Brexit Arms - Pop Up

[time4chocolate]

Well I’m going to have a crack at this Landlady business and I’ve opened a pop up pub.

Rules are:
Anything brexit related is up for discussion and even not Brexit related if you feel the need (so if you want to discuss Haemoroids that’s ok too ).

I’m ok with a bit of arseyness (it’s an emotive subject) but if you go full monty in here I reserve the right to withhold all alcoholic beverages.

I have reserved a quiet table for MNHQ if they want to pop in for a quiet drink (Happy Hour is 6-7pm).

Haven’t properly caught up yet with today’s Brexit news yet but looks like we are finally facing end game, that said still plenty of days left for high jinks and holidays.

Anyone have any views on how they think the next few days will play out are welcome to voice here.

First drinks are on the house 🍻 Cheers

Wow. Just wow.

I am so incredibly sad that it’s all come to this because of a democratic vote and a difference of opinion on a political customs union

If only it were that... its irreversible, thats what makes it such a disaster... for remainers..

Without a CU and SM regulatory alignment, there has to be a hard border in NI, same as the border at Dover or any other border in the world BUT because of the history, a border is going to mean a return to violence.
Even a WA means only a delay for 2 years before the issue has to be re-addressed and there is no tech solution to this as none deal with criminality.

Surely no one can serious expect the EU to agree to no border as the UK moves away from EU standards?
With no border, food and goods that do not meet their std's can flow freely into europe.

The GFA requires an open border. There is no way round this. A Customs Union or Schengen Membership with Customs controls (as with Switzerland) would provide this.

This has actually happened to me, from peoole who were supposedly friends

😮

That's shit 😟

I've got friends who voted Remain (my best friend of decades being one) but they've never been confrontational to me about my wanting to leave.

Pretty sad that Leavers on here make no attempt to bring people like me onside. I had moved from Remain to an Orderly Brexit. But apparently that's not pure enough.

Every single thread you say similar, and every single thread I and others have said compromise is the way forward (ie tweaked WA, EEA/EFTA/CU (time limited) etc)

You either do not bother to read posts or you are choosing to ignore them.

Yes I read the posts and instead of then taking the idea and running with it, you and others spend your time trotting out the usual entrenched Leaver nonsense about how everyone is betraying you and Parliament is undemocratic blah blah blah. And obviously people like me are just Remoaners.
If I saw even a glimmer of desire to compromise on here, I would be delighted. But no, it's the same old same old.

@bellinisurge you've spent 10 months that I have personally witnessed calmly advising people to get a buffer of food according to their budget. You are the person who got me to do it and to do it for my mum/get her to do it. You have been a voice of calm reason and latterly one of compromise. No one could ever accuse you of being an I'm alright jack but I've noticed however that you have lost your patience and understandably so. I've only been on the brexit threads since about January I think but you've been so helpful and reassuring despite this shitstorm

“I've got friends who voted Remain (my best friend of decades being one) but they've never been confrontational to me about my wanting to leave.”

That’s good!

Don’t get me wrong, I do have some lovely remainer friends who have been fine and have never mentioned it to me, but it was just such a shock to get such venom from some of the others.

I refuse to discuss it openly and in public now. I am a ‘hidden leave voter’ to all intents and purposes, apart from at the ballot box. I very strongly suspect there are millions more like me out there, hence why I don’t hold much confidence in polls anymore and frankly neither should anyone else.

Best wishes @BercowsFlyingFlamingo . You are right. I've lost my patience with never ending self congratulating nonsense from Leavers. I only care about protecting GFA. We can leave and still protect GFA as long as we avoid No Deal.
Rather than work on that, all you read from Leavers on here is how everyone is out to destroy their Brexit dreams .
Fuck 'em.

And @Notthebloodymustardcushion , I actually understand that. I live in a Leave area and, given the Tommy Robinson stickers and graffiti up around our way, I'm too afraid to tell people I voted Leave.
Lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas.

Ha ha, voted Remain!

Freudian slip there Bellini?

@Notthebloodymustardcushion , which soda are on the Leave side? Disaster capitalists like Rees-Mogg and Tommy Robinson. I would be ashamed to be associated with that lot.

