Ireland and your vote.

[RuggerHug]

I am genuinely interested in all opinions here and I really hope that comes across. I don't want to start arguments or stir up hatred or insults. I've been on these boards for awhile and I know I've probably been quite ranty at times. I really want to not be here, so I'd like to ask everyone who voted, leave or remain, the following and I'd really appreciate your answers/thoughts.

Did ROI and NI play a part in your decision to vote whatever way?

Did the effect of a vote either way to NI and ROI occur at all, if so how?

Since the result, did anyone have a change of heart/become more sure of their vote based on what came out regarding ROI and NI afterwards?

Have you any thoughts on how we've been during it all/how our media portrays activities in the UK(if you're aware of what is said/shown here).

Hopefully this won't come across as trying to start a fight but, in all of this, did you care about us and the fallout or did you consider it not the UKs/anyone elses problem?

For disclosure, I'm Irish, in ROI, spent a lot of time at the border/in NI before the GFA, not as much after. Anyone I know in the UK that had a vote voted remain, I know 1 Leave voter(who lives in ROI).

Thanks in advance for sharing your thoughts.

It should have been brought up

A failure by the BIC (British Irish Council).

Ireland and the EU were naive to believe that the UK would continue to maintain its responsibility to the peace treaty it signed

UK have stated they don’t want a border between Ireland and NI. A UK no deal WTO departure from EU does not require a hard border. WTO have said that to both Ireland and UK.

EU law is Ireland’s dilemma. To comply with EU law there has to be a border between EU and non EU countries. Alternatively Ireland ignores EU law and takes the consequences.

UK has a hard border with all EU countries. Why should we be bothered Ireland will have the same.

Means nothing. That's how our sovereign system works. The one other people (not you because you don't live here) voted to protect

Was GFA in labour manifesto for the 1997 campaign? Can’t remember?

Yes it was Mystery. It was also in the conservative party manifesto as John Major had done a lot of the initial work on it.

"Northern Ireland

Labour's approach to the peace process has been bipartisan. We have supported the recent agreements between the two governments - the Anglo-Irish Agreement, the Downing Street Declaration and the Framework Document. The government has tabled proposals which include a new devolved legislative body, as well as cross-border co-operation and continued dialogue between the two governments.

There will be as great a priority attached to seeing that process through with Labour as under the Conservatives, in co-operation with the Irish government and the Northern Ireland parties. We will expect the same bipartisan approach from a Conservative opposition.

We will take effective measures to combat the terrorist threat.

There is now general acceptance that the future of Northern Ireland must be determined by the consent of the people as set out in the Downing Street Declaration. Labour recognises that the option of a united Ireland does not command the consent of the Unionist tradition, nor does the existing status of Northern Ireland command the consent of the Nationalist tradition. We are therefore committed to reconciliation between the two traditions and to a new political settlement which can command the support of both. Labour will help build trust and confidence among both Nationalist and Unionist traditions in Northern Ireland by acting to guarantee human rights, strengthen confidence in policing, combat discrimination at work and reduce tensions over parades. Labour will also foster economic progress and competitiveness in Northern Ireland, so as to reduce unemployment."

So, something that brought peace was supported by British government, but not put to a public vote

And there lies a problem. 17.4 Million people think their vote might be ignored in favour of something they had no say?

Had GFA been put to a public vote on UK mainland I would guess the turnout would not have been that high, but nobody could apply the argument they weren’t given the chance to vote.

Of those that might have voted (those affected by the troubles) can’t think why they wouldn’t have supported the GFA.

UK has a hard border with all EU countries.
No it doesnt. It has a barely there border with Republic of Ireland.

Why should we be bothered Ireland will have the same.
No idea what you mean by this.

@kingsassassin

Thanks for the information. Was not aware that both major parties were behind what eventually became the GFA.

However, it is funny that GFA and Article 50 (which says nothing about the GFA) were both signed when UK had a labour government.

What's funny about it?

What's funny about it?

Same party that sanctioned war in Iraq.

Remainer.

No, didnt consider it.

