so once out, it'll be "stay out"
Anyone old enough to rememer the 1960s and the years of the French veto against the UK joining ?
That was before this UK clusterfuck

The 27 remaining members of the EU will not vote unanimously to invite in such disaster again, so once out, it'll be "stay out"

You're pretty astute BCF so you're probably right.

I have tried to be more cup half full with my older DC ( who are very despondent). I said perhaps if we got a run of future moderate governments which apologised for the past and made positive progressive generous gestures. Perhaps following a prolonged effort with humble skilled diplomacy then we could maybe be readmitted within my DCs lifetimes. Yes we would have to pay far more and our unique rebates etc wouldn't even feature. Yes we may agree to be part of Schengen but if we went cap in hand the exit may be reversible eventually? Ever the optimist.

According to Wikipedia, de Gaulle's objection was "a number of aspects of Britain's economy, from working practices to agriculture" had "made Britain incompatible with Europe" and that Britain harboured a "deep-seated hostility" to any pan-European project.

tephen Smith
@SteveNickSmith
·
1h
If some racist crank confronted Boris Johnson shouting antisemitic slurs would BBC journalists like Nick Eardley or Laura Kuenssberg (who retweeted Eardley) neutrally platform them as “protesters”? The lack of safeguarding for Muslims in the UK is shocking

Turns out he was right about the deep seated hostility.

Tom Rayner
@RaynerSkyNews
Here’s more on the man who heckled Corbyn: scotstounparishchurch.co.uk/Who_we_are/richard.html. Labour sources pointing to what they say is homophobic and islamophobic content on his twitter account

FFS people will you just STOP with the anti Swinson anti Corbyn shit.

Misti is right we fucking deserve all we are getting if we can't stop with this crap.

We need to pull together, encourage our parties to pull together and stop with all this shit. It's too fucking important not to.

I've really had it with some of you.

Kind of like the way so many of the people heckling Boris mysteriously turn out to be Labour activists?

Kind of like the way so many of the people heckling Boris mysteriously turn out to be Labour activists?

Blimey - I didn't know Labour had smuggled so many activists into the flooded areas of Yorkshire.

mysteriously turn out to be Labour activists?

Definitely not fathers concerned about their child in an under funded health system he was there only because he had planned to be at a photo op that wasnt a photo op

Definitely not people who have just lost everything due to an under funding of northern flood defences theyve probably all been bused in from Islington with their strong fake accent game

I'm unfollowing a lot of people on twitter because of silly partisan politicking and pretty fed up with it on here too.

Me too, although I don't follow many on twitter. Vote for the best candidate in your constituency.

Those of you who are Labour enthusiasts - it is absolutely a wasted vote in my constituency. At the last election, with a good candidate, the best Labour have fielded for many a long year, plus a strong showing from the student vote, they only got about 1,000 more votes than previously.

Define activist.

Vote for the best candidate in your constituency.

It turns out no amount of tactical voting is going to damage my MP.
But I looked at the Labour candidate to see what they said on Brexit, they have nothing to say on the issue.
The local Lib candidate isn't awe inspiring either but overall voting for them sends the strongest anti Brexit message.

I agree that a lot of personality bashing isn't helpful.

( Also in areas like Stainforth there are still families that don't get on that well after the miners strike!)

I would add that if you are in an area where your vote won't matter, then vote for your preferred candidate. The BBC used the excuse that UKIP had gained 10% of the votes to inflict wall to wall Farage on us.

I think Jo Swinson is on rocky territory when it comes to her seat in East Dunbartonshire. However, I'm not here for the LOLs when the inevitable collapse happens.

All I want for Christmas is EU! Also peace and prosperity.

Still voting Labour.

Second. OUBBK.

This election is too important to fuck up.

I know people are fighting because we're scared and angry but ...

Here, right here, is where we practise being human, thinking wider - so we can go out and lead by example.

But of ❤️ and hope, everyone.

On MN, I'm an activist for hope.

Well, I try ...