I live in a leave area. I have never seen a tommy robinson sticker or graffiti and would be disgusted if I did. Although I did once call out some twat who spouted some sympathetic views about Tommy on a local forum, as did many others (for reference the conversation was not linked to brexit) So I am very sorry that you have had to endure that awfulness, it’s not right and if that’s what you see regularly then naturally and rightly you would be angry.

Thank you @Notthebloodymustardcushion .
I take my dd past it on the way to school everyday. Presumably it's done by relatives of kids at her school. It gets renewed regularly.
I try not to talk about Brexit with her other than to tell her to say nothing about it at school. She tells me most of the children she speaks to are utterly fed up and bored of the whole shit show and hate Boris Johnson. Obviously that doesn't mean they are all for Remain but if we agreed a customs union solution for NI we would be out by the end of the month and we could focus on something else.

I don’t take ‘sides’ Bellini, thats the point. I just don’t like the EU as an expanding political behemoth. it’s really that simple.

On balance, from my perspective, I never expected unicorns and rainbows. I believe the EU is a sick and wounded project dogged with serious financial scandal and issues, and for me leaving is about ripping off the plaster instead of delaying the inevitable ‘death by a thousand cuts’ and throwing more good money after bad. I’m not asking you to agree or trying to ‘sell brexit’ to you. Just trying to give you an insight to where I am in this dialogue.

If a good deal comes forward, that doesn’t cynically keep us tied in, and protects everybody’s interests then I’m all in. Sadly, I think that ship may have sailed, but it aint over until its over!

Mustard The Tommy Robinson stuff is bull. Just another long stereotype of what a leaver is. 👍👏 on the secret Brexit voters, I know tonnes and funnily enough most of them are BAME 😉
"the Leave electorate was far more diverse than many people would have you believe. You do not hear it very often but Leave was endorsed by one in three of Britain’s black and minority ethnic voters, large numbers of affluent conservatives, nearly half of 25-49-year olds, one in two women, four in ten people in London, and one in four graduates. We’ve heard much from Boston but nothing from Birmingham. We’ve heard much from retirement homes and working men’s clubs but nothing from university campuses or the cricket grounds."

Your poor DD, how shit for her.

Of course I know plenty of people locally who voted Leave and who are decent people who just disagree with how I voted. But they must see these horrible things up around here every day and they have just moved over to supporting No Deal. What conclusions am I supposed to draw about what they really think?

Well Belle, it’s interesting that you raise the statistics on young people actually.

My DD and her friends ( young voting age uni students) have been discussing this and having previously been inclined to remain are now fed up and pretty dismayed at the hostile language from the EU and in the media. They apparently would now be inclined to vote leave. It’s an anecdote, but it does seem to be at odds with what we often hear about young people in this discussion and if I am honest, it took me by surprise.

I cant speak for the BAME community, as I am white, but those are also interesting but not surprising stats to me.

The way to leave the EU was via EEA/EFTA with a CU for NI.

It was always the only option, May refused that option because of the ERG/DUP.

But now, this option has gone forever, unless Labour get in and negotiate similar with the EU.

...i'll add this, leavers who are relying on a FTA with the Americans and trust BJ to protect environmental and food standards are pissing in the wind.
As can be seen with that young lad killed by a diplomat's wife and the betrayal of the Kurds in Syria, the US it is all about America First.

Europe needs that EU army asap.

The BAME stuff I know from personal experience because I am black and family members voted leave. I also work with a lot of Asian people who voted leave too. Re: your daughter and her friends that tallies with what I have heard anecdotally within that gaming circles I frequent. I have a big feeling that the polls have got it wrong again.

“Europe needs that EU army asap.”

God no. Just more wars and posturing. What we need, is continued international cooperation amongst sovereign nations.

As for Trump. Well, Yes. What a colossal dick. He is not to be trusted at all and my only hope, is that he may have jumped the shark politically with that heinous abandonment of the kurds. Even fox news have gone for the throat with him over this, the best we can hope is that he doesn’t make a second term. But that doesn’t negate my strength of feeling around the EU. If it carries on as is, and we remain in it will ultimately have it’s own Trump moment, and we will be stuck hopelessly at its mercy. (Imho obviously)