I did consider UK expats though as I realised they could get a poor deal and didnt have a say.

Was not aware that both major parties were behind what eventually became the GFA
Well maybe you should have done some research before spouting nonsense.
There are many subjects I don't understand on MN but I don't comment to make a false points.

So, something that brought peace was supported by British government, but not put to a public vote

Because we have a Parliamentary Democracy. It does seem hard for Leavers to get their heads round this.

Not sure if its been mentioned on here. The USA are guarantors to the GFA. Goodbluck getting a trade deal with them if we mess leave up and upset Irish peace.

17.4m placing an X on a piece of paper wanting something unclear, based on lies means more than 3532 dead,47,500+ injured,and an international peace treaty years in the making. Right so Mystery.

Out of curiosity, when you said before you didn't know enough about this and looked things up after the vote, did it occur to you that maybe we know more than you do? Have you ever read what is said on these threads and thought about the words and what they mean, not just glance and twist to suit your version?

Have you ever read what is said on these threads and thought about the words and what they mean, not just glance and twist to suit your version?

Not in the job description.

But I take heart from the fact that only one person on here is prepared to stand up and say that Irish/Northern Irish lives don't matter (and that person lives half a world away the U.K. and plainly does not have its interests at heart).

There are many subjects I don't understand on MN but I don't comment to make a false points

Comment about labour 1997 manifesto was not a false point, but a question.

Good luck getting a trade deal with them if we mess leave up and upset Irish peace

Johnson might want a FTA with US, but I am not convinced UK population wants such a deal. Too many horror stories about food standards and possible sale of NHS.

Because we have a Parliamentary Democracy. It does seem hard for Leavers to get their heads round this

498 MPs voted to invoke Article 50 which has no caveats about deals.

EU are only interested in saving their third largest donor. GFA is nothing to EU other than a way of avoiding losing their third largest donor.

That is such utter bullshit. The GFA is held up as a model treaty all over the world and the EU is proud of the enabling part it plays - and it continues to heavily fund initatives in NI. In fact Michel Barnier was responsible for peace programmes in NI and signed on on millions of euro of support. www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/michel-barnier-an-energetic-supporter-of-ireland-in-brexit-woes-1.3478214

You can repeat your rubbish about Article 50 not mentioning GFA all you want and the effort to find some technical way of blaming the EU for the current issues but the GFA and ensuring peace would never have been possible without the single market and membership of the EU underpins the entire treaty. The GFA is not a trade deal, it is a peace treaty (or as our friend Bonnie pointed out, a truce).

Obviously the EU have another aim in saving the single market but this Brexiteer view that just because they don't care about NI, no-one else does, is totally wrong.

Comment about labour 1997 manifesto was not a false point, but a question.

And yet surely you must know that the GFA agreement wasn't in existence until 1998, so how could it possibly have been mentioned in the 1997 labour party manifesto?

But I take heart from the fact that only one person on here is prepared to stand up and say that Irish/Northern Irish lives don't matter (and that person lives half a world away the U.K. and plainly does not have its interests at heart)

I believe those who were affected by what happened before GFA passed have genuine concerns over potential affect that Brexit may have on GFA.

The rest of remain supporters I don’t believe. Just a way of trying to cancel the result of a referendum they don’t like.

EU are the biggest liars of all. They are stringing Ireland along big time. EU cares about customs revenue only. Any suggestions made by UK to solve the border issues will be rejected by EU as they don’t want Brexit to happen.

Mystery do you honestly believe that people living in Britain should have had a vote in the GFA, most don't know feck all about Ireland or care. The people of NI voted, the people in the republic voted as they had to change their constitution.

And yet surely you must know that the GFA agreement wasn't in existence until 1998, so how could it possibly have been mentioned in the 1997 labour party manifesto?

I am aware that GFA was signed off in 1998. Check other posts if you wish. Hence my question as to whether GFA was in labour manifesto. Other poster has said it was in both conservative and labour manifesto

The futile attempt to discredit the GFA is really foul to read. Thank god most leave voters don’t seem to go this far.