Brexit Arms

[DustyDiamond]

Welcome to the Brexit Arms!!

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#PrayForSally
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Thanks dusty, bottoms up. I still cant find any glitterballs lol.

Yeah...I thought we were at that point where you haven't got an answer

Just seems weird that you're asking whether posters are in favour of privatising the NHS & making education completely privately funded 🤷🏻‍♀️

Not one poster on these threads has implied any support for either of these notions, nor has anyone even discussed them as being a viable option.

Not one political party is proposing either as far as I'm aware.

So why bring it up?!

It's like me posting:

"So Arse - do you believe that we should dye pigs green & drown them in a vat of washing up liquid?"

Completely nonsensical & without foundation or context 🤷🏻‍♀️

I see you haven't bothered to answer my very serious question Arse

Off to bed

(Have I done that right? I asked a random question, demanded an answer, then stropped off with a sarcastic aside because posters didn't kowtow to me... I think I followed the script right...?)

the Sutton Trust has found that state school pupils outperform independent school pupils with the same A level grades at university level for instance.

Continuityerror that's interesting and corresponds with evidence of the same re grammars and hot house schools in leafy suburbs with "exceptional" results.

However I'm not sure it demonstrates that Independent and other "good" schools are not better. Rather they help DC to achieve above their inherent level. It is then a moot point whether those that benefit from extra qualifications outweigh those who end up having to drop out because they are not as suited to a course of study as their qualifications would indicate.

Good schools also prepare DC for things like STEP and LNAT and so Unis who use them as additional filters compound the issue.

I had a look at The Other Place yesterday, Bearbehind, and admired you for trying to get your views across so clearly but there are some posters permanently stuck on "transmit" and not "receive".

Thanks singing - I think you’re complete right about the transmit / receive point

It appears that if you comment on Corbyn’s incompetence more than once (and Gods knows there’s more than one thing to mention) you are a ‘lonely, special needs terrier with a rat’ 🤔

Anyway, what do we think is going to be in Labours manifesto to trump the entirely ridiculous broadband plan?

A really interesting article neatly illustrating why the social elite do not know best and what drives their "luxury beliefs".

quillette.com/2019/11/16/thorstein-veblens-theory-of-the-leisure-class-a-status-update/

Hey Bear, whats the mood about free internet? Do Labour lovers think it is a vote winner? Is their much discussion about the consequences of that policy?

It was this discussion that appeared to be my demise!

I was arguing the same as many on here, which is that it’s not a priority and I can certainly afford to pay my own broadband so shouldn’t get it free from the government

The general mood swayed between ‘its a great idea that will pay for itself’ to ‘silly old Corbyn, it’s just another of his jolly japes’. No one seemed to understand the point that, although it would benefit those who can’t afford it, that doesn’t mean it needs to be free for everyone.

Mentioning free WiFi on public transport and in cafes etc pretty much ended me.

I know this thread is predominately Tory supporting anyway - you must all rub your hands with glee when he comes out with shite like free broadband

Anyone with the ability of critical thinking can see it’s utterly ridiculous and impractical and most importantly, not a priority.

Labour policy is to negotiate a deal and put it to a 2nd ref in which they will campaign to remain

What I don’t understand is why this is taken as gospel by Labour supporters whilst other pledges such as abolishing private schools or free broadband, which can be demonstrably proven to be impossible, are taken with a pinch of salt in many cases

Even if you think all 3 will happen, surely the flaws with the second 2, which are so easy to point out, make you question the practicability of the first.

Anyway, what do we think is going to be in Labours manifesto to trump the entirely ridiculous broadband plan?

Quoting post here but it appears to to free band 1 dental treatment for all!

My own post ^^

What madness is this?

It’s already free to those who need it to be so?

Where the fuck do they think the money comes from to give people like me things for free that I can afford

I know this thread is predominately Tory supporting anyway - you must all rub your hands with glee when he comes out with shite like free broadband

To be fair, I don't think the Labour Party has a monopoly on shite policies, Bear. I gave my Tory MP a hard time in 2017 on fox hunting and adult social care, a-k-a the dementia tax. What's the point of offering up such hostages to fortune, I asked her, when there are bigger issues staring us in the face (which I think was exactly the point you were trying to make in The Other Place ).

I hear that the Conservative manifesto will be short and sweet (Isaac Levido channelling his mentor, Lyndon Crosby). It will be interesting to see what all the manifestos will say, though, and hopefully they will be published this week. Labour is apparently squabbling about freedom of movement versus Len's preference of controlled immigration, so we'll see.

In the meantime, enjoy regular deployment of the dead cat strategy on here. Isaac Levido is not the only one channelling his inner Crosby.

You’re quite right about shite policies not being exclusive to Labour - the big difference I see though is that the stories aren’t the ones playing catch up.

They need to incentive people to vote for them and giving away free stuff to those who don’t need it might sound nice but it will bankrupt the country.

They need to incentive people to vote for them and giving away free stuff to those who don’t need it might sound nice but it will bankrupt the country.

You are quite right again, Bear, but Jezza promising to "deal with the burden of student debt" (cleverly worded) translated to many as "cancel my debts" and had an effect on votes.

I quoted John McDonnell earlier, when he said, "It's easy to manipulate most students. Just pander to their natural youthful anarchic tendencies and promise them free stuff". This is a man who was prepared to bankrupt the GLC to serve his political aims so I fully believe he would do the same to the country in a heartbeat. He terrifies me.

