To feel so fucking depressed and angry about brexit?

[ssd]

I'm Scottish. I voted to remain. It feels like nothing I vote for matters. I despise Farage and Johnstone. I despise the call for sovereignty certain parts of England still believe in. I despise of the right wing media.

I really feel this country is fucked, unless you have money behind you and beside you.

It’s the all of nothing approach that’s always problematic, isn’t it?

After all, a vote to stay in the EU isn’t necessarily a vote endorsing absolutely everything that the EU does.

It may not be a popular view on here but the core EU policies aren’t exactly aligned with core values of the Labour movement. The problem is that people see a Leave vote as in essence a ‘biting the hand that feeds you’ but actually people don’t want to be fed. They want to grow, cook and eat their own food.

ThatsMeInTheSpotlight

I remember that

Who do we 'boot out' about Brexit? Is it the Tories for calling the referendum in the first place? Is it all the MPs who voted to trigger Art 50 when they didn't even agree on what Brexit meant? Is the MPs who have shown they are incapable of negotiating on a world stage? Is it the MPs (all of them) who have failed to marshal all the talent (from civil servants to academics from business people to other specialists) within the UK to create an exit plan? Is it all the MPs who couldn't even suggest a working party for conducting referendums prior to the Scottish one and the Brexit one so everyone knew what they were voting for and agreed the majority necessary to carry a decision?

The biggest achievement of MPs over the last few years has been to convince the electorate that other voters have caused this complete farce. Responsibility for this entire debacle lies with MPs.

Half the staff worked in the offices, half in the warehouse...hard to feel sorry for the leave voters when the lose their jobs

There is a labour shortage in that sector;

"Labour shortages are impacting various sectors across UK industry and is a hot topic when it comes to warehousing trends this year. Record numbers of people are currently in work, which is great from a general employment perspective, but from a hiring perspective, it is becoming increasingly difficult to fill the skills gap. “The lack of attractiveness of warehousing jobs is demonstrated in a recent report by the UK Commission for Employment and Skills, which found that only 9% of the industry’s existing workforce is under 25 years old,”

"With Brexit on the horizon and the Government’s new policy regarding the UK’s future skills-based immigration system to come into play, the warehousing industry will have to consider offering additional perks, including increased wages, flexible working, and other schemes in order to recruit new talent into the workforce."

I do disagree with that, spotlight

Cameron didn’t call the referendum for lols, he called it because people were flocking to UKIP. That indicated a healthy amount of euroscepticism.

Had he ignored that, the issue wouldn’t have meekly gone away, as people seem to think.

It is scary and depressing. Even when the Leave result was announced, I never thought it would be such an extreme deal with this level of self-harm.

As it stands, I plan to vote, encourage others to vote and have a Plan B in place for leaving England next year if it's a Tory majority.

I am under no illusions about a Labour win or the outcomes of another hung Parliament: I just think we can fix those issues in a way we can't with the Tory firesale.

European Medicines Agencies...Children had no choice in becoming emigrants. Leavers did that to them.

You are being overly dramatic - 840 of the 900 EMA staff members working in the UK were from other EU countries (spread across the remaining 27 member states) - contracts are awarded on a 9 month - 2 years basis or 5 years, and may or may not be extended.The Dutch government offered a very attractive relocation package.

Yep. The hand wringing and the disbelief on here comes from a kind of spoilt anger

What a horrible thing to say. A vile assumption, based on fuck all actual knowledge of how other individuals feel and think.

I guess it makes you feel better to dismiss people’s feelings, rather than feel uncomfortable by believing them.

Do you believe the Leavers felt the EU adversely impacted them?

If that’s aimed at me, then yes, I’m sure lots of them did/do. The problem is that feelings were made prime and overrode facts. I respect everyone’s feelings, though, and wouldn’t seek to sneer at them.

Maybe you haven’t personally Tolles but many have. Thick, racist, didn’t know what they were voting for ...

I'm an EU immigrant, lived in the UK for just over 15 years now. I think this is all affecting my mental health a lot more than I initially thought...

I'm in the process of getting everything ready to apply for British citizenship but of course no passport can really erase my immigrant background; I will always be seen as one of the unwanted others by some...

That would be true regardless viccat - if you believe every vote to leave the EU was a vote against you personally. I’m not denying that there aren’t some racists but not 17,410,742 of them.

And had the results been reversed and we elected to remain, it would still mean 16,141,241 people saw you as ‘unwanted’ which of course they don’t.

Oh calm down tolleshunt

The word "vile" must be the most overused word on Mumsnet. It usually means 'I don't agree with you'.

@viccat I am in the same situation as you but made a completely different decision.

We are going back.

840 of the 900 EMA staff members working in the UK were from other EU countries (spread across the remaining 27 member states)

Yes, like my then dentist's wife. But they had spent most of their working lives here and their children had gone to school here.

Back to the initial OP.

I agree with you.

Leave or Remain....doesn’t matter how anyone voted because surely nobody can be happy with this.

I voted Remain but wasn’t surprised to see a Leave victory, my only surprise was how narrow it was.

I have friends here from the EU, working, paying taxes, having children and building social friendships. Some are going home as they no longer feel welcome and there’s been a definite increase in abuse against those who have come to work here.

That makes me sad.

However I am not silly enough to believe this is all Leave voters...although all racists will have voted Leave in the mistaken belief that immigration is the problem, ...news flash for them....austerity was the issue. And that didn’t come from the EU.

Austerity was only an issue for some. For the Rees-Mogg's of the world, it's about more money for them and making a bonfire of workers, i.e. ordinary people's rights.

Yes, like my then dentist's wife. But they had spent most of their working lives here and their children had gone to school here.

I think you said your dentist retired to follow his wife to Amsterdam - their children must be grown up by now. So essentially, remain posters are saying that freedom of movement to work in another country is only desirable if you settle in one country for 20 years plus if you have children - doesn't sound very flexible to me.

Immigration isn’t a problem but uncontrolled immigration is.

Yes, the dentist's children are grown up now. One worked in medical research and has left the country also.

However you are putting your own twisted construction on this Clavinova. No one is saying that you have to settle here for most of your working life and have children to be accepted here. What we are saying that there are an awful lot of people in this category, who are now having to think very hard about their futures. The EMA move was dismissed because 840 staff out of 900 were EU citizens, forgetting that they could have UK spouses and UK born children.

although all racists will have voted Leave

There is a flaw in your argument here - you are assuming that there are no racists amongst the 3 million EU citizens living in the UK.

austerity was the issue

No, it really wasn't. Anti-EU feeling had been growing for a long time, long before so-called Austerity. It's been simmering in the background for probably 20-30 years. Lots of people were against the morphing of the common market (which we voted for) into the EU (which we didn't and were never given our say in elections nor referendums). Anti-EU feelings grow in Blair's watch, especially with him not imposing limits on freedom of movement/immigration from the ascension countries during his reign - made even worse by him "wanting to rub the Right's noses in diversity!" and then by Brown's "bigoted woman" fiasco.

So-called austerity had little to do with it, and don't forget that even Labour were proposing wide ranging reductions to public spending in their election manifestos too, similar in scope to the Tories, to try to mend the economy.