Agree that Labour don't have the monopoly on shite policies but comrade Corbz & co are certainly upping the stakes in this area 😱

I'm not really following much at all now - I'm hoping the Tory manifesto is pretty short & sweet with enough good stuff but no massive own goals - enough to satisfy wavering Tories who are not solely motivated by Brexit & are horrified at the thought of a communist revolution...

Probs best to stay away from the other place 🐻 tbh 🍷

They need to incentive people to vote for them and giving away free stuff to those who don’t need it might sound nice
Like giving tax breaks to the already wealthy?

@howabout

However I'm not sure it demonstrates that Independent and other "good" schools are not better. Rather they help DC to achieve above their inherent level.

Possibly - from what I have seen of friends with DC at private schools there is a massive work ethic, which I know has got one child an Oxbridge place rather than any intellectual horsepower.

And I agree that private schools can be better set up to help students prep for uni interviews and entrance exams, although my DC went to an academy that did particularly well at getting students into both law and med schools (good senior phase leadership team), but that’s an area that needs more awareness and prioritising in the state sector.

It’s also interesting that Aberdeen Uni research found that state educated medical students were more likely to graduate top of their class than privately educated ones, despite having lower BCAT / UCAT scores on entry. Researchers ascribed it to the state educated students being more motivated and resilient.

Today's Matt...

When you all trot down to the polling station to give the Tories your vote, I hope you will bear in mind that thanks to Universal credit there are children eating from bins at school.

I'm sure many of you would like to brush this off as hyperbole from one head teacher, but this is reality in Tory Britain. Maybe some of you who are mocking Jezza's nutty free broadband proposal, will save some of your indignation and take pause to wonder why a group of cross-party MPs is calling for the government to appoint a Minister for Hunger. We are one of the wealthiest countries in the world. A vote for Conservatives, is a vote for the party that introduced Universal Credit and turns a blind eye to children going to school hungry.

Medicine is interesting. I have 2 DDs with the ideal subject mix and grades for medicine. They both had to actively avoid being channelled into medicine. I suspect this is even more the case in Independent schools whose top 20% become medics - in the standard Scottish comp my DC attend it is lower than 1%. Doing something as hard work as medicine just because it is expected must cause motivation issues. I know people from private schools who dropped out of medicine but then came top of their class when they transferred to something they had actively chosen.

Lots of the medical schools now strongly recommend intercalating with a standard degree subject and some front load the course towards more generally applicable science and I wonder if this is why.

I know this thread is predominately Tory supporting anyway - you must all rub your hands with glee when he comes out with shite like free broadband
Morning all.
No gleeful hand rubbing here either, it's very early days and too serious for that. It just reminds me of ds2's school age 11 when they had to campaign for positions of power and they all rolled up with power points and posters promising free sweets, fireworks displays, sausage and chips every friday, etc.etc.

When you all trot down to the polling station to give the Tories your vote, I hope you will bear in mind that thanks to Universal credit there are children eating from bins at school.

The problem with this narrative is that the Labour Party supported the introduction of Universal Credit and the 2 child limit. While Labour have said they will scrap UC I have not heard a coherent policy on what will replace it or how they will compensate for the benefits freeze? The tax credits system was riddled with inconsistencies and no longer melds with the changes to the tax system and the minimum wage. The Labour Party started the process of dismantling "as of right NI earned benefits".

This is my number 1 priority after Brexit but it appears very much as an afterthought in Labour policy thinking - I therefore do not trust glib promises to "fix it" which will likely create a whole new class of unintended collateral damage.

I am not predominantly Tory supporting but when the Opposition parties subordinate all other political policy at the EU altar there is little alternative.

Continuity, Interesting study about medical students. I have some experience of both private and state education with our children.
What I would say is that the private system definitely gives an advantage to students gaining higher grades, increasing confidence and ensuring the student is articulate and well mannered when seen in an interview context etc.
How ever a child from the state system who achieves the same results in my mind have a much higher level of ability and intelligence as they received far less coaching, 1 to 1 tuition and time in class than the privately educated child.
Thus the privately educated child without the crutch of their school can sometimes be less able to cope in the 'outside world' of university. I would also say that many children in private education can gain grades well beyond their own unhindered 'natural ability'.

However JC didn't take advantage of his private prep school and his 400 year old selective boys(only co-ed in 6th year) in grammar school and only managed two grade Es at A level!

When you all trot down to the polling station to give the Tories your vote, I hope you will bear in mind that thanks to Universal credit there are children eating from bins at school.

A vote for Conservatives, is a vote for the party that introduced Universal Credit and turns a blind eye to children going to school hungry.

The children who are rummaging in bins are not doing so solely because their parents are on benefits - there are other confounding factors in play.

I'm just coming off 4 years of the most basic benefits entitlement for a single parent of 2.
They get free school meals & my eldest gets a bursary for 6th form now - that's how low my income has been.
I've never had to choose between heating & eating.

It's enough to live and to have the odd Costa or rare night out but not a long term lifestyle choice.
I'm grateful for the safety net that benefits provided but they're not intended for long term.

I do however think sickness & disability benefits should be more substantial, and the system for that is far too harsh & badly managed, but simple out of work benefits? They're about right in my experience.

When you all trot down to the polling station to give the Tories your vote, I hope you will bear in mind that thanks to Universal credit there are children eating from bins at school.

A vote for Conservatives, is a vote for the party that introduced Universal Credit and turns a blind eye to children going to school hungry.

This is what I just don’t get

I understand why people hate the Tories but what I don’t understand is this concept that voting for anyone else is better

Labour appear to want to give people who can well afford it, stuff for free (state education for all, broadband, dental care or whatever)

That just isn’t economically viable

So how are the UC issues magically going to resolved by a party who are throwing money at people who don’